City "have made the PL uncompetitive"

[Gary James]

Precisely!!

Memorable, engaging, exciting, season enders, where it could have gone to any one of City, Liverpool or Arsenal. It's so engrained in the culture of our club that there are multiple memes about it.

Manchester City have, IMO, more or less defined the Premier League since 2009. Example being things like Transfer Deadline Day with the yellow ticker bar. Before the takeover, TDD was always a damp squib where they just reported on last minute transfers between League One clubs. After Takeover Day, media outlets have been hoping to capture that lightning in a bottle moment ever since and now TDD has become a staple of the Sky football coverage calendar.

Uncompetitive? City made the Premier League more engaging than Utd ever did or could. Utd made the Premier League about them winning it, City have made the Premier League season about who wins the Premier League!

As fans some may not like the following but in terms of Premier League entertainment it is an absolute fact that the PL is now much more popular globally, especially in the States, than ever before. It's not because of MUFC or Arsenal; it's not simply because of City to be frank but it is because of the entertainment created by opening up the League beyond the two, often negative style, clubs that dominated in the 90s and early 2000s. Chelsea have contributed, LCFC briefly did, LFC have fairly consistently in recent years, but mostly City have shown an attractive style of football that brings entertainment etc. Lots to it but it's clear. People want to see City.

 

[meltonblue]

CL money has played a huge factor in distorting the league as well

Yep I mentioned that too :)

 

[Kippaxpete]

I've made this point previously but it bears repeating. Rather than attacking City with an ongoing campaign of hostility, the PL should, in fact, be cherishing us as absolutely Integral to their current prosperity. Inevitably, the rise in our popularity is inextricably linked to that of the PL product (to use their favoured term). Do they really believe that the global appeal of the PL - and, with it, their income - hasn't been boosted exponentially by City's success in the modern era? While yes, we've been dominant in terms of trophies won, those successes have often been fantastic box office for a worldwide football audience both in terms of last gasp title wins and, more generally, our swashbuckling style of play.

 

[DiscoSteve]

The only time where we 'allegedly' made it boring was the 100 points season - to be fair we smashed everyone that year and only a f*ck up against the rags stopped us winning the League in March (ISTR) - every other season its gone to the wire (or at worst the last 2 or 3 games of the season). That is NOT a set of boring seasons.

 

[Gary James]

I've made this point previously but it bears repeating. Rather than attacking City with an ongoing campaign of hostility, the PL should, in fact, be cherishing us as absolutely Integral to their current prosperity. Inevitably, the rise in our popularity is inextricably linked to that of the PL product (to use their favoured term). Do they really believe that the global appeal of the PL - and, with it, their income - hasn't been boosted exponentially by City's success in the modern era? While yes, we've been dominant in terms of trophies won, those successes have often been fantastic box office for a worldwide football audience both in terms of last gasp title wins and, more generally, our swashbuckling style of play.

And let's be honest if the PL was serious about level playing fields and all of that there are so many things they could do which I'm sure City will support. Maybe things like a limit to how much all clubs can spend each transfer window, thereby encouraging clubs to invest in youth instead; maybe salary caps; maybe have US style merchandise operations so that each club benefits equally etc. I'm not saying I support any of those but there are steps the PL could do to improve competitiveness and allow the best run smaller clubs to compete more if they want to. Remember when gate receipts used to be shared? Then Utd, LFC, Spurs, Everton, Arsenal and others (pretty certain Swales was in there for this) decided it was unfair that the more popular clubs were subsidising the less popular clubs.

 

[willipp]

And let's be honest if the PL was serious about level playing fields and all of that there are so many things they could do which I'm sure City will support. Maybe things like a limit to how much all clubs can spend each transfer window, thereby encouraging clubs to invest in youth instead; maybe salary caps; maybe have US style merchandise operations so that each club benefits equally etc. I'm not saying I support any of those but there are steps the PL could do to improve competitiveness and allow the best run smaller clubs to compete more if they want to. Remember when gate receipts used to be shared? Then Utd, LFC, Spurs, Everton, Arsenal and others (pretty certain Swales was in there for this) decided it was unfair that the more popular clubs were subsidising the less popular clubs.

Look at how Spains salary cap works, hardly a level playing field is it.

 

[Bluesince1979]

When the cartels talk about making it fairer i cant help thinking of the quote, “all animals are equal, but some are more equal than others”

Funny, they were pigs too

 

[Gone for a Burton]

It drives me mad! Before yesterday's Arsenal game the handover to the match on R5L talked about how things had changed and how it was so important for Arsenal to win because any gap now means that Pep's City will walk away with it and make an unassailable lead before Christmas as 'they usually do!' But, but, but.... most of our League titles have been won on the last day of the season!

I wrote this in May and feel we'll need to keep reminding people of the facts not the fiction:

League Dominance?

