Chippy_boy
Well-Known Member
It speaks volumes that you find it amusing that some parents are worried and struggling to pay school fees. Not that it reveals anything new whatsoever.
Vat on Independent school fees?
- Thread starter Worsleyweb
- Start date
Chippy_boy
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It’s not the VAT that winds me up - I don’t even have any kids FFS. it’s the piss poor attititufe of some wankers on here who seem to think anyone on more than average wage is minted and they can be fleeced with impunity. It’s their loathing of better off people that I find so deeply offensive.
Anyway I’m out for a while. Too many cretins on here to waste my time on.
Nah, you’ve just gotta read the room Chippy. This is predominantly a forum for working class people who have a football club in common. When somebody is complaining about not being able to afford an extra few grand for their kids to go to private school it won’t wash with many.
I’m firmly in the camp that if you’re well off through your own hard graft then good luck to you and spend your money on what you want.
There’s a few very successful in life posters on here and I’ve no issue with the majority because they don’t throw it in peoples faces.
This argument of yours on this particular subject just doesn’t make sense. Sorry.
I'm With Stupid
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Welcome to how taxes work. The people who benefit most from the country we live in are the ones expected to contribute to it the most. It's not a novel concept. It's literally how every country on the planet (that isn't a tax haven for people who earned their money in a proper country) works and how every mainstream political party in all of those countries think it should work.
But anyway, we could always just recommend the right wing solution to anyone moaning about this. Just work harder. That's what poor people are told by right wingers when they can't afford things they want.
I’ve got a few quid so you can’t be talking about me. :-) x
roubaixtuesday
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"Fleeced with impunity". At least you're getting funnier rather than just aggressive. I assumed you were in the sauce.
Anyway, it's the removal of a tax perk, a subsidy.
If people don't want to pay this tax it's trivial for them to avoid it. Everyone has an option here, nothing is being done with impunity.
bluethrunthru
Well-Known Member
can you imagine the improvement in state education if you closed down all fee paying schools. All those sharp elbowed parents who would demand better outcomes, more swimming pools, playing fields and so on for their off spring? Who knows they may be prepared to pay extra in tax directed at education for all kids. It would mean that most likely 32k overseas borders would not be coming here which would appease Reform UK Ltd
meltonblue
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Was always going to happen given how much the social contract has been broken over the last couple of decades though.
Taking the emotion out of it though, I don’t see this as being fleeced with impunity as it’s not targeting all in that bracket, it’s targeting those that choose to procure a service that they’re currently getting a 20% discount from the state for.
I do think some of their ire should be directed at the private schools themselves too, particularly those that are in that position where they can only just afford it.
Chippy_boy
Well-Known Member
Against my better judgement, Im going to reply to this.
I don't have kids. I didn't go to private school. If I had kids, I would not have sent them to one, not necessarily because I couldn't afford it, but because I am not sure I approve of it.
But that's not the point. Many of my friends have been in similar earnings bracket to me and some fretted long and hard about whether sending their child to a private school was something they could possibly afford. One friend (not the one I referred to earlier) had a son who was being repeatedly bullied at the school he was in, and my mate was deeply worried about him. Another friend of mine, his son was bering bullied and he endec up killing himself. He threw himself in front of an oncoming train, aged 13. It devastated the family who never ever got over it. Very concerned about the welfare of his son, ultimately my mate decided he would take his child out of the school he was in, and send him to a private school in the southwest. It virtually bankrupted them, but their son was finally happy. I remember my mate saying to me how broke they were all the time, and I said to "yes but what price your child's happiness", something he thanked me for saying.
These are the only two people I know who have sent their children to private schools. One I mentioned previously who had to move out of his house to pay for it, and another who was effectively bankrupted.
And yet some people on here have the downright temerity to suggest that 20% VAT on top is water off a ducks back? I am gobsmacked at both how clueless and at the same time now utterly uncompassionate and insensitive some people can be.
Yes but that's just the way of the world. Some people can't afford luxuries and private education is a luxury. It's like saying there shouldn't be VAT on Ferraris.
Alan Harper's Tash
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Amendments in taxation are always going to affect somebody. The fact that it may make life harder for two people you know has made yours an emotive argument.
When the shoe was on the other foot and kids getting fed was in the news, those parents had to sell phones, TVs, stop drinking lattes, booze and smoking.
roubaixtuesday
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I think you're describing Finland
Finland has no private schools – and its pupils perform better than British children
Finland ranked seventh in the world in OECD's student assessment chart in 2018, well above the UK and the United States, where there is a mix of private and state education
inews.co.uk
meltonblue
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It’s also hard to have sympathy given how much state schools have had their budgets cut, coupled with private schools not partnering anywhere near as much as they should.
There’s still a choice for both the private schools and their consumers (as in the former could choose to lower their costs or the latter could choose to pay more). State schools are having to make far worse decisions around basic provisions….
Chippy_boy
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It's not the same as that at all.
There has already been tax on cars (at least in my memory). The equivalent would be like suddenly we are whacking a 20% additional tax on Ferraris that was never charged previously. There's no VAT on food so perhaps we should stick VAT on that as well?
Only it's much much worse. A car is just a car. Tax goes up, don't buy it or get rid of it. Your child's welfare is a completely different thing and this will cause lots of parents to have to take their kids out of their school.
meltonblue
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Only if the private schools choose to pass it on to them though, which plenty could afford not to with no change to their current service and others could by doing things like increasing their class sizes, it’d still be comparably an exclusive service.
Would you support it if it was a staggered implementation rather than a big bang?
west didsblue
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I find it amusing that people who can afford to spend nearly £60k a year on a luxury are moaning that the fees that they pay are going to have a tax applied like every other professional fee.
If I was spending that much cash on discretionary spending I’d keep my trap shut rather than go and moan about it, and I certainly wouldn’t expect randomers on a footy forum to fight my corner.
Chippy_boy
Well-Known Member
I wouldn't support it, no. I think people should be encouraged to not be dependent the state, like people are encouraged to pay for their own pension, for example. Seems entirely illogical to me to ask people to pay for the state education of their child, even if the state is not educating their child. It's bad enough people have to pay the full fees, without having VAT added on top.
But at least parents would not have been place in the very undesirable position of having to pull a child out of a school they are settled in. It's not the child's fault that Rachel Thieves is a heartless robot.
west didsblue
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Or me.
The Fat el Hombre
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If you can't afford it your kids can't go
roubaixtuesday
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No, it won't.
Reputable estimates are in the 3-7% range. A tiny minority of a tiny minority.
Thus far, despite it being announced in advance, private school rolls have actually increased relative to state (both have fallen, but state by very sightly more).
And in the last decade, private school fees have gone up far beyond inflation without impacting numbers.
You can't possibly have a tax system where nobody is every affected by any change, and there have been many changes where fast more people are negatively affected. The bedroom tax, for instance.
If private schools really cared, they'd reduce their costs a bit by increasing class sizes. It's not difficult.