Russian invasion of Ukraine

dickie davies said:
No unemployment because a million men are dead or incapacitated due to the war
Retail sales up , because retail prices have spiralled out of control

If things were all sunny and rosie in ruSSia, hitler putin wouldn't even be talking to taco
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I did laugh at the ‘unemployment is virtually non existent’ line…

In fairness to Putin, he’s papered over the cracks brilliantly with his war time economy. However interest rates at 20%, inflation close to half that figure, 1m dead working age men, and the depletion of nearly all their liquid assets in their wealth fund leaves Russia (and more importantly, its citizens), significantly worse off as a direct result of the war.
 
Manchester33 said:
I did laugh at the ‘unemployment is virtually non existent’ line…

In fairness to Putin, he’s papered over the cracks brilliantly with his war time economy. However interest rates at 20%, inflation close to half that figure, 1m dead working age men, and the depletion of nearly all their liquid assets in their wealth fund leaves Russia (and more importantly, its citizens), significantly worse off as a direct result of the war.
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And whatever the outcome here, they will still be ostracised by most of Europe for the foreseeable. And there is no way they are getting that seized money back. Those things will have a huge impact on Russia going forward. And there will be zero chance of Russia’s brain drain being reversed. Plus the returning soldiers will be a huge issue to manage. Rebuilding the stolen territory will be a huge undertaking. And I’d say their demographic challenge is the greatest of any nation.

So many issues to deal with.

It will be an ugly place to live the other side of this.
 
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Manchester33 said:
I did laugh at the ‘unemployment is virtually non existent’ line…

In fairness to Putin, he’s papered over the cracks brilliantly with his war time economy. However interest rates at 20%, inflation close to half that figure, 1m dead working age men, and the depletion of nearly all their liquid assets in their wealth fund leaves Russia (and more importantly, its citizens), significantly worse off as a direct result of the war.
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The tightening of sanctions that Trump recently announced takes place now. China and India expected to stop buying Russian oil. This will cause major disruption to Russia.
I don’t really understand how Trump squares the circle of support for Putin’s peace policy (Russia gets everything) while tightening sanctions. A collapse of the Russian economy helps Ukraine. Russian oil currently selling at 36 dollars a barrel against a Brent crude price of 64.
 
The key to successful propaganda is that those on the receiving end don't realise it.

Don't worry (insert city name) is an impregnable fortress, followed by, rumours that (insert city name) is about to fall is Russian propaganda, followed by, the fall of (insert city name) is no big deal. Rinse and repeat.

Russia has been running out of missiles for 3 years, the Russian economy has been on it's knees for 3 years, the latest weapon supplied by the west has been a game changer for 3 years.

Most on here have been living in a heavily pro Ukraine echo chamber, the trouble with that is that sooner or later reality bites.

In truth Ukraine is losing this war and is going to lose this war. Sorry to sound so harsh but someone has to say it.

The front lines look extremely bad for Ukraine at the moment, critical infrastructure is being destroyed, doubtful whether energy supplies can be maintained for the Winter, corruption scandals abound.

This is the actual backdrop to the negotiations, not some fantasy parallel universe where Ukraine can win back it's lost territories, actually it faces losing much more territory, men and equipment.

The Ukrainian economy is fucked, millions have fled, casualties likely much higher than publicly admitted, cities destroyed, families torn apart.

Easy to sit at a computer miles away from the carnage, safe in the knowledge that your loved ones aren't getting blown to pieces, and advocate for the slaughter to continue, or for some pie in the sky deal that Russia won't accept.

Ukraine has suffered enough, far too much, this needs to end.
 
Hgblue2 said:
The key to successful propaganda is that those on the receiving end don't realise it.

Don't worry (insert city name) is an impregnable fortress, followed by, rumours that (insert city name) is about to fall is Russian propaganda, followed by, the fall of (insert city name) is no big deal. Rinse and repeat.

Russia has been running out of missiles for 3 years, the Russian economy has been on it's knees for 3 years, the latest weapon supplied by the west has been a game changer for 3 years.

