Rony Lopes

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JoeMercer'sWay said:
true, he was awful and directly culpable for at least their first goal though. It's not worse, a fuck-up is a fuck-up, there's just a perceived higher risk through an undoubted lack of experience.
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He is a right sided cb playing at left back. If things go pear shaped for Liverpool, it's not surprising if he struggles.
 
Neville Kneville said:
No, but we see it from everybody depending on the circumstances, not just kids. It will be interesting to see just how mistake free Otamendi is when he starts playing in this league.
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well yes, but there's an established view that experienced pros are less likely to make mistakes, and are more consistent, hence why they get paid for. Gomez has the chance to bounce back, it's a learning curve for him, but if we want to win the title, then we can't really afford performances like Liverpool's, hence why we invest more and have a stronger first team of established pros, hence why we don't have a Gomez filling in, looking promising but also inconsistent.
 
JoeMercer'sWay said:
well yes, but there's an established view that experienced pros are less likely to make mistakes, and are more consistent, hence why they get paid for. Gomez has the chance to bounce back, it's a learning curve for him, but if we want to win the title, then we can't really afford performances like Liverpool's, hence why we invest more and have a stronger first team of established pros, hence why we don't have a Gomez filling in, looking promising but also inconsistent.
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Well that's what I'm talking about. We had a whole bunch of people dropping bollocks left right & centre last season & now Gomez has one iffy game alongside everyone else for Liverpool, he is labelled as a weak link & inconsitent, even though he hasn't even had chance to be be inconsistent.

Because he is a kid. Whereas Lovgren is shite every week, but cost more & is older.
 
Neville Kneville said:
Well that's what I'm talking about. We had a whole bunch of people dropping bollocks left right & centre last season & now Gomez has one iffy game alongside everyone else for Liverpool, he is labelled as a weak link & inconsitent, even though he hasn't even had chance to be be inconsistent.

Because he is a kid. Whereas Lovgren is shite every week, but cost more & is older.
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No, he had a bad game, where he previously had good games, inconsistent. Lovren is evidently doing poorly, but I'm not blaming Gomez for the world ending here, just pointing out after his praise last week that he did poorly, and that we shouldn't get carried away in either positivity or negativity. The fact Liverpool have an underperforming CB, and a kid CB at LB, shows how poorly they're run and managed and why they're not currently on a level like a club like us, who have a proper first team but are more cautious about youth prospects, because of the ambitions we have and the risks associated with them.
 
JoeMercer'sWay said:
No, he had a bad game, where he previously had good games, inconsistent. Lovren is evidently doing poorly, but I'm not blaming Gomez for the world ending here, just pointing out after his praise last week that he did poorly, and that we shouldn't get carried away in either positivity or negativity. The fact Liverpool have an underperforming CB, and a kid CB at LB, shows how poorly they're run and managed and why they're not currently on a level like a club like us, who have a proper first team but are more cautious about youth prospects, because of the ambitions we have and the risks associated with them.
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I think we're cautious because the manager looking after his own arse, no other reason.
 
squirtyflower said:
there you go again with the hyperbole aimed at the manager, it's ridiculous
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Oh please just sod off with that crap ffs. I absolutely fucking refuse to have peope start putting me in that catagory & will not sit here & accept it, so all my posts becone tarred with that fucking shite. Enough.

I think Pellegrini is the best manager we've ever had & he pisses on Mancini etc

And so far, he is utter shite with bringing through kids etc. The two have no connection.

Stop it.
 
I think it's impossible and wrong to solely blame Pellegrini for not playing youth players.

As head coach working under a DoF model, his job is to make the most out of the resources he is given. He would be out the door in a flash of he constantly played Lopes, just because he is club trained, at the expense of Sterling and KDB and results went against us.

Likewise, if Txiki believed that Denayer and Lopes could take us to the next level, we would not have signed Otamendi and KDB.

Unfortunately for a youth players, when ever we sign a top class player it pushes them further down the pecking order. However, the fact we won nothing last season suggests we needed to add top quality, something we have done.

It's funny how Khaldoon talks about a holistic approach and collective responsibility but as fans we still look for individual scapegoats.
 
daztrueblue91 said:
I think it's impossible and wrong to solely blame Pellegrini for not playing youth players.

As head coach working under a DoF model, his job is to make the most out of the resources he is given. He would be out the door in a flash of he constantly played Lopes, just because he is club trained, at the expense of Sterling and KDB and results went against us.

Likewise, if Txiki believed that Denayer and Lopes could take us to the next level, we would not have signed Otamendi and KDB.

Unfortunately for a youth players, when ever we sign a top class player it pushes them further down the pecking order. However, the fact we won nothing last season suggests we needed to add top quality, something we have done.

It's funny how Khaldoon talks about a holistic approach and collective responsibility but as fans we still look for individual scapegoats.
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Again this bollocks about 'constantly playing' kids. Don't think one single person has ever asked for anything more than a very gradual , cautious introduction.
It was also stated that the first team manager would be the one who decides on first team affairs & not subject to orders re that.
 
Neville Kneville said:
Again this bollocks about 'constantly playing' kids. Don't think one single person has ever asked for anything more than a very gradual , cautious introduction.
It was also stated that the first team manager would be the one who decides on first team affairs & not subject to orders re that.
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Which is exactly what Pellegrini did with Kelechi yesterday.

Your the one who seems annoyed at the club signing top class players.
 
It will probably take a couple more City managers before you can say that any EDS player has a realistic chance of making into the first team.
 
ColinLee said:
I think you're simplifying things too much with Lopes. Yes he looked fantastic in the youth teams against other youth usually older than him and he tended to look the best player at Lille (although if you've watched them you'll know that the bar is set low there). He may yet turn out to be absolutely world class since he's still only 19 unbelievably.
By all accounts he refused to sign a new contract as is his right so with just 12 months left on it City have done the right thing for the club and for Lopes.

He is not good enough right now to take anyone's place in the 1st team squad (let alone the 1st eleven). If he was they'd have kept him and sold someone else, despite claims from some the club are not stupid.

Rather than a kick in the bollocks I'm hopeful that the other kids will use this as a spur to kick on, they're with the coaches every day, they know the requirements.

We all want youth players coming through for the 1st team but I have absolute faith in the club hierarchy that they'll do it when it's right for the club and player both. Yes they'll make an error now and again since there's no magic formula to foresee what a player will be like even 12 months down the line, would Chelsea have still sold De Bruyne if they had a crystal ball?
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My views seem to chime with yours on this. Their is no doubt that everybody, from the clubs hierarchy down to the fans, would like to see academy graduates playing regularly in the first team. No problem with that, it,s a no brainer. It adds to the prestige of the club, it saves us squillions and it deepens the squad. Whats not to like. The problem, I feel, is with timelines and the perception of the where players are in their development. Obviously the player is going to be eager to play for the first team and in his own opinion he may think he is ready to do that. The club may not necessarily agree. That does not mean they will not feel the same way in 12 months time. The question is, is the player willing to wait that long and trust the club to do the right thing by him. These days they will usually they will have an agent whispering in his ear. An agent who will be more interested in making a quick buck for himself rather than be interested in the long term development of the player. The club cannot be expected to pander to the needs and expectations of players while ignoring the long and short term needs of the club as a whole. I think the attitude of the club will be that if a player is prepared to wait until the club thinks he is ready then the club will give him a chance. However if a player thinks that he is ready and can't be waiting around for City, then i think the club is more than happy to let him move on at the right price. What is quite clear is that the club will not let players and their agents bounce them in to making decisions they feel are not right for the team and the club.
 
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