Open Letter on Season Tickets and Pricing | Club announce price freeze on "general admission season tickets & PL match tickets" for next season (p163)

[East Level 2]

I feel exactly the same.

I’ll always love City, the team, even if they’re shit. They’re my team and always will be.

But the boardroom… nah! They aren’t City, they’re just temporary employees of our club who could all go and be replaced tomorrow as far as I care since they don’t care about us.

Istanbul car park was the day they lost me. I’ll never have any affinity for any of them ever again. What’s going on now, as much as it angers me and makes me feel really down about the club, doesn’t surprise me one bit. They don’t want us there anymore, and their total disrespect and disdain they hold us in shows it.

It wasn't just the foreseeable farce in the Istanbul car park, it was the club's refusal to condemn the treatment of City fans during the following weeks.
Like you, I support the team. I do now, and I did when we went down to the third tier. However the directors show less commitment to the fans (other than buying decent players and coaches) than they have ever done in living memory, with the possible exception of the ticket sales arrangements for Wembley 1999.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

How come Kev Parker got two terms?

I know PB was extended but even he had to give it up eventually so what makes the OSC rep different that the same guy can do multiple terms??

You know shit. I was never extended.

We talked about a system of rotation without coming to any agreement as the club proposal was ridiculous.Then eventually we came to an arrangement whereby three reps stood down every couple of years. So no one would do more than 4 years. And as there were only 3 of the original group left after 4 years we all stood down. The only problem was that one was the chair, so he stayed on to handover to Alex.

And it was also agreed that the OSC should have the right to send whoever they decided to send and currently that's Kevin.

 

[jrb]

You know shit. I was never extended.

We talked about a system of rotation without coming to any agreement as the club proposal was ridiculous.Then eventually we came to an arrangement whereby three reps stood down every couple of years. So no one would do more than 4 years. And as there were only 3 of the original group left after 4 years we all stood down. The only problem was that one was the chair, so he stayed on to handover to Alex.

And it was also agreed that the OSC should have the right to send whoever they decided to send and currently that's Kevin.

Was that a forgone conclusion?

Was another OSC member/candidate ever going to be sent?

Who bar Kevin Parker were the other OSC candidates for the OSC, City Matters Rep position?

Was there ever an OSC vote for the position of City Matters Rep?

If so, what was the voting criteria? The committee? The branch secretaries? The OSC membership?

I’m sure the club were delighted by the decision.

Believe it or not I’ve got nothing against Kevin Parker. I’m sure he has done some good things for City fans via his position of general secretary of the OSC. He certainly runs a tight OSC ship.

But for me he is too close to the club and too close to the directors to be truly independent of either or both.

 

[CoventryBlue]

You know shit. I was never extended.

We talked about a system of rotation without coming to any agreement as the club proposal was ridiculous.Then eventually we came to an arrangement whereby three reps stood down every couple of years. So no one would do more than 4 years. And as there were only 3 of the original group left after 4 years we all stood down. The only problem was that one was the chair, so he stayed on to handover to Alex.

And it was also agreed that the OSC should have the right to send whoever they decided to send and currently that's Kevin.

Extended versus the original 2 years that it was initially meant to be is what I meant

 

[OneTonyHenry]

It wasn't just the foreseeable farce in the Istanbul car park, it was the club's refusal to condemn the treatment of City fans during the following weeks.
Like you, I support the team. I do now, and I did when we went down to the third tier. However the directors show less commitment to the fans (other than buying decent players and coaches) than they have ever done in living memory, with the possible exception of the ticket sales arrangements for Wembley 1999.

70 + pages of comments on the debacle that was the Istanbul organisation (especially post match) - and from what I've seen not one word on the subject from the club. The greatest achievement in our history but not one acknowledgement of what so many had to put up with. The club hierarchy didn't have to encounter any of it - and that's the reason why

 

[Whether or not]

70 + pages of comments on the debacle that was the Istanbul organisation (especially post match) - and from what I've seen not one word on the subject from the club. The greatest achievement in our history but not one acknowledgement of what so many had to put up with. The club hierarchy didn't have to encounter any of it - and that's the reason why

Your comment about the hierarchy not encountering the fans experience is 100% the issue, they exist in a different world. We caught a midnight flight on the Friday from Heathrow to Istanbul, arriving about 04.00 Friday morning. It was a couple of hours too early for the metro so we sat in the terminal and had a brew. Even at that time there must have been 40 chauffeurs waiting, all with placards, for UEFA, City, Inter, sponsors, broadcasters etc. and the limousines and SUV’s were lined up outside. From the moment the VIP’s arrive to the moment they leave they are in a luxurious bubble, and it is week in week out. How can they even begin to relate to the bedlam on that car park. It doesn’t excuse them not caring, or ignoring the duty of care to the clubs fans/customers, but to some extent hearing the reports about it must been like us watching the news and seeing some disaster on the other side of the world, sad but very difficult to relate to.

