Russian invasion of Ukraine

meeesh said:
I asked a couple of genuine questions mate yesterday that's all, but as you quite rightly mention, the noise has made it irrelevant now.

Unfortunately, and I should have known better, it's pointless now, as I didn't get anything of relevance back, which is weird considering how many have had an input on this thread.

But I did learn that the UK is in Europe, funny that, as I'm 54 in a couple of week and never knew that, oh and I have tourettes as well apparently.

I won't say nothing more on this thread, but just peruse it for a few giggles as experts fall over themselves talking shit, but throwing an odd stat in here and there, funny innit how stats come into play when they in fact don't paint the whole picture.
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What is the whole picture? Other than the UK having a larger population than France (which was news to you) because “they send them all over here”.
 
Jimmieblue said:
He doesn’t seem to want peace. That’s the impression I get. It’s all a mess, let’s see what happens might all be different in a week.
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Let’s say I break into your house tonight, declare the living room and bathroom as mine, smash the kitchen up and shoot your wife.

Would you be happy if you rang the police and were told you should make peace with me by offering me all of your valuables and 20% of the property value, all whilst having no guarantee I won’t come and attack again. You’d take that deal right?
 
Jimmieblue said:
An election would prove that he is popular, some doubt it. If he is, just carry on doing what we are doing. If he’s elected, he now wants to make up with US, I’m sure that will happen. Some security agreements with US while they raid the earth elements. No troops on the ground because Putin won’t agree to that ever. He withdraws from the agreed bits. NATO pays more to rebuild Ukraine and we all live happy ever after, but poorer.
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We didn’t have an election during WW2 either.

He’s got other things to do rather than campaigning don’t you think?
 
meeesh said:
I get it, but as not totally clued up on the subject, I was mainly looking for a bit more insight, but as per too many were just putting their own thoughts and spin on it, without answering the questions, I do think many thought I was taking the piss, which I wasn't at all.
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Jimmieblue said:
I don’t know, I was just hoping beyond hope that it could happen. Maybe I am naive. Just don’t trust politicians anymore.
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At the risk of boring regulars on here with repetition, anybody who wants to educate themselves on the matter could do worse than reading ex World Chess champion Garry Kasparov's Winter Is Coming: Why Vladimir Putin and the Enemies of the Free World Must Be Stopped

I read this at the start of the invasion and it opened my eyes to how truly evil the Russian state is.

One of the things that he covered was what it takes to stand in a Russian election. Before the votes are even cast and counted, the whole system is against anybody who wants to stand against Putin. You have to get 50,000 signatures from 16 different Oblasts to even enter to ballot (might not be the exact numbers, I can't remember, but you get the point).

That is why most posters on here want to see the war ended on Ukraine's terms.
 
ManCitizens. said:
Let’s say I break into your house tonight, declare the living room and bathroom as mine, smash the kitchen up and shoot your wife.

Would you be happy if you rang the police and were told you should make peace with me by offering me all of your valuables and 20% of the property value, all whilst having no guarantee I won’t come and attack again. You’d take that deal right?
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You could also add into that mix that your next door neighbour gets to take anything of value from your back garden without coming to your aid, as part of that deal.
 
grunge said:
So he's openly saying he wants peace, has said he will leave office now if Ukraine is granted NATO membership. all he wants some guarantee's that Ukraine will get support if Russia starts up again. whats the issue with that?
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He’s desperate to get NATO membership. If that happens I wouldn’t like to think of the outcome. At the end of the day our glorious politicians will try and sort it out. We will pay more taxes and there will be more poverty. Never mind City are through, the Rags are out, hope we’re cleared this month. Always 2 diverse opinions on here, very rarely are people’s opinions changed.
 
grunge said:
Not sure on that. if you think about it. if Ukraine declares a ceasefire a Russia ignores it then its flips the "Zelenskyy doesn't want peace" argument entirely on its head.
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And they could get overwhelmed.

The proposition is predicated on the fact that Ukraine has done anything wrong.

Plus he is calling for unequivocal support for a man who is clearly a Russian asset.
 
Jimmieblue said:
He doesn’t seem to want peace. That’s the impression I get. It’s all a mess, let’s see what happens might all be different in a week.
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Peace can be declared, today. Wanna know how? Putin ends the invasion and the Russians fuck off back home.

So why isn't he doing that? Almost makes me think Putin doesn't want peace.
 
Jimmieblue said:
He’s desperate to get NATO membership. If that happens I wouldn’t like to think of the outcome. At the end of the day our glorious politicians will try and sort it out. We will pay more taxes and there will be more poverty. Never mind City are through, the Rags are out, hope we’re cleared this month. Always 2 diverse opinions on here, very rarely are people’s opinions changed.
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Yeah - nightmare that any country bordering Russia actually be a member of NATO. That would be totally unaccepta... no wait.. do Norway, Finland, Estonia and Latvia count as countries?
 
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gordondaviesmoustache said:
And they could get overwhelmed.

The proposition is predicated on the fact that Ukraine has done anything wrong.

Plus he is calling for unequivocal support for a man who is clearly a Russian asset.
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Declaring a cease fire doesn't mean move military back or defend. Say "midnight on x day we will have a cease file". when Russia keeps attacking then keep fighting and say "well we tried a cease fire and Russia are not interested in peace"
 
Jimmieblue said:
He’s desperate to get NATO membership. If that happens I wouldn’t like to think of the outcome. At the end of the day our glorious politicians will try and sort it out. We will pay more taxes and there will be more poverty. Never mind City are through, the Rags are out, hope we’re cleared this month. Always 2 diverse opinions on here, very rarely are people’s opinions changed.
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Well Russia would leave them alone for one.
 
Jimmieblue said:
He doesn’t seem to want peace. That’s the impression I get. It’s all a mess, let’s see what happens might all be different in a week.
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He wants Russia to get the fuck out of his country.

Churchill didn’t want peace either when offered it in 1940. Would you have wanted him out as well? Seriously why the double standards with Zelensky and Putin? Why not put each of these attacks your aiming towards Ukraine and its leader at Russia? They started the war. They invaded. Putin is on record saying he wants the borders back to where they were pre glasnost.

This war ends the minute Russia leaves Ukraine and they’re desperate now as their economy has six months tops left in the current situation.
 
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