EU referendum

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

508 pages and a couple of inners are still trying to convince normal folk that uncontrolled immigration is good and a reason to vote in.

508 pages and the outers are still trying to convince themselves that uncontrolled immigration is to blame for everything thats wrong in their lives

same as it ever was

Imigration is such a complex issue and the EU debate is going nowhere near the fundemental issues. There is a vague notion that once out we can pull up the drawbridge over the channel and the problem goes away. That is pure fantasy.

 

[AlgarveBlu]

70% in you mean, its 70% that want Mourinho out

Yes that should read 70% in! Mourinho is another reason we should leave the eu - bloody immigrant!

 

[blueonblue]

So you think you want to remain in ?, but "In" what exactly is a question that should trouble anyone but the hard of thinking.

Slovakia, alongside Poland and Hungary are being threatened with €250,000 fines per migrant they refuse to re-home from the European Union, now its a fair assumption that these governments are doing so because of their populations objections, its the job of any government to carry out the will of the people in a democracy after all.

The EU is threatening to penalize these countries for being democratic, so what happens next, its not likely that these countries will pay up willingly or accept something the population does want so will that mean they will be expelled from the EU, or sanctioned until they say F*ck it and go their own way.

So what are you going to remain "In" if its already near breaking point ?

You may vote how you want, but the reason you have that vote is because generation have fought and in many cases died for it, you live in a country that despite its many faults is still a free country where you have the right to hold whatever beliefs you choose, but you also have the responsibility to maker sure the generations that come after you have those same rights.

 

[grunge]

This has been popping up in facebook recently and seems quite accurate

 

[Allnightlong]

This has been popping up in facebook recently and seems quite accurate

But you could leave and find yourself in a better place......

 

[manctheknife]

Or...let's get the fuck out of here, happy hours over, they're tripling the price of beer and someone's just been glassed'

 

[grunge]

Talk about missing the point. There is no ( not that they are telling us) plan if we leave!. without that plan people voting on an exit have no clue what they are voting for.

 

[Pino]

The dangers of becoming a prisoner in an insular, backward looking fortress europe.
www.brexitthemovie.com

 

[EalingBlue2]

But you could leave and find yourself in a better place......

If you had a plan and somewhere to go that wanted you then yes that's true

 

[adrian99]

Imigration is such a complex issue and the EU debate is going nowhere near the fundemental issues. There is a vague notion that once out we can pull up the drawbridge over the channel and the problem goes away. That is pure fantasy.

Immigration from the EU would go away because EU citizens post Brexit could no longer walk in and work or look for a job. A points based system would identify those we need from those we don't, how many Eastern European car washers/waiters do we need? If we do need immigrants we should be offering the best of the best the opportunity to come here, the next Aguero's and De Bruyne's not 333,000 pub players as is the case today. The aim should be to reduce the number of immigrants to the lowest possible number and concentrate on training people already here to do the jobs we need, training more nurses and doctors would be a logical start when we only have 20,000 nurses training places and 80,000 kids wanting to train. It is lazy and too convenient to simply claim the NHS would collapse without immigrants when we do not provide the opportunities for enough British kids to train and take up these jobs. There is no reason immigration numbers can not return to 30 to 50,000 that they were pre 1997 and bring in people as we need them, it just takes political will, a desire to do it and to stand against big business and bosses who want a never ending supply of cheap unskilled immigrant workers. Less immigration and greater employment levels here will raise wages its simple supply and demand.

 

[EalingBlue2]

Immigration from the EU would go away because EU citizens post Brexit could no longer walk in and work or look for a job. A points based system would identify those we need from those we don't, how many Eastern European car washers/waiters do we need? If we do need immigrants we should be offering the best of the best the opportunity to come here, the next Aguero's and De Bruyne's not 333,000 pub players as is the case today. The aim should be to reduce the number of immigrants to the lowest possible number and concentrate on training people already here to do the jobs we need, training more nurses and doctors would be a logical start when we only have 20,000 nurses training places and 80,000 kids wanting to train. It is lazy and too convenient to simply claim the NHS would collapse without immigrants when we do not provide the opportunities for enough British kids to train and take up these jobs. There is no reason immigration numbers can not return to 30 to 50,000 that they were pre 1997 and bring in people as we need them, it just takes political will, a desire to do it and to stand against big business and bosses who want a never ending supply of cheap unskilled immigrant workers. Less immigration and greater employment levels here will raise wages its simple supply and demand.

They would be able to walk in because if we want a trade deal with Europe we will have to accept free movement of labour. If we want an economic disaster we could go it alone and trade with Europe on worse terms than anyone else and not have free movement of labour. On top of that if we did go that way then Europe would happily usher refugees through to go to the UK as there would be no incentive at all to stop immigration. What you wrote is the Brexit pipe dream but there is more chance of rainbow leprechauns dancing on dodos backs whilst handing out pounds on Teddington high street.

Unless that is the aim of such a policy is reducing standards of living and reducing GDP, what makes you think In a global free market that the cream of the crop would go to a country with declining infrastructure, education and high taxes?

 

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

Immigration from the EU would go away because EU citizens post Brexit could no longer walk in and work or look for a job. A points based system would identify those we need from those we don't, how many Eastern European car washers/waiters do we need? If we do need immigrants we should be offering the best of the best the opportunity to come here, the next Aguero's and De Bruyne's not 333,000 pub players as is the case today. The aim should be to reduce the number of immigrants to the lowest possible number and concentrate on training people already here to do the jobs we need, training more nurses and doctors would be a logical start when we only have 20,000 nurses training places and 80,000 kids wanting to train. It is lazy and too convenient to simply claim the NHS would collapse without immigrants when we do not provide the opportunities for enough British kids to train and take up these jobs. There is no reason immigration numbers can not return to 30 to 50,000 that they were pre 1997 and bring in people as we need them, it just takes political will, a desire to do it and to stand against big business and bosses who want a never ending supply of cheap unskilled immigrant workers. Less immigration and greater employment levels here will raise wages its simple supply and demand.

