Discussing religion with kids

Psychedelic Casual said:
Religions hold our species back.

Look at wherever there’s a strong orthodoxy of Islam in the world… women are treated like shit, the scientific and technological advances in some countries are slow. Wherever in that region any countries are more secular, they have larger economies, more technologically advanced cities and entice people to live there from the wider world.
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I would agree with so much of this.

Your first sentence made me think of several examples from this year alone (apart from what has been going on in Iran): the repeal of Roe v Wade in the USA (which was undoubtedly fuelled by religious sentiment), the current stance of the CofE on homosexuality (which Sandi Toksvig recently drew attention to), and opposition to the Assisted Dying Bill by Archbishop Justin Welby (apparently there is a religious cabal in the House of Lords that are also resistant to this change).

You may want to have a look at this article by Martyn Percy, an academic theologian and minister who has just left the Church:

https://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/...-justify-having-bishops-in-the-house-of-lords

Here is a paragraph from it:

'Values may well be the new religion of the 21st century. They are formed out of a simple equation: ideologies + passions = values. By values I mean integrity, transparency, equality, justice, accountability, kindness and honesty. Institutions and organisations that fail to exemplify these are unlikely to be trusted by most under-35s. In my view the Church of England consistently fails all tests on this. Its failure to address sexism and homophobia, its systemic opacity, the lack of clear and accountable governance—well, you do the maths. Few will join. The emerging generation will get behind movements that address the political, ethical and global challenges that society faces. This excludes most churches.'

With Islam though, when it comes to scientific and technological advances, it hasn't always been like that (e.g. see Ehsan Masood's Science and Islam : A History), and its a shame that the faith has been pretty much hijacked by militant Salafis, autocratic Shia, and other conservative/Islamist factions like the Deobandis and the Muslim Brotherhood in recent times .

This is why I think Richard Dawkins is wrong to liken Islam to 'a carnivorous gene complex', as he does in The God Delusion. He maybe needs to chill out by listening to some taqwacore punk music.

And thinking of economics, I would rather prefer it if Truss and Kwarteng would worship at a different altar than that of neoliberalism (there are strong resemblances between Trickle-Down economics and what is known as Prosperity Theology). That's one of the things I want to look at soon: modernity whispers 'God is dead' and 'All hail to freedom', and then elevates capital to God-like status.

Finally, the persistence of religion can, perhaps, also partly be explained by the desire for ego transcendence. This is something that Nick Cave continually goes on about in his new book that I mentioned upthread. He even suggests that the album Ghosteen was created in an egoless state.

So that need would still need to be satisfied somehow. The philosopher Jules Evans goes into this here:

aeon.co

Religion has no monopoly on transcendent experience | Aeon Essays

You don’t need drugs or a church for an ecstatic experience that helps transcend the self and connect to something bigger
aeon.co aeon.co
 
I have steadfastly taught my children that religion is a belief system for the feeble minded that can't come to terms with the fact that everything living dies.

A myth to tell children when the death of a loved one causes distress, the irony being children could quite easily get used to the idea of finite life if we didn't fill their nappers full of the fantastical ideas.
 
Colin Bells Holdall said:
So you are a Godfather who I presume doesn’t believe in God? How ridiculous is that.
Agree with support however you can.
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I've 7 (used to be 8, lost one to cancer 2 months ago) and I don't believe in a god either. You're supposed to guide them not beat the fuck out of them with a Bible.
 
JASR said:
Yeah church weddings are very odd… for a couple who don’t go to church and won’t be going ever again, afterwards.

That you can now get married practically anywhere these days is another ‘hidden’ advancement for this country, compared to the 2 choices offered in my youth - church (bit hard for different religions!) or some rundown council property registry office.
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@JASR if you're calling Sale Registry Office a rundown council property Mrs Mist will have to ask you to step outside.
 
I'm With Stupid said:
But it depends. If you've pretended to be religious to get into a religious school, you can't then kick up a fuss about them teaching religion. My cousin just got her kid baptised. She's never been to church in her life except the odd wedding or funeral. It's definitely to give her a bigger choice of schools.
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I’m a pretty strong atheist at this poiint. The thought of sending any of my kids to a school that will actively brainwash them to follow a certain religion is pretty abhorrent to me.
 
Colin Bells Holdall said:
Sorry for your loss.
Nobody has said beat the fuck out of them with a bible. Not sure where I implied that in my post.
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Just saying you don't need to be religious to be a godparent, it's their parents asking you to be the person to guide and care for their child when they're not around.
 
In infant baptism and denominations of Christianity, a godparent (also known as a sponsor, or gossiprede)[1] is someone who bears witness to a child's christening and later is willing to help in their catechesis, as well as their lifelong spiritual formation.[2] In the past, in some countries, the role carried some legal obligations as well as religious responsibilities.[3] In both religious and civil views, a godparent tends to be an individual chosen by the parents to take an interest in the child's upbringing and personal development, to offer mentorship or claim legal guardianship of the child if anything should happen to the parents.[4][5] A male godparent is a godfather, and a female godparent is a godmother. The child is a godchild (i.e. godsonfor boys and goddaughter for girls).
 
Colin Bells Holdall said:
In infant baptism and denominations of Christianity, a godparent (also known as a sponsor, or gossiprede)[1] is someone who bears witness to a child's christening and later is willing to help in their catechesis, as well as their lifelong spiritual formation.[2] In the past, in some countries, the role carried some legal obligations as well as religious responsibilities.[3] In both religious and civil views, a godparent tends to be an individual chosen by the parents to take an interest in the child's upbringing and personal development, to offer mentorship or claim legal guardianship of the child if anything should happen to the parents.[4][5] A male godparent is a godfather, and a female godparent is a godmother. The child is a godchild (i.e. godsonfor boys and goddaughter for girls).
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Pretty much as I said. Spiritual formation is just a fancy way of saying guidance.
 
Mr Kobayashi said:
No but you get the point. Humans live around a daily time period equivalent to 24 hour days anyway.
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Yes, no one is claiming the Babylonions invented daytime and nightime.

They did invent splitting each into 12 segments though, which you now live your life around. That's why you start work at 9am and not sunrise. We change days at midnight and not dawn.

The only reason it's 12 and not 10 is 6000 years ago people used to count using the 12 segments of your fingers.

The point is, just because something is 2500 years old doesn't mean it's irrelevent or wrong.

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