Most on here have been living in a heavily pro Ukraine echo chamber, the trouble with that is that sooner or later reality bites.

In truth Ukraine is losing this war and is going to lose this war. Sorry to sound so harsh but someone has to say it.

The front lines look extremely bad for Ukraine at the moment, critical infrastructure is being destroyed, doubtful whether energy supplies can be maintained for the Winter, corruption scandals abound.

This is the actual backdrop to the negotiations, not some fantasy parallel universe where Ukraine can win back it's lost territories, actually it faces losing much more territory, men and equipment.

The Ukrainian economy is fucked, millions have fled, casualties likely much higher than publicly admitted, cities destroyed, families torn apart.

Easy to sit at a computer miles away from the carnage, safe in the knowledge that your loved ones aren't getting blown to pieces, and advocate for the slaughter to continue, or for some pie in the sky deal that Russia won't accept.

Ukraine has suffered enough, far too much, this needs to end.
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Thanks for that Donald
 
Hgblue2 said:
The key to successful propaganda is that those on the receiving end don't realise it.
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That is fucking hilarious coming from you.
Hgblue2 said:
Don't worry (insert city name) is an impregnable fortress, followed by, rumours that (insert city name) is about to fall is Russian propaganda, followed by, the fall of (insert city name) is no big deal. Rinse and repeat.
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When was the last great success for the russian army Advika? How many men have they lost trying to capture Pokrovsk and it is still not captured yet.

Hgblue2 said:
Russia has been running out of missiles for 3 years, the Russian economy has been on it's knees for 3 years, the latest weapon supplied by the west has been a game changer for 3 years.
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Ah yes I'm sure russia planned for their refineries to get fucked, their nuclear bombers to be destroyed and forced to retreat to the other side of russia. So many businesses are defaulting on their loans and going under, it's a slow burn but putin needs this war over just as much as Ukraine but with support Ukraine can outlast the russian economy which is why Trump is desperate to help putin out before it is too late.
Hgblue2 said:
Most on here have been living in a heavily pro Ukraine echo chamber, the trouble with that is that sooner or later reality bites.

In truth Ukraine is losing this war and is going to lose this war. Sorry to sound so harsh but someone has to say it.
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Are they? Says who?
Hgblue2 said:
The front lines look extremely bad for Ukraine at the moment, critical infrastructure is being destroyed, doubtful whether energy supplies can be maintained for the Winter, corruption scandals abound.
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Corruption is a funny thing everyone seems to concentrate of Ukraines but never the US or Russia, the frontlines have been pretty static for a long time now what are you on about.
Hgblue2 said:
This is the actual backdrop to the negotiations, not some fantasy parallel universe where Ukraine can win back it's lost territories, actually it faces losing much more territory, men and equipment.
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The past 4 years says otherwise, just desperation from Trump and russia to try and force Ukraine into a bad deal.
Hgblue2 said:
The Ukrainian economy is fucked, millions have fled, casualties likely much higher than publicly admitted, cities destroyed, families torn apart.

Easy to sit at a computer miles away from the carnage, safe in the knowledge that your loved ones aren't getting blown to pieces, and advocate for the slaughter to continue, or for some pie in the sky deal that Russia won't accept.

Ukraine has suffered enough, far too much, this needs to end.
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Tbf Hg you're a rat who comes by posting your pro russian dirge, then slinks off for weeks or months at a time. You talk about sitting behind computers but its the only thing stopping you getting a smack.
 
Hgblue2 said:
The key to successful propaganda is that those on the receiving end don't realise it.

Don't worry (insert city name) is an impregnable fortress, followed by, rumours that (insert city name) is about to fall is Russian propaganda, followed by, the fall of (insert city name) is no big deal. Rinse and repeat.

Russia has been running out of missiles for 3 years, the Russian economy has been on it's knees for 3 years, the latest weapon supplied by the west has been a game changer for 3 years.