 

[Brian Worrall]

Hi all, I am the City Matters rep for the Matchday Members and I have supported my colleagues in not attending other meetings until we see some movement on the pricing and ticketing issues, this is what I put on my Facebook page for the Matchday Members:

Since the letter on ticket prices (contained in an earlier post) was published and sent to the Club over a month ago, there has been no formal reply, only the promise of a meeting to discuss which has not yet materialised. In fairness these are complex issues to deal with fully. We raised, along with the other supporter groups, concerns over season ticket pricing, the nature of season tickets to be offered in the future and in particular Flexi Gold, along with the current and future cost of tickets to Matchday members. Complex, yes, but the Club did not start working on these issues the day the letter was posted and the lack of communication and engagement with City Matters during this time, the key time of year for pricing renewal, is deeply concerning. With this in mind, and along with other City Matters colleagues, I think it appropriate to suspend engagement with the Club on more everyday matters, to allow both parties the time to engage fully on this critical one. We hope this will be done quickly but until it is we will not be attending other working meetings, but will continue to engage fans more generally. Hopefully this gives us all the time and space to concentrate on this one issue, and arrange a full and meaningful discussion on it.

I had a comment asking if I could encourage other City Matters Reps who have not declared their position to do so. Obviously I can't speak for them but I will pass on the request.

 

[shnaghaicityfish]

Has anyone seen any suggestion that the proposed government regulator will monitor/enforce meaningful fan engagement by the clubs? I’m not particularly optimistic but if they were to act like some sort of fan ombudsman they might actually be useful. “Fan engagement” is some sort of government requirement isn’t it?

 

[dannybcity]

Has anyone seen any suggestion that the proposed government regulator will monitor/enforce meaningful fan engagement by the clubs? I’m not particularly optimistic but if they were to act like some sort of fan ombudsman they might actually be useful. “Fan engagement” is some sort of government requirement isn’t it?

Within some of the draft rules I'm pretty certain is says the would be able refuse them a licence if they can't show a certain level of fan engagement. I'd have to double check the exact wording though.

 

[Alex - Not City Matters]

Has anyone seen any suggestion that the proposed government regulator will monitor/enforce meaningful fan engagement by the clubs? I’m not particularly optimistic but if they were to act like some sort of fan ombudsman they might actually be useful. “Fan engagement” is some sort of government requirement isn’t it?

This is a really good question.

The fact sheet published by the Government does contain reference to fan engagement requirements.

Fact sheet: Football Governance Bill - the Independent Football Regulator (IFR)

www.gov.uk

That said, I suspect both the Premier League and the Club to argue that the Fan Engagement Standard is evidence of such engagement, particularly as the fact sheet refers to have an “effective framework” in place to meet with fans. It’s debatable what constitutes effective, of course, but the Premier League and Club both publish documents under this guise.

However, more promising from my perspective is the following line from when the Bill was reintroduced to the House. From the BBC article, it will compel clubs to democratically select the fan representatives the club must engage with" and demand "effective engagement" with supporters on changes to ticket prices.

Football Governance Bill: Government to introduce 'strengthened' legislation

"Strengthened" legislation to establish an independent football regulator for the elite men's game in England is set to be introduced to parliament by the government.

www.bbc.com

Currently, as my paper from last summer sets out, the recruitment for City Matters isn’t completely independent of the Club. Likewise, given my current stance of non-engagement in meetings with the Club, I would suggest that they are falling short on the point about ticket prices.

That said, more broadly on the plans for the Independent Football Regulator, I asked the Club back in December whether they felt they complied with the plans - as far as was in the public domain. They believe that they do. It’s in the minutes from that meeting.

 

[East Level 2]

Has anyone seen any suggestion that the proposed government regulator will monitor/enforce meaningful fan engagement by the clubs? I’m not particularly optimistic but if they were to act like some sort of fan ombudsman they might actually be useful. “Fan engagement” is some sort of government requirement isn’t it?

Within some of the draft rules I'm pretty certain is says the would be able refuse them a licence if they can't show a certain level of fan engagement. I'd have to double check the exact wording though.

The regulator might be able to enforce fan engagement by clubs but the role was never going to cover pricing and stupid kick-off times.

 

[dannybcity]

The regulator might be able to enforce fan engagement by clubs but the role was never going to cover pricing and stupid kick-off times.

They'll have to engage on ticket prices at the very least;

Strengthened Football Governance Bill launched to protect clubs and support fans

The Government will take its first step to address the significant issues facing the financial sustainability of elite men’s football in England with the introduction of a strengthened Football Governance Bill in the House of Lords.

www.gov.uk

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

They'll have to engage on ticket prices at the very least;

Strengthened Football Governance Bill launched to protect clubs and support fans

The Government will take its first step to address the significant issues facing the financial sustainability of elite men’s football in England with the introduction of a strengthened Football Governance Bill in the House of Lords.

www.gov.uk

I am not convinced but hope the regulator will make a difference and help fans. The least it should do is put pressure on the corrupt gang who have taken over the PL leadership.

 

[Man_City_Loyal]

been said before. But this is so true.

