Attacks in Paris

Blue Haze said:
They've discovered that two were refugees. European leaders are reluctant to confirm it until the story dies down because so many of them were balls deep in supporting the open door policy for refugees.
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That's not yet proven though, the Egyptian passport they found has been confirmed as one of the injured victims not from one of the bombers and the Syrian Passport has gone throught 4 countries before arriving in france leaving it open to have been sold on the black market, stolen or a forgery. Some anylists in counter terrorism have also questioned why a suicide bomber would bring a passport with him. As I just posted they now believe this was planned in Belgium by 2 living there for a while and another and had accomplacies in france, maybe it was the guy who come through greece, but it's still too early to tell and I doubt he was the ringleader.
 
Blue Haze said:
They've discovered that two were refugees. European leaders are reluctant to confirm it until the story dies down because so many of them were balls deep in supporting the open door policy for refugees.
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As far as I can see, all they actually know is that at least two of the attackers were from France and that a passport belonging to someone who appears to have been a refugee has been found at the scene, on one of the dead attackers. There's nothing to link that document to the body as of yet or even that it's a genuine document. And even if some were refugees, criminals, terrorists and intelligence agents travel on false documents all the time so this is hardly a new feature brought on by the refugee crisis.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
As far as I can see, all they actually know is that at least two of the attackers were from France and that a passport belonging to someone who appears to have been a refugee has been found at the scene, on one of the dead attackers. There's nothing to link that document to the body as of yet or even that it's a genuine document. And even if some were refugees, criminals, terrorists and intelligence agents travel on false documents all the time so this is hardly a new feature brought on by the refugee crisis.
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It's besides the point really, at the end of the day.

We know that there'll be IS fighters and sympathisers among those millions of refugees/migrants making the trip to the EU this year alone, on the basis of simple mathematical probability.

It is utterly absurd to have little to no border controls in place as millions of people travel to the EU from a region that is a breeding ground for ideologies like IS.

It's insanity.

They have openly stated that they were sending fighters to the EU via these vast migrations of people.

It is not a sustainable or rational policy, and it has to change.
 
They quickly need to find out how many got away. They are looking for one man who was at the scene but they admitted more could have fled with him. These people went out on Friday night expecting to die, they will want to go out in a blaze of glory elsewhere. As the net tightens I expect him and his accomplices to lash out. That Coulibaly during the attack in January re emerged later in the day attacking the Jewish supermarket after he had killed the police women in the morning.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
As far as I can see, all they actually know is that at least two of the attackers were from France and that a passport belonging to someone who appears to have been a refugee has been found at the scene, on one of the dead attackers. There's nothing to link that document to the body as of yet or even that it's a genuine document. And even if some were refugees, criminals, terrorists and intelligence agents travel on false documents all the time so this is hardly a new feature brought on by the refugee crisis.
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This story is the work of European media, and the Greek government imho, the media want to hype it up further for their own political agenda's, and the Greeks certainly want to hype it up so that the rest of Europe come and help them, with the tide of refugees.

The terrorists picked a significant date, Friday 13th, in a major European City, and then targeted 3 things they are absolutely dead against, Sport, Music, and drink/food entertainment, to be done on their own 'Sabbath'.

None of that is coincidence, it was very carefully planned, probably over months, clearly from Belgium. That planning wouldn't include "hoping" one of the bombers made it in time, across a sea, probably in a shitty boat, many of which sink on route, and could be intercepted by a European naval force trying to protect the refugees and European borders, to a small island, from which escape is purely in the hands of the Greeks, then after processing passing through multiple other borders, avoiding contact with any further authorities. On top of all that, at about the time they allegedly entered Greece, was the time many countries started putting up razor wire to stop movement, or at least make it much more difficult. Quite far fetched for an organisation who we're constantly being told plan quite in quite sophisticated manner these days.

If you were planning a major terrorist outrage in a major European capital, why would you risk this method of getting a bomber to its target ? It makes absolutely no sense, to an operation that must have been months and months in the planning.
 
RichardDunneOwnGoal said:
It's besides the point really, at the end of the day.

We know that there'll be IS fighters and sympathisers among those millions of refugees/migrants making the trip to the EU this year alone, on the basis of simple mathematical probability.

It is utterly absurd to have little to no border controls in place as millions of people travel to the EU from a region that is a breeding ground for ideologies like IS.

It's insanity.

They have openly stated that they were sending fighters to the EU via these vast migrations of people.

It is not a sustainable or rational policy, and it has to change.
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It may already be too late there could be dozens of trained terror cells already in the EU. It was crazy to allow these refugees into Europe unchecked the German government have a lot to answer for. Merkel should be brought to book for her Cavalier attitude to Border Safety.
 
cleavers said:
This story is the work of European media, and the Greek government imho, the media want to hype it up further for their own political agenda's, and the Greeks certainly want to hype it up so that the rest of Europe come and help them, with the tide of refugees.

The terrorists picked a significant date, Friday 13th, in a major European City, and then targeted 3 things they are absolutely dead against, Sport, Music, and drink/food entertainment, to be done on their own 'Sabbath'.

None of that is coincidence, it was very carefully planned, probably over months, clearly from Belgium. That planning wouldn't include "hoping" one of the bombers made it in time, across a sea, probably in a shitty boat, many of which sink on route, and could be intercepted by a European naval force trying to protect the refugees and European borders, to a small island, from which escape is purely in the hands of the Greeks, then after processing passing through multiple other borders, avoiding contact with any further authorities. On top of all that, at about the time they allegedly entered Greece, was the time many countries started putting up razor wire to stop movement, or at least make it much more difficult. Quite far fetched for an organisation who we're constantly being told plan quite sophistically these days.