Immigration from the EU is less than half of the net figure! And then on top of that you acknowledge that we need some of these people so we would have a points system! So leaving does not actually do a massive amount for imigration just a few car washers less! Is that worth screwing up the whole economy for?

 

[blueonblue]

You constantly bang on about "If WE want a trade deal with Europe we HAVE to accept" when nothing could be further from the truth, within the EU we have to accept their conditions, once out we make our own an if they choose not to trade ( Highly f*cking unlikely) then fine because there is a big world out there we have managed to trade with for the best part of nine hundred years.

Europe ushering refugees ( Financial migrants) through to go to the UK is one of your more poorly thought out scare fairy stories, we live on an Island where with the political will we can secure our borders, you think the likes of France want to risk being stuck with them when they can not get in ?

 

[Helmet Cole]

Immigration from the EU is less than half of the net figure! And then on top of that you acknowledge that we need some of these people so we would have a points system! So leaving does not actually do a massive amount for imigration just a few car washers less! Is that worth screwing up the whole economy for?

Racist.

 

[Blue Hefner]

They would be able to walk in because if we want a trade deal with Europe we will have to accept free movement of labour. If we want an economic disaster we could go it alone and trade with Europe on worse terms than anyone else and not have free movement of labour. On top of that if we did go that way then Europe would happily usher refugees through to go to the UK as there would be no incentive at all to stop immigration. What you wrote is the Brexit pipe dream but there is more chance of rainbow leprechauns dancing on dodos backs whilst handing out pounds on Teddington high street.

Unless that is the aim of such a policy is reducing standards of living and reducing GDP, what makes you think In a global free market that the cream of the crop would go to a country with declining infrastructure, education and high taxes?

Would we?

 

[Blue Hefner]

Vince Cable made an interesting point re net immigration figures. His point was that this does not show necessarily how many more or less people are coming in if the rate of people leaving slows down/stops

 

[smudgedj]

This has been popping up in facebook recently and seems quite accurate

No point staying somewhere that´s shit. Especially when there´s a whole world out there.
Unless you´re saying that the eu is that spiteful and vindictive they would punish us. In which case why would you want to be a member of such an organisation.

 

[PragueBlue]

Talk about missing the point. There is no ( not that they are telling us) plan if we leave!. without that plan people voting on an exit have no clue what they are voting for.

Is there much more of a plan for staying? Do we know what a future in the EU really holds? Would we adopt the euro and fully integrate within the EU or stay on the fringes as at present?

Personally I think there's as much uncertainty about staying in as leaving.

 

[laserblue]

You constantly bang on about "If WE want a trade deal with Europe we HAVE to accept" when nothing could be further from the truth, within the EU we have to accept their conditions, once out we make our own an if they choose not to trade ( Highly f*cking unlikely) then fine because there is a big world out there we have managed to trade with for the best part of nine hundred years.

Europe ushering refugees ( Financial migrants) through to go to the UK is one of your more poorly thought out scare fairy stories, we live on an Island where with the political will we can secure our borders, you think the likes of France want to risk being stuck with them when they can not get in ?

Get real. Nearly half of our export trade is with the EU and without a trade deal our exports will be subject to tariffs making them more expensive at point of use in the EU. If there are other ready markets out there that we can steam into to take up the slack why aren't we already doing this? Some are talking about the glorious opportunities in Commonwealth markets but Commonwealth Preference Tariffs were scrapped decades ago so that argument is even more redundant than it was 40 years ago when others with a similarly tenuous grip on reality were putting it forward during the 1975 Common Market referendum.

As for your argumment about the effects of Brexit on immigration, below is part of my post from yesterday.

"....., the situation in the 'Jungle' in Calais is that, as part of cross border co-operation within the EU, the French authorities are committed to do their best to prevent these people (and any others) from illegal access to the UK. There is also a British police presence in Calais to monitor the situation and co-operate with the French. Calais is therefore effectively our border. If we leave the EU the French police will wash their hands of the migrant issue in Calais and no longer prevent anyone from attempting to enter the UK illegally as it would no longer be either their problem or their responsibility. The British police contingent would also have to be withdrawn. This would mean open season for illegal migrants and the couple of recent instances of boats full of them caught crossing the Channel would increase exponentially and northern France would become a magnet for many more migrants trying to enter the UK illegally."

 

[sir baconface]

Slovakia, alongside Poland and Hungary are being threatened with €250,000 fines per migrant they refuse to re-home from the European Union, now its a fair assumption that these governments are doing so because of their populations objections, its the job of any government to carry out the will of the people in a democracy after all.

The EU is threatening to penalize these countries for being democratic, so what happens next, its not likely that these countries will pay up willingly or accept something the population does want so will that mean they will be expelled from the EU, or sanctioned until they say F*ck it and go their own way.

Probably the same as when the French break the rules: sweep it under the carpet rather than give it the oxygen of publicity. What ever happened to them when they set sheep on fire and banned British beef? Fcuk all, that's what.

EU politicos are probably the most adept in the world at being mealy-mouthed and self-serving. And no wonder; it's such a good number. We engage in austerity here to bring UK finances under control. In Europe they just carry on funding gold-plated super-pensions and a ridiculously wasteful bureaucracy.