The Labour Government

[BlueHammer85]

This isn’t a dig but maybe you notice more because you disagree with it? I don’t think it’s a new phenomenon since 2024. That said we are seeing more and more toxic postings on social media. I can’t believe how openly racist some people are, I thought we left that sort of shit behind 50 plus years ago.

The two are connected, soon as Labour come to power social media went into max speed of negativity and racism - it’s no suprise when the platform owner of the biggest social media app tells the world our Labour MPs are rape apologists and vouches for Tommy Robinson- there’s a massive push by the far right and they’ve used Labour to enable that.

 

[Blue and true]

This isn’t a dig but maybe you notice more because you disagree with it? I don’t think it’s a new phenomenon since 2024. That said we are seeing more and more toxic postings on social media. I can’t believe how openly racist some people are, I thought we left that sort of shit behind 50 plus years ago.

There have always been openly racist people, but historically they never had social media platforms to hide behind.

Social media has, handily, shown racists up for what they have always been; cowards.

 

[Hertzblue]

Ended long running disputes and strikes in the rail sector.
Same for NHS and Doctors Strikes although recent demands to deal with.
Took quick and decisive action to stop the Farage riots.
Launched UKs biggest prison expansion in over a decade.
Bought in legislation to nationalise the railways.
Launched GB energy act and billions in green investment.
Workers rights bill - more protection against unfair dismissal, better rights for zero hour contracts and expanded paternity leave.
Increased NHS funding by 30 billion annually- waiting lists have already decreased 5%
Began recruitment for 1000 more GPs.
Increased the minimum wage.
Launched a 113 billion infrastructure project also including AI.
Have begun recruiting 6500 extra teachers.
Rolled out ‘Best Start’ hubs - backed by 500mill to support vunreable families.
Scraped Rwanda - working with EU and Macron on Migration issue and return agreement, record deportations and arrests of illegal workers up 51%.
Committed to increase defence budget to 2.5% and strengthening UK military.
Invested significantly in housing and bought in the renters rights bill which will ban no fault evictions most significantly.
Government task force to tackle homelessness with a 1 billion funding boost.
Introduced paid civil service internship programme.
Implemented ‘Ronan’s Law’ - including ban on Ninja Swords and an amnisty for illegal blades.
Enforced the online safety act prioritising child safety.

 

[metalblue]

There have always been openly racist people, but historically they never had social media platforms to hide behind.

Social media has, handily, shown racists up for what they have always been; cowards.

I do agree that the internet gives the nut cases of this country to congregate, you don’t see the fruit loops on the street corner with their sandwich boards as often these days as the internet lets them find like minded loons. The internet gives rise to a sense of being anonymous but I’m seeing racism is more creeping in to everyday language in real life, surprisingly amongst the young as much as any other cohort.

 

[metalblue]

More Dippers shirts unfortunately.

My understanding is the trusts have pretty much total discretion over how/who they recruit. I was in hospital a few weeks ago and had a chat with an ambulance driver. The trust was just in the process of ending the contract with a private ambulance company. That was having the effect of taking 20 ambulances from the resource available.

Oh even worse!! #PrayforHampshireBlue!!

Yes it’s trust discretion and per my previous losing corporate functions takes time to reduce which is where they’d ideally want to make the reductions and join forces with other trusts. Hence why I think it unintended consequences.

 

[metalblue]

The two are connected, soon as Labour come to power social media went into max speed of negativity and racism - it’s no suprise when the platform owner of the biggest social media app tells the world our Labour MPs are rape apologists and vouches for Tommy Robinson- there’s a massive push by the far right and they’ve used Labour to enable that.

People have always slagged off the government of the day from day 1 if their party didn’t get in.

I equally agree that within a few weeks of Labour coming to power we had the riots, obviously there was a trigger and it’s easy to conflate the 2 and a sense of there being a rise in far right rhetoric which has shown no sign of abating. My belief is the same would have happened if the tories were still in power at the time/now rather than being an anti Labour thing.

 

[stonerblue]

From the civil service world publication

The basis for determining whether the socio-economic test is met is understood to be the jobs an internship candidate’s parents had when the applicant was 14.

Feel free to provide evidence to the contrary.

Mate, i'm not in a 'competition with ou on this. Just pointing out the indicators for class.

 

[Brewster's millions]

I completely agree that's what the article says.

So, those that managed to get one of the 200 places, then go on to impress during the internship, and then decide they want to apply for a job, will be 'fast-tracked to the final stages of the Fast Stream selection process'. Given that they've almost certainly had to do the aptitude tests and initial interviews to get a place on the internship scheme, it would be a bit daft to put them back at the start and make them do all that again.

So, some of the 200, will be considered for the 1000 jobs, and will still be competing against the best of the other applicants.

I don't agree that it reduces the pool - other people won't not apply in the first place because maybe a few dozen out of 1000 jobs will go to people on this scheme (it *could* be up to 200, but that seems very unlikely). Given the publicity, and the greater access for applicants from poorer families, then it wouldn't be unreasonable to expect more of them to apply for this scheme, and the main application process, than currently apply. I'd argue that this increases the pool, rather than decreases it.

