The end of the Conservative Party?

law74 said:
With the rumours of bullying and manhandling of Tory MP's in the House of Commons this evening, if proven (& far too much happening and being reported for nothing to have happened), added to the current polls, and fractional warfare within the tories, is this the end of not just this government, but the entire "conservative" party?
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They'll bring in someone like Rishi Sunak, and he'll stand there shaking his head, and going, "can you believe what that lot did? - my 'new' government will never let that happen. Time to move on."

And lots of ex-Tory voters will agree.
 
I'm With Stupid said:
I don't really know anything about Walker's record, but let's just say that it's easy to be critical when you're leaving. Having said that, he sort of sums up the problem with politics when he talks about his 17 year record as an MP having never been given a job in the cabinet, while people who say the right thing (or probably more accurately know the right people) are repeatedly promoted beyond their talents.
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Some politicians are quite happy to be on the backbenches and serve the country and their constituents by being on committees and campaigning for particular causes. That always entails a degree of party loyalty but sometimes also dissension. I’m pretty sure Rees-Mogg would have preferred to have remained on the backbenches, but because he’s desperate for his ideology to win and can sense it is in peril, he’s found himself thrust into the limelight. He might not make it to 17 years.
 
I'd like to think it is... but they would still probably win the next election regardless. Our country is full of idiots.
 
Gabriel said:
Some politicians are quite happy to be on the backbenches and serve the country and their constituents by being on committees and campaigning for particular causes. That always entails a degree of party loyalty but sometimes also dissension. I’m pretty sure Rees-Mogg would have preferred to have remained on the backbenches, but because he’s desperate for his ideology to win and can sense it is in peril, he’s found himself thrust into the limelight. He might not make it to 17 years.
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I know that, but the way he was talking suggested that he wasn't. Or at least he disapproved of the type of people who are only interested in chasing status.
 
Gabriel said:
Some politicians are quite happy to be on the backbenches and serve the country and their constituents by being on committees and campaigning for particular causes. That always entails a degree of party loyalty but sometimes also dissension. I’m pretty sure Rees-Mogg would have preferred to have remained on the backbenches, but because he’s desperate for his ideology to win and can sense it is in peril, he’s found himself thrust into the limelight. He might not make it to 17 years.
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Agree with that assessment. Another key factor is outside jobs. Mogg was running* an asset management company from the back benches. He had to give up his 'official' position and salary.

*I say running but a lot of these companies are basically a fancy name for a small pool of extremely rich people who employ someone to look after their money on a full time basis. There are some very clever people who work in this field but also a lot of people with nothing more than the right friends/contacts. Its clearly a massive conflict of interest to do this sort of work whilst being an MP but that is the reason why such people get into politics - to control the rules on conflicts of interest.
 
I'm With Stupid said:
I know that, but the way he was talking suggested that he wasn't. Or at least he disapproved of the type of people who are only interested in chasing status.
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No, I think he's been quite happy to do that, especially if the people in Cabinet were both competent and capable. However, he recognises that now they are not, and that people are putting personal ambition/ideology ahead of the country's needs. It's all become horribly tawdry. He's always struck me as a sensitive soul in an increasingly insensitive House.
 
still inclined to think NO coz you cannot underestimate the survival instinct of these cockroaches but the state of the last 24hrs makes me think its highly possible to see a collapsed govt/Party splitting into 2 or 3 factions going forwards because clearly now looking at their antics and total disregard for doing the job they are there for will make them unelectable for ages.
 
west didsblue said:
No sympathy for any of them. They were all there enabling Johnson to break the law and to ride roughshod over the future of the country and now they’re angry because their jobs are at stake.
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They have been pandering to the hard right since Cameron agreed to the Brexit Ref. Its been a tawdry slide down that road ever since. Suella as Home Sec just summed it all up. She is not up to any cabinet job let alone high office.

We are at the stage where such incompetents run the party and the lack of ability so crystal clear that the moderates who have been sat on their hands are starting to wrestle back control. But they have made their bed and the nasty right wing grifters and agitators are going to come for them. So yes they are in grave danger of splitting.

 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
Without PR, they’ll be back.
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Labour party members want it. The PLP doesn't. Probably because some have got a nice cushy number whilst in opposition.

Give me a system that represents the whole country. Not just a binary left or right, as a lot of people are left on moral policies and right on economic ones. Plus a couple of official fascists, commies, and greens in there would liven the place up.
 
mat said:
Labour party members want it. The PLP doesn't. Probably because some have got a nice cushy number whilst in opposition.

Give me a system that represents the whole country. Not just a binary left or right, as a lot of people are left on moral policies and right on economic ones. Plus a couple of official fascists, commies, and greens in there would liven the place up.
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I’ve never got that argument about having ‘extremists’ in Parliament being a bad thing. If they represent a reasonable proportion of the population. Why shouldn’t Parliament have communists in if enough people support that?
 
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