If you were planning a major terrorist outrage in a major European capital, why would you risk this method of getting a bomber to its target ? It makes absolutely no sense, to an operation that must have been months and months in the planning.
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Mate, there's no way of knowing what their plan did or didn't include, you're speculating.

Migration from Syria into the EU has been ongoing for years as well, there's no reason why any potential fighter from Syria/Iraq couldn't have been in the EU for long enough to take part in a planned attack with homegrown cell of EU lunatics. Perfectly plausible.
 
whp.blue said:
It may already be too late there could be dozens of trained terror cells already in the EU. It was crazy to allow these refugees into Europe unchecked the German government have a lot to answer for. Merkel should be brought to book for her Cavalier attitude to Border Safety.
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It's absolutely certain that there will be such people in the EU right now from said open border policy from Merkel. Just a question of how many.

Hopefully the security services will intercept them before they commit any further atrocities on European soil.
 
RichardDunneOwnGoal said:
It's besides the point really, at the end of the day.

We know that there'll be IS fighters and sympathisers among those millions of refugees/migrants making the trip to the EU this year alone, on the basis of simple mathematical probability.

It is utterly absurd to have little to no border controls in place as millions of people travel to the EU from a region that is a breeding ground for ideologies like IS.

It's insanity.

They have openly stated that they were sending fighters to the EU via these vast migrations of people.

It is not a sustainable or rational policy, and it has to change.
Click to expand...
You seem to make a habit of sneeringly dismissing any points that challenge your somewhat pompous and opinionated views and forcing those same views on the rest of us.

It's not beside the point at all but is a completely different point to the one you're making. Even if everything was hunky-dory in Syria, terrorists with false documents could legally enter Europe. Or illegally enter if necessary. There are some border controls in place around EU borders and genuine refugees are being processed. But there are many who are being smuggled in and no amount of border controls can prevent that.
 
cleavers said:
This story is the work of European media, and the Greek government imho, the media want to hype it up further for their own political agenda's, and the Greeks certainly want to hype it up so that the rest of Europe come and help them, with the tide of refugees.

The terrorists picked a significant date, Friday 13th, in a major European City, and then targeted 3 things they are absolutely dead against, Sport, Music, and drink/food entertainment, to be done on their own 'Sabbath'.

None of that is coincidence, it was very carefully planned, probably over months, clearly from Belgium. That planning wouldn't include "hoping" one of the bombers made it in time, across a sea, probably in a shitty boat, many of which sink on route, and could be intercepted by a European naval force trying to protect the refugees and European borders, to a small island, from which escape is purely in the hands of the Greeks, then after processing passing through multiple other borders, avoiding contact with any further authorities. On top of all that, at about the time they allegedly entered Greece, was the time many countries started putting up razor wire to stop movement, or at least make it much more difficult. Quite far fetched for an organisation who we're constantly being told plan quite in quite sophisticated manner these days.

If you were planning a major terrorist outrage in a major European capital, why would you risk this method of getting a bomber to its target ? It makes absolutely no sense, to an operation that must have been months and months in the planning.
Click to expand...

Stop burying your head in the sand.

I agree with you that this was months in the planning but it didn't hinge on one of the attackers making it to Europe from Syria. If he did get caught up they would have continued without him. This guy may not have been in contact with any of these people until he got here and sought one of the terror cells, in that respect he would be a lone wolf. I honestly don't think the refugee attacker was integral to the plan just an extra dimension that presented itself to the organisers.
 
RichardDunneOwnGoal said:
Mate, there's no way of knowing what their plan did or didn't include, you're speculating.

Migration from Syria into the EU has been ongoing for years as well, there's no reason why any potential fighter from Syria/Iraq couldn't have been in the EU for long enough to take part in a planned attack with homegrown cell of EU lunatics. Perfectly plausible.
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Of course he's speculating, he wasn't there. His logic however is flawless.
 
daesh is an Arabic word in its own right (rather than an acronym)meaning 'a group of bigots who impose their will on others' That it can be 'differently conjugated' to mean either the phrase above or 'to trample and crush' That one of the words in the acronym also means 'to trample or crush'
 
Benarbia_is_god said:
Stop burying your head in the sand.

I agree with you that this was months in the planning but it didn't hinge on one of the attackers making it to Europe from Syria. If he did get caught up they would have continued without him. This guy may not have been in contact with any of these people until he got here and sought one of the terror cells, in that respect he would be a lone wolf. I honestly don't think the refugee attacker was integral to the plan just an extra dimension that presented itself to the organisers.
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You're actually agreeing with him as far as I can see. Cleavers is saying that this attack was largely home-grown and the fact it might or might not have included recent refugees is neither here nor there.
 
Benarbia_is_god said:
I agree with you that this was months in the planning but it didn't hinge on one of the attackers making it to Europe from Syria.
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Of course it didn't, precisely what I said. The passport is a complete red herring imho, whoever planned this wanted it found, to add extra terror to the whole thing, quite a simple thing to do I would think.

Do you seriously think this "lone wolf" turned up and knocked on a few doors in Brussels, in the hope there was an op he could join ?
 
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