People from the "chosen subset" at the moment have a lower chance of success, so giving them an advantage in the earlier stages of the application process, doesn't make the overall quality of applicants worse.

I don't know how privileged your own life has been Brewster, but I honestly believe that this kind of process is important, and is one of the main reasons why the civil service isn't still selecting from a small pool of middle and upper class men, as was the case for many, many years. I obviously can't speak for you, but I'd hope you would agree that it's a good thing we've moved on from those times?

I posted later in this thread about some of the experience I had working with people who wanted to be barristers, and I can tell you for certain, that people who don't already have that middle class upbringing, and who don't know people doing similar jobs already, can get completely lost, rather than living up to their potential.

As for you last point - agreed, it sounds nonsensical, but assuming you're going to try something like this, you have to start somewhere. In fact some of those very clever people who previously got through the fast stream system likely wrote a huge report about why it's the best method. I don't know, but it's certainly better than asking Charlie Mullins :)

Wanted to reply to this and offer a few thoughts - I suspect we see things differently and we’re not going to agree, which is probably a good thing, but I do still see the scheme as both discriminatory and indeed patronising, so I don’t agree with it.

I suppose a lot will rest on how many of the 200 interns will ultimately be successful in their applications, but I would be surprised if the success rate wasn’t a high number given that the whole intention is to change the type of people entering the civil service. If we end up with 10-15% of successful applicants coming from one chosen demographic, and the remainder assessed purely on merit, then I can’t see how that’s a positive.

Ultimately you are introducing a factor other than merit into the selection process. Some people will see that as a necessary move, but personally I find the whole thing to be rather patronising and I wouldn’t have entertained applying for the scheme when I was younger.

I do not come from a privileged background, very far from it actually, but by the time I was finishing up my studies I knew I didn’t need any help competing with rich sorts. I quite enjoyed getting one over them, but when I got my first job the best mate I made there (and still good friend) had been to Eton and so had one of my bosses, and I never had a problem.

Actually it was very funny observing them and although I may have had to work a bit harder to get on, I don’t think I was treated that differently. It would have helped that I was in a much more meritocratic environment than the civil service, but if people had started making it easier for me because of my background I’d have walked out.

 

[Chippy_boy]

Ended long running disputes and strikes in the rail sector.
Same for NHS and Doctors Strikes although recent demands to deal with.
Took quick and decisive action to stop the Farage riots.
Launched UKs biggest prison expansion in over a decade.
Bought in legislation to nationalise the railways.
Launched GB energy act and billions in green investment.
Workers rights bill - more protection against unfair dismissal, better rights for zero hour contracts and expanded paternity leave.
Increased NHS funding by 30 billion annually- waiting lists have already decreased 5%
Began recruitment for 1000 more GPs.
Increased the minimum wage.
Launched a 113 billion infrastructure project also including AI.
Have begun recruiting 6500 extra teachers.
Rolled out ‘Best Start’ hubs - backed by 500mill to support vunreable families.
Scraped Rwanda - working with EU and Macron on Migration issue and return agreement, record deportations and arrests of illegal workers up 51%.
Committed to increase defence budget to 2.5% and strengthening UK military.
Invested significantly in housing and bought in the renters rights bill which will ban no fault evictions most significantly.
Government task force to tackle homelessness with a 1 billion funding boost.
Introduced paid civil service internship programme.
Implemented ‘Ronan’s Law’ - including ban on Ninja Swords and an amnisty for illegal blades.
Enforced the online safety act prioritising child safety.

He asked for positives. Nearly all of them aren't.

Fortunately 80% of the population would appear to agree with me and not you.

 

[Hertzblue]

Big Ange is struggling to get all those new houses going it seems..



The housing market looks under strain, if prices do start to fall in a meaningful way then she won't get anywhere near her target. I have to say though that I have seen a lot of planning applications for new developments, whether they happen is another thing.

 

[BlueHammer85]

Fortunately 80% or 90% of the population would appear to agree with me and not you.

Fine, what party in a year in government will not face the same backlash ?

this isn't me defending Labour, it's the reality of politics nowadays.

 

[Chippy_boy]

People have always slagged off the government of the day from day 1 if their party didn’t get in.

I equally agree that within a few weeks of Labour coming to power we had the riots, obviously there was a trigger and it’s easy to conflate the 2 and a sense of there being a rise in far right rhetoric which has shown no sign of abating. My belief is the same would have happened if the tories were still in power at the time/now rather than being an anti Labour thing.

I've said repeatedly that the media by and large don't make winners or losers, they just choose to back winners. They work off clicks and to a smaller extend sales, and they get more clicks and more sales if they say what the greatest numbers of people want to hear. It's as simple as that.