Lots of tosh has been spoken recently about teams dominating English league football with some claiming that there’s ‘never’ been a time when a team has dominated as much as Manchester City do toda…

gjfootballarchive.com

Oh and this will be useful too for when they start banging on about the gap between top and bottom is so great because of big bad MCFC (facts, facts, facts!):

League Dominance – Gap Between Top and Bottom

Following on from my piece the other day about League domination where I challenged a few myths that have developed about Premier League domination. It continues to be said that the Premier League …

gjfootballarchive.com

These arseholes don't deal in facts.

Facts are inconvenient.

Look at the facts & any sensible person will see that City have been an exciting, positive and dynamic force for the PL.

Informed international observers and fans are utterly bemused by the decade of attacks and denigration of City.

They believe we should be beatified for the quality of our football and character of players & coach.

Great Britain isn't Great it's fucked !!

 

[citymad]

All the top clubs have had a chance to invest in their team. Gooners under Wenger refused to open the purse strings, Dippers and Chelsea have spent a ton and we all know the rags have wasted an obscene amount on absolute garbage. The difference is City have looked both short and long term. We created a supreme business model with a vision that enticed the best coach in the world making us the most watched team on the planet playing the best football. And its partly due to Peps influence that the PL is now much more competitive. That never happened back in the so called "good old days'. Any team on their day can turn any other team over. You have to be "on" it every week.

 

[Gary James]

Informed international observers and fans are utterly bemused by the decade of attacks and denigration of City.

They believe we should be beatified for the quality of our football and character of players & coach.

It is interesting that I quite often do interviews with overseas media and, unless the journalist is a dedicated fan of LFC, MUFC or AFC and makes a living from that connection (even then it's a personal choice), they tend to have a much more healthy and positive view of City. They are often baffled by the negativity and surprised that fans of other English clubs do not understand the history of it all.

 

[eyalluvitt]

It is interesting that I quite often do interviews with overseas media and, unless the journalist is a dedicated fan of LFC, MUFC or AFC and makes a living from that connection (even then it's a personal choice), they tend to have a much more healthy and positive view of City. They are often baffled by the negativity and surprised that fans of other English clubs do not understand the history of it all.

It’s English tribalism , I have several American United fan friends who seem relatively normal people compared to the ex pat rags, who are just as bitter and hate filled as I am.

 

[Gone for a Burton]

It’s English tribalism , I have several American United fan friends who seem relatively normal people compared to the ex pat rags, who are just as bitter and hate filled as I am.

3 last day wins

One from 2.0 down scoring⁰ three goals in six minutes.

Another from 2.1 down in injury time, scoring twice including the winner on 93.20.

The CENTURIONS achievement was from a last minute winner in the last game of the season.

Additionally, we've created more meaniful performance records than any other English team in modern history.

Boring , boring City !!

 

[.db.]

United; won 7 league titles over the course of 10 years. "An example of the greatest football the world had ever seen! A truly remarkable football team with a manager who exemplifies what it means to nurture success and homegrown, young academy talent reaching the pinnacle of acheivement and recognition! A tremendous asset and advert for the English Premier League brand!"

Manchester City; wins 7 league titles over the course of 10 years. "The Premier League is now boring and uncompetitive and Manchester City have made it so. The players and manager are overrated and have only won it so often because they spent oil money to buy the best players. None of the success has been deserved and it paints a grim future for the English Premier League brand that success in football is now measured by how much money you spend."

All i'm doing is pointing out what we all already know about coverage regarding City.

Indeed.

Even stretch it out further:

Liverpool won the league 11 times in 17 years (1972-73, 1975-76, 1976-77, 1978-79, 1979-80, 1981-82, 1982-83, 1983-84, 1985-86, 1987-88 and 1989-90).
That’s 64.7% of the time in that period.

United won the league 13 times in 21 years (1992-93, 1993-94, 1995-96, 1996-97, 1998-99, 1999-00, 2000-01, 2002-03, 2006-07, 2007-08, 2008-09, 2010-11, 2012-13).
That’s 61.9% of the time in that period.

City have won the league 8 times in 13 years (2011-12, 2013-14, 2017-18, 2018-19, 2020-21, 2021-22, 2022-23, 2023-24).
That’s 61.5% of the time in this period.

Top two clubs, that was alright, no problem.
Bottom one, that’s not alright, it is a problem.

Even if we win another four titles in the next six seasons to split the other two’s 17 and 21 years of dominance, calling ours 19 years of dominance with 12 league titles in this time period, that’s still only 63.1%.

 

[talkativesprout]

The only time where we 'allegedly' made it boring was the 100 points season - to be fair we smashed everyone that year and only a f*ck up against the rags stopped us winning the League in March (ISTR) - every other season its gone to the wire (or at worst the last 2 or 3 games of the season). That is NOT a set of boring seasons.

I don't remember Bookies ever paying out for a City title win before it was mathematically impossible for them to lose it. I seem to remember it happening at least twice under Fergie.

How short their memories are mate

 

[blue whippet]

The only time where we 'allegedly' made it boring was the 100 points season - to be fair we smashed everyone that year and only a f*ck up against the rags stopped us winning the League in March (ISTR) - every other season its gone to the wire (or at worst the last 2 or 3 games of the season). That is NOT a set of boring seasons.

