Is our military…

The Future’s Blue! said:
It’s late, but why would the primarily volunteers step-up if they didn’t feel pride? And what about all the support for those who have served recently? Seems completely divorced from reality but willing to understand.
Click to expand...

Volunteering to defend ones country tells you nothing about our attitude towards our armed forces, conscription even less.

Remember the old songs...I don't want to join the Army, I don't want to go to war. I'd rather hang around Piccadilly underground....etc, etc

Those who have served recently are caught in a bind, the establishment pays lip service to them and the wider public seems mostly indifferent.

My opinion and its just my opinion, the establishment think of your average professional soldier much as Wellington did "scum of the Earth". It's the class based bollocks that infests this country, they think the nurses and the working class in general are lazy scum, so it's all much of a muchness. As for the man on the Clapham omnibus, he's mostly apathetic, the right wing media he consumes doesn't seem to give a shit, so he goes about his business not giving it a second thought.

I might add I'm telling it as I see it, not necessarily as I would like it.
 
Last edited:
Zabbasbeard said:
That maybe but when you've been physically attacked, racially abused, harassed and been on the end of other criminal activity from racists, you might be forgiven for thinking those people are poisonous and malicious.
Click to expand...
Those people demonstrably are. Hence why I deployed the words ‘Isn‘t necessarily’. And I stand by that. You may know plenty of poisonous and malicious people who aren’t racist in the slightest. I know I do.
 
Gorton_Tubster said:
We used to have the best police, healthcare fire service, society.
Click to expand...

Did we though?

Or did we (ie Britain at large) just convince ourselves we did and backed it up with nationalistic sentiment?

I’m sure we had and still do have a very good police, healthcare, fire service and society, but the best?

In my experience countries who spend their time boasting about being the best never are.
 
domalino said:
Did we though?

Or did we (ie Britain at large) just convince ourselves we did and backed it up with nationalistic sentiment?

I’m sure we had and still do have a very good police, healthcare, fire service and society, but the best?

In my experience countries who spend their time boasting about being the best never are.
Click to expand...
The whole we’re the best nonsense is a favourite of the Americans. When I was out there for a holiday this year folk genuinely believed we were in awe of them. The whole flag shagging stuff I found odd and enjoyed debating them as to why it’s daft. I met up with a city fan in Denver who was also ex-military (we watched the RM nightmare) then went on the piss after. He was a sound lad and we talked about politics and the military all day once the footy was off limits due to the result. He agreed Trump was an idiot and a bullshitting grifter but would alway vote Republican because his family does and….god guns flag…he even agreed it was mental to vote for that but said it was like religion and can’t be changed. He must have sunk 15 pints then got in his car to drive home. I asked him if he was concerned about getting pulled but he replied that he had his military badges on his truck and the police would bother a vet. Thing was he was a top bloke, doing a masters in brewing but was all wrapped up in the US as the dream and everyone wants the dream.
 
Pedestrian said:
The whole we’re the best nonsense is a favourite of the Americans. When I was out there for a holiday this year folk genuinely believed we were in awe of them. The whole flag shagging stuff I found odd and enjoyed debating them as to why it’s daft. I met up with a city fan in Denver who was also ex-military (we watched the RM nightmare) then went on the piss after. He was a sound lad and we talked about politics and the military all day once the footy was off limits due to the result. He agreed Trump was an idiot and a bullshitting grifter but would alway vote Republican because his family does and….god guns flag…he even agreed it was mental to vote for that but said it was like religion and can’t be changed. He must have sunk 15 pints then got in his car to drive home. I asked him if he was concerned about getting pulled but he replied that he had his military badges on his truck and the police would bother a vet. Thing was he was a top bloke, doing a masters in brewing but was all wrapped up in the US as the dream and everyone wants the dream.
Click to expand...
Not arguing with you on your main point, however a couple of years back I was visiting a mate in Spain (Brit) who’s moved down there permanently. We were sat at one of the bars where only Brit’s drink at and having beers with some Lubbly jubbly English transplants, none of whom could utter a word of Spanish. They thought they were Royalty and spend their days laughing at the locals because obviously they’re all lazy daygo’s blah blah. One of the blokes asked me at one point if I was enjoying myself and then proceeded to tell me that I could never have such a laugh living in America as we don’t drink much, have no sense of humor and all the usual Little England bollocks. I refrained from giving him a good slap but had to laugh at his and their self perception of Englishnesessess
 