Only way the clubs will react with fans complaints, treatment of fans/cheaper ticket prices and more is when fans STOP paying the money for the tickets and STOP going in the ground.

 

[Gone for a Burton]

Was that a forgone conclusion?

Was another OSC member/candidate ever going to be sent?

Who bar Kevin Parker were the other OSC candidates for the OSC, City Matters Rep position?

Was there ever an OSC vote for the position of City Matters Rep?

If so, what was the voting criteria? The committee? The branch secretaries? The OSC membership?

I’m sure the club were delighted by the decision.

Believe it or not I’ve got nothing against Kevin Parker. I’m sure he has done some good things for City fans via his position of general secretary of the OSC. He certainly runs a tight OSC ship.

But for me he is too close to the club and too close to the directors to be truly independent of either or both.

The OSC, its Chair & officers must be completely independent of the club.

Professional engagement is a given but beyond that everything must be at arms length.

Transparency regarding ticket allocations, social/industry/complimentary/ events for officials etc must also be improved.

There is a growing amount of disquiet regarding the operation of the OSC which is not good for it !!

 

[Tim of the Oak]

The OSC, its Chair & officers must be completely independent of the club.

Professional engagement is a given but beyond that everything must be at arms length.

Transparency regarding ticket allocations, social/industry/complimentary/ events for officials etc must also be improved.

There is a growing amount of disquiet regarding the operation of the OSC which is not good for it !!

That’s what the OSc expect from Bluemoon though, although things have improved markedly in recent years. Membership of the OSC is overrated but it’s still better than not being a members.

Who spoke up yonks ago when it was routine for posters to try to bully OSC members on here. (I gave as good as I got so I was t worried about that). The alliance of fans groups were nowhere to be seen on those days.

Re. Representation on City Matters. I don’t know why anyone is interested in being involved in the current climate. Credit to all those reps who’ve worked hard to help fellow Blues. It’s been a thankless task.

It’s a sad time when diehards Blues are so frustrated with City’s lack of effective engagement that they go cap in hand to the Manchester United Evening News. City’s Directors should be embarrassed.

 

[Edghill OG]

This is a really good question.

The fact sheet published by the Government does contain reference to fan engagement requirements.

Fact sheet: Football Governance Bill - the Independent Football Regulator (IFR)

www.gov.uk

That said, I suspect both the Premier League and the Club to argue that the Fan Engagement Standard is evidence of such engagement, particularly as the fact sheet refers to have an “effective framework” in place to meet with fans. It’s debatable what constitutes effective, of course, but the Premier League and Club both publish documents under this guise.

However, more promising from my perspective is the following line from when the Bill was reintroduced to the House. From the BBC article, it will compel clubs to democratically select the fan representatives the club must engage with" and demand "effective engagement" with supporters on changes to ticket prices.

Football Governance Bill: Government to introduce 'strengthened' legislation

"Strengthened" legislation to establish an independent football regulator for the elite men's game in England is set to be introduced to parliament by the government.

www.bbc.com

Currently, as my paper from last summer sets out, the recruitment for City Matters isn’t completely independent of the Club. Likewise, given my current stance of non-engagement in meetings with the Club, I would suggest that they are falling short on the point about ticket prices.

That said, more broadly on the plans for the Independent Football Regulator, I asked the Club back in December whether they felt they complied with the plans - as far as was in the public domain. They believe that they do. It’s in the minutes from that meeting.

That was a really good question and has been something I'd been thinking about myself. They probably think they're covering themselves with the ridiculous amount of questionnaires they send out. Something like fan engagement can presumably be subjective so I don't know how it can be enforced. Consequently it needed a stance like you have chosen and it'll be interesting if you get any assistance from elsewhere now. Otherwise the standard is just a bit of meaningless paper at the end of the day.

Probably not the right place to ask this Alex, but from the comments you can only serve one term. Is that just for that category or altogether? I'm sure most of us would be delighted if you could be a representative for another category when this one comes to an end.

 

[Eccles Blue]

How many members of the City Matters group have to attend to make the meeting quorate?
The rules state that they have to attend each meeting. This obviously doesn’t happen as it keeps being reported that at least one member doesn’t.
The rules/procedure or whatever also states that reps are ‘expected to share the minutes with their respective fan groups through their own social media or via email through their City Matters email account’. Mmmm

If the City Matters ‘Committee’ consists of more City employees than Fan Representatives surely depending on the number of attendees to form a quorum the former outnumber the latter?

Just my random thoughts in what appears to be an impasse?

 

[Gone for a Burton]

Not the best looking lot. ;-)

The Rags protesting against the Glazers and Scruffy Jim today.

After the other illegal protests,trespassing,criminal damage and violence, who would take these bandwagon jumpers seriously.

The world is laughing at the arrogant, deluded, entitled out of town imposters.

 

[DTKOAG]

Not the best looking lot. ;-)

The Rags protesting against the Glazers and Scruffy Jim today.

I sense it wont be too long before we start doing protest marches to the ground.