That was a wonderful season, so exciting to watch every week. I am still pissed off we lost against them on that day though.

 

[TedofChume]

I don't remember Bookies ever paying out for a City title win before it was mathematically impossible for them to lose it. I seem to remember it happening at least twice under Fergie.

How short their memories are mate

They did it with Liverpool and Leicester...

 

[Vic]

That was a wonderful season, so exciting to watch every week. I am still pissed off we lost against them on that day though.

Eased a bit by them losing it instead in front of their own fans while Vinnie was in his local pub...

 

[TedofChume]

I'm pretty sure the Premier League is more competitive now than ever, and it is down to the money invested in City.

Older fans will know what I'm about to say, but younger fans might not.

When the Premier League started in 92-93, Liverpool and and United were live on tv all the time. Closely followed by Arsenal, Everton and Spurs. These five clubs started pushing for an English Super League in they 80s, the Premier League was the 4th attempt. They ran it and have done since. Everton should have been relegated twice but have stayed up...

Live football on BBC/ITV arrived in 83-84. These five self styled "Glamour Clubs" were on tv all the time. I'm pretty sure the tv companies had picked City as well, because you'd have the three biggest derbies to show, but City had other plans....

They were each shown at 2-3 times a month out of 8 games, they quickly built up armchair supporters around the UK, who'd buy shirts, programmes and other merchandise. So being on TV the most was the holy grail.

Elitism had started before this with home gate receipts, end of maximum wage etc. but live matches on tv accelerated this.

Back to the Premier League:

United won 7 of the first 9 titles, and as the Champions League had started at the same time and only the champions entered, they shot ahead financially. It would have been 8/9, if Jack Walker hadn't bankrolled Blackburn.

During this time Chelsea (£400m) and Leeds (£200m), almost went bust, trying to keep up. Leeds went down and Chelsea were saved by Abramovich. If it hadn't been for Abramovich's money, the following decade would have been 8/10 for United. Newcastle had been back rolled by John Hall in the 90s, but when he stepped down Freddie Shepherd racked up £250m of debt before selling to Mike Ashley, who ran a tight ship and paid it off. Liverpool didn't do much better racking up almost £500m of debt before RBS/NatWest called in the debt.

We had a period in the 00s where the same four clubs qualified every year for the Champions League (Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool and United). It was becoming very boring and predictable.

After almost 20 years only 4 teams had won it, two with massive cash injections.

The only thing that changed it was City joining the party. First City pushed Liverpool out of their regular Champions League slot, creating churn. Since the money came into City, 5c extra clubs (City, Spurs, Newcastle, Villa and Leicester).have all played in the Champions League, and three new teams City, Leicester and Liverpool have won the Premier League.

Currently we have Brighton really trying to break into the Champions League places.

As others have pointed out 5/8 titles that City have won have gone to the wire, 3 being the tightest Premier League title races ever.

If Newcastle had been allowed to spend like City, we'd have a much more competitive league.

I'm pretty certain over the last 8 years United and Chelsea have spent more on players than City every year, and Arsenal have in 6 of them too. It baffles me how City are accused of buying the league.

If it hadn't been for wealthy owners like John Hall, Abramovich and Sheik Mansour upsetting the apple cart, United would have won the Premier League over 20 times by now.
 
The reality is, it's not all about Arsenal, Liverpool and United anymore, and their owners and fans don't like it.

What does anything mean, basically? What is the Script of the Bridge, Strange Times indeed.

 

[trotsky]

What does anything mean, basically? What is the Script of the Bridge, Strange Times indeed.

They’ve tried to hamper us all the way, it’s been like running Up the Down Escalator

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

Indeed.

Even stretch it out further:

Liverpool won the league 11 times in 17 years (1972-73, 1975-76, 1976-77, 1978-79, 1979-80, 1981-82, 1982-83, 1983-84, 1985-86, 1987-88 and 1989-90).
That’s 64.7% of the time in that period.

United won the league 13 times in 21 years (1992-93, 1993-94, 1995-96, 1996-97, 1998-99, 1999-00, 2000-01, 2002-03, 2006-07, 2007-08, 2008-09, 2010-11, 2012-13).
That’s 61.9% of the time in that period.

City have won the league 8 times in 13 years (2011-12, 2013-14, 2017-18, 2018-19, 2020-21, 2021-22, 2022-23, 2023-24).
That’s 61.5% of the time in this period.

Top two clubs, that was alright, no problem.
Bottom one, that’s not alright, it is a problem.

Even if we win another four titles in the next six seasons to split the other two’s 17 and 21 years of dominance, calling ours 19 years of dominance with 12 league titles in this time period, that’s still only 63.1%.

Just look at those stats and think what we have achieved in such a short period.

What’s not to like, absolutely outstanding from us and probably the best return of any era.

Wait, what, did I say probably?