idahoblues said:
Not arguing with you on your main point, however a couple of years back I was visiting a mate in Spain (Brit) who’s moved down there permanently. We were sat at one of the bars where only Brit’s drink at and having beers with some Lubbly jubbly English transplants, none of whom could utter a word of Spanish. They thought they were Royalty and spend their days laughing at the locals because obviously they’re all lazy daygo’s blah blah. One of the blokes asked me at one point if I was enjoying myself and then proceeded to tell me that I could never have such a laugh living in America as we don’t drink much, have no sense of humor and all the usual Little England bollocks. I refrained from giving him a good slap but had to laugh at his and their self perception of Englishnesessess
Click to expand...
What’s that got to do with what I posted?
 
idahoblues said:
Mainly that you asserted only Americans are guilty of feeling superior to others when in fact (having lived for long periods of time in England and the US) I would say Brits are more so
Click to expand...
I think the UK has a huge problem with folk thinking we’re still the jewel in the crown. The flag shagging happens here as well. Brexit was an example of that. This thread is also an example of someone clinging onto distance victories and forgetting the British army failure in Iraq and more recently Afghan. Using ex-pats in Spain eating a full English and drinking John smiths in the red lion in Benidorm isn’t the same as me meeting a lad in Denver.
 
metalblue said:
We treat everyone as equal (health and wealth) - I think the only advanced economy that does and is actually envied by others.
Click to expand...
England’s poorest people get worse NHS care than its wealthiest citizens, including longer waiting for A&E treatment and worse experience of GP services, a study shows.

Those from the most deprived areas have fewer hip replacements and are admitted to hospital with bed sores more often than people from the least deprived areas.

www.theguardian.com

England's poorest 'get worse NHS care' than wealthiest citizens

Study found stark differences in A&E waiting times and experience of GP services
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com


"We have an accessible and fair legal system".

New research shows both the public – and legal professionals themselves – believe only wealthy people have access to the justice system.
Those at the centre of the legal system see it as even less accessible than members of the general public do.
Barely one in five people in the UK believe the justice system to be ‘fair and transparent’, new research has found.

People believe the UK justice system is ‘unfair, confusing and inaccessible’ | AllAboutLaw

New research shows both the public – and legal professionals themselves – believe only wealthy people have access to the justice system.
www.allaboutlaw.co.uk www.allaboutlaw.co.uk
 
The perfect fumble said:
Historically the British have never really thought of the armed forces as central to our sense of national identity, the navy perhaps, when we had the largest in the world, but unlike other European countries we have a detached relationship with our military. You have to go back to Cromwell if you're looking for military rule, so we don't hold that against them, As for the two world wars they were fought mostly by conscript forces and if you think of the songs they produced they weren't about glorious victories more "when this bloody war is over, no more soldiering for me"....

Gordon Brown when he was Chancellor of the Exchequer dreamt up Armed Forces Day, but it's never caught on. Unlike on the continent you don't see men and women on the street in uniform, our military discourages it.

Unless you live in a garrison town, or have family in the services, most folk never think of the armed forces at all.
Click to expand...
I remember as a kid back in the 60's and 70's you would see people around in their military uniforms. I think that all changed after a young kid aged 16 in the cadets was gunned down at Stafford train station by some IRA hitmen in the 70's, and the wearing of uniforms outside barracks was banned after that.

I used to work in an office back in the late 80's/early 90's and one of my colleagues was in the Territorial Army, and she said they couldn't wear their uniforms outside for the public to see.

It's the way it is, but I have no doubt the young lads and lasses now serving in our military today are just as committed as those from the past.

Before I retired, I worked at Manchester airport, and flights from Afghanistan regularly touched down in the early hours. We would take them back to Catterick, Chester, wherever, and they always struck me as being solid, polite, and fit individuals you would be proud of if they were members of your family.

We may not think about them on a day to day basis, but they are there, doing a magnificent job. If you read the comments from sericemen and women from other countries that have worked alongside them, our military from all the services is universally praised and held in the highest regard.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top