Most on here have been living in a heavily pro Ukraine echo chamber, the trouble with that is that sooner or later reality bites.

In truth Ukraine is losing this war and is going to lose this war. Sorry to sound so harsh but someone has to say it.

The front lines look extremely bad for Ukraine at the moment, critical infrastructure is being destroyed, doubtful whether energy supplies can be maintained for the Winter, corruption scandals abound.

This is the actual backdrop to the negotiations, not some fantasy parallel universe where Ukraine can win back it's lost territories, actually it faces losing much more territory, men and equipment.

The Ukrainian economy is fucked, millions have fled, casualties likely much higher than publicly admitted, cities destroyed, families torn apart.

Easy to sit at a computer miles away from the carnage, safe in the knowledge that your loved ones aren't getting blown to pieces, and advocate for the slaughter to continue, or for some pie in the sky deal that Russia won't accept.

Ukraine has suffered enough, far too much, this needs to end.
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Same here. It was, is, a bit of a pipe dream to think Ukraine could beat the superpower on their doorstep.

Shit I know but people dying for a mostly lost cause is so wasteful of life.

I too am fed up of news and social media feeds proclaiming Russia to be in their knees. Its western clickbait bullshit mainly.
 
Gorton_Tubster said:
Same here. It was, is, a bit of a pipe dream to think Ukraine could beat the superpower on their doorstep.

Shit I know but people dying for a mostly lost cause is so wasteful of life.

I too am fed up of news and social media feeds proclaiming Russia to be in their knees. Its western clickbait bullshit mainly.
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What’s your solution, then?
 
Gorton_Tubster said:
Same here. It was, is, a bit of a pipe dream to think Ukraine could beat the superpower on their doorstep.
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Yet they have been, destroyed a navy without having their own. Forced russia to depend on north korea for ammunition and to help them take back Kursk. Depleted all their Soviet stocks, now struggle to have an artillery advantage. russia have been broken in Ukraine you have to be a thick **** to not realise that.
Gorton_Tubster said:
Shit I know but people dying for a mostly lost cause is so wasteful of life.
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Fighting for the survival of your nation isn't a lost cause, or were our soldiers in ww2 fighting a lost cause as they evacuated at Dunkirk against a greater foe? And ultimately it is up to Ukrainians to decide what is a lost cause not you or I. If they want peace on the terms offered then who am I to judge I'm not the one sat underground most nights praying my home is still in one piece.
Gorton_Tubster said:
I too am fed up of news and social media feeds proclaiming Russia to be in their knees. Its western clickbait bullshit mainly.
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Only because you're clueless to how it all works.
 
Republicans aren't too happy - but we shall see if their push comes to anything. It hasn't in the past.

www.dailykos.com

House Discharge Vote on Russian Sanctions?

Haven’t seen anything on this story about a potential House discharge petition regarding a large increase in Russian sanctions being pushed by Rep Brian Fitzpatrick from PA. Apparently there is a very good chance it will pass and the Senate will...
www.dailykos.com
 
Hgblue2 said:
The ones that spring to my mind are Mariupol, Bakhmut and Avdiivka.
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They are all events of some antiquity and I don’t recall anyone saying Mariupol was an impregnable fortress. The zeitgeist at the time that Mariupol was under threat from most quarters was that Russia was an irresistible force.
 
Elbow beards said:
Let him keep the bits he's nicked, no, let him have the whole of Ukraine as long as he writes on a post it note that he promises to not invade another country, cross his heart hope to die.
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Your lighthearted post actually makes the key point perfectly. I’m yet to hear a sensible solution where the fighting stops that doesn’t involve European NATO forces having to be deployed in the aftermath. It’s truly astonishing to me how anyone can think that Russia is going to stop being cunts when this phase is over.

I think (as I have for some time) that Ukraine will have to concede territory, because that reflects reality on the ground, but the notion of Ukraine not being able to defend itself (and be assisted in so doing) against future Russian aggression is nothing short of reprehensible.
 
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