EU referendum

[laserblue]

Hash smuggling doesn't count...

Busted! ;)

 

[KenTheLandlord]

"In Russia live Russians. Any minority, from anywhere, if it wants to live in Russia, to work and eat in Russia, should speak Russian, and should respect the Russian laws. If they prefer Sharia Law, and live the life of Muslims then we advise them to go to those places where that's the state law. Russia does not need Muslim minorities. Minorities need Russia, and we will not grant them special privileges, or try to change our laws to fit their desires, no matter how loud they yell 'discrimination'. We will not tolerate disrespect of our Russian culture. We had better learn from the suicides of America, England, Holland and France, if we are to survive as a nation. The Muslims are taking over those countries and they will not take over Russia. The Russian customs and traditions are not compatible with the lack of culture or the primitive ways of Sharia Law and Muslims. When this honorable legislative body thinks of creating new laws, it should have in mind the Russian national interest first, observing that the Muslim minorities are not Russians.

How very dare a leader speak up for his own country like that...

It is made up, he never said that.

 

[sir baconface]

How anyone can support a campaign fronted by buffoons like Johnson, Gove or Farage I'll never know.

Which buffoons should we be supporting then?

 

[sir baconface]

Martin Schulz was voted as president of the EU by a vote of all MEPs, in a similar way that the Speaker of the House of Commons is elected by MPs in the UK parliament. In Schiulz case, he was elected to the EU Parlaiment by the voters of a constituency in Germany , the same way any other MEP is elected and therfore has a mandate from the people and has the right to vote, in the same way as an MP can vote in the UK.

Jean-Claude Juncker is also voted for by MEPs in the European Parliament, but since there is no necessity for the President of the European Commission to be an elected MEP, i.e elected by a popular vote, he has no voting rights himself.

Donald Tusk was chosen by the political leaders of the member nations of the EU. As with Juncker, there is no pre-requisite of a popular vote to the Council for the role and so the President of the European Council has no voting rights in the Council (although they could if he/she was also a sitting political head of a member state, like Cameron).

Is this an argument that it is democratic or undemocratic?

 

[hilts]

508 pages and the outers are still trying to convince themselves that uncontrolled immigration is to blame for everything thats wrong in their lives

same as it ever was

Must have missed those particular posts unless youre making it up of course

 

[Manchester_lalala]

Which buffoons should we be supporting then?

This shouldnt be about supporting individuals, it's about supporting Britain. I'm not supporting farage, Johnson etc. I'm supporting Britain and what I think is best for its long term future. I don't listen to any of the campaigns scare tactics, my minds been set on voting to leave for ages. Both Johnson and Cameron are both idiots.

 

[mayo31]

Sent my postal vote today.

I have made my choice and so am now turning off from it all until the day when I working on a polling station

 

[blueonblue]

As I posted yesterday, the leave campaign is forever telling us that Norway got themselves a trade deal with the EU. That's true but what they haven't been telling us is that to obtain that trade deal they had to agree to unlimited immigration from any and all EU countries.

NORWAY IS NOT THE FIFTH BIGGEST ECONOMY ON THE F*CKING PLANET, Sorry to have to shout but you seem oblivious to the simple fact we are not Norway and can not be compared to Norway in any way, shape, or form.

We are a trading nation and have managed perfectly well for the nine hundred years before the EU was dreamed up ( By a convicted criminal & lifelong communist no less Altiero Spinelli ), we are more than capable of making our own way with or without the f*cking EU, see who blinks first when the Germans have to start laying off car workers and the French try and explain the realities of life to its farmers without the massive subsidies we pay to keep them on their arses.

 

[laserblue]

NORWAY IS NOT THE FIFTH BIGGEST ECONOMY ON THE F*CKING PLANET, Sorry to have to shout but you seem oblivious to the simple fact we are not Norway and can not be compared to Norway in any way, shape, or form.

We are a trading nation and have managed perfectly well for the nine hundred years before the EU was dreamed up ( By a convicted criminal & lifelong communist no less Altiero Spinelli ), we are more than capable of making our own way with or without the f*cking EU, see who blinks first when the Germans have to start laying off car workers and the French try and explain the realities of life to its farmers without the massive subsidies we pay to keep them on their arses.

Congratulations on a) missing the point entirely and b) posting a load of ignorant clap trap. You seem unaware that Germany and France are also nett contributors to the EU. They don't rely on subsidies from the UK but do understand that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts.

From the tone of your post and your (irrelevant to the issue) historical reference it seems you want us to go back to the days of simply trading cloth for wine with Portugal who are, er, in the EU. Even better let's go back to the days when we got half the population of coastal China addicted to opium so we could screw highly favourable trading concessions out of their government. I'm sure that would work just fine all over again.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

It would be reasonable if it was true, but its not.

There is no President of the EU. Each section of the EU has a president ( Council, Commission and Parliament ).

The commission And Parliament presidents are elected by the Parliament ( MEPs, who we vote in! ) and the Council president is elected by the heads of state of member countries ( Who we vote in ).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/President_of_the_European_Union

Sounds really undemocratic!.

The unelected commissioners make the law the meps talk about it

 

[Tim of the Oak]

NORWAY IS NOT THE FIFTH BIGGEST ECONOMY ON THE F*CKING PLANET, Sorry to have to shout but you seem oblivious to the simple fact we are not Norway and can not be compared to Norway in any way, shape, or form.

We are a trading nation and have managed perfectly well for the nine hundred years before the EU was dreamed up ( By a convicted criminal & lifelong communist no less Altiero Spinelli ), we are more than capable of making our own way with or without the f*cking EU, see who blinks first when the Germans have to start laying off car workers and the French try and explain the realities of life to its farmers without the massive subsidies we pay to keep them on their arses.

It is a good job that we are not NORWAY otherwise getting a trade deal with the EU might require us to sign up to Shengen. So much for controlling our own borders then!!

Yes we have helped to subsidise the French farmers but I think the German car industry will do just fine without us. We will end up buying their cars anyway but probably paying higher taxes. Our car industry might be hit harder as some manufacturers nigh relocate into the EU area over time!

 

[SWP's back]

Congratulations on a) missing the point entirely and b) posting a load of ignorant clap trap. You seem unaware that Germany and France are also nett contributors to the EU. They don't rely on subsidies from the UK but do understand that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts.

From the tone of your post and your (irrelevant to the issue) historical reference it seems you want us to go back to the days of simply trading cloth for wine with Portugal who are, er, in