Labour were obviously going to win the GE, so the media largely backed them. That made sense. They like to back winners. Then they got only 20% of the voter voting for them and clearly at that point it made more sense to ditch them. And since they've fucked up so badly, in so many ways - and everyone (apart from the few rather strange individuals on here) can see it - it makes even more sense for the media to ditch them. They think Farage will win, so all the media coverage is about Farage. No shit Sherlock.

 

[metalblue]

Mate, i'm not in a 'competition with ou on this. Just pointing out the indicators for class.

I understand mate and agree we would all define working class in differing ways, but for the purposes of the civil service intern criteria it does appear to be based solely on job of your parents and what they consider working class. As Mrs MB has done a degree (as that’s what the government said nurses should have) she is no longer working class for the purposes of the civil service criteria despite growing up being 5th in line for the tin bath water! On the flip side you can have someone privately educated working in a cafe being classed as working class. It’s bonkers isn’t it?

 

[Blue and true]

I do agree that the internet gives the nut cases of this country to congregate, you don’t see the fruit loops on the street corner with their sandwich boards as often these days as the internet lets them find like minded loons. The internet gives rise to a sense of being anonymous but I’m seeing racism is more creeping in to everyday language in real life, surprisingly amongst the young as much as any other cohort.

Without wishing to trivialise racism, I don't think young people are becoming racist. The ribbing my mates and I did as adolescents, i.e jokes and "race banter" if you will doesn't really qualify as pure racism, at least in my view. We had a couple of Asian lads in our friend group and they were self-deprecating and took any light-hearted ribbing for what it was. What we see online is different, it's visceral and hateful.

Although, in this country there is a generational divide when it comes to tolerance and attitudes, at least in my opinion.

 

[stonerblue]

I've said repeatedly that the media by and large don't make winners or losers, they just choose to back winners. They work off clicks and to a smaller extend sales, and they get more clicks and more sales if they say what the greatest numbers of people want to hear. It's as simple as that.

Labour were obviously going to win the GE, so the media largely backed them. That made sense. They like to back winners. Then they got only 20% of the voter voting for them and clearly at that point it made more sense to ditch them. And since they've fucked up so badly, in so many ways - and everyone (apart from the few rather strange individuals on here) can see it - it makes even more sense for the media to ditch them. They think Farage will win, so all the media coverage is about Farage. No shit Sherlock.

Ur not winning a UK election withouit the support of The sun

 

[BlueHammer85]

I've said repeatedly that the media by and large don't make winners or losers, they just choose to back winners. They work off clicks and to a smaller extend sales, and they get more clicks and more sales if they say what the greatest numbers of people want to hear. It's as simple as that.

Labour were obviously going to win the GE, so the media largely backed them. That made sense. They like to back winners. Then they got only 20% of the voter voting for them and clearly at that point it made more sense to ditch them. And since they've fucked up so badly, in so many ways - and everyone (apart from the few rather strange individuals on here) can see it - it makes even more sense for the media to ditch them. They think Farage will win, so all the media coverage is about Farage. No shit Sherlock.

And do you have more hope in Farage to make things better ?

 

[Oldham Exile]

People have always slagged off the government of the day from day 1 if their party didn’t get in.

I equally agree that within a few weeks of Labour coming to power we had the riots, obviously there was a trigger and it’s easy to conflate the 2 and a sense of there being a rise in far right rhetoric which has shown no sign of abating. My belief is the same would have happened if the tories were still in power at the time/now rather than being an anti Labour thing.

I cannot be arsed to do a search - but I'm sure that if I could be I would not find any examples of BH85 slagging of the tories before the last election-;)

 

[mosssideblue]

And do you have more hope in Farage to make things better ?

Farage would totally ruin this country within months

 

[bluenova]

Big Ange is struggling to get all those new houses going it seems..

View attachment 164741
View attachment 164742
The housing market looks under strain, if prices do start to fall in a meaningful way then she won't get anywhere near her target. I have to say though that I have seen a lot of planning applications for new developments, whether they happen is another thing.

I was surprised when she came out so quickly after the election and upped the targets. Unless she was hugely confident, the only thing I could think of was it was a "reach for the stars and you might get to the moon" strategy, but it looks like a majorly risky target.

Not sure how much we can read into this though. The planning bill isn't even through parliament, and even if they started pushing through more planning applications from day one, the effects would be a long way off.

Ultimately, as you say, it's another one to add to the wait and see pile. Right now, I doubt anyone is confident Labour are going to do even half of what they promised, but I do wonder what ever happened to the old "turning around a tanker" thinking that we used to see a lot of in politics. None of the major pieces of legislation have gone fully through parliament yet, and most of the big changes won't be anywhere near feeding through.

 

[stonerblue]

I understand mate and agree we would all define working class in differing ways, but for the purposes of the civil service intern criteria it does appear to be based solely on job of your parents and what they consider working class. As Mrs MB has done a degree (as that’s what the government said nurses should have) she is no longer working class for the purposes of the civil service criteria despite growing up being 5th in line for the tin bath water! On the flip side you can have someone privately educated working in a cafe being classed as working class. It’s bonkers isn’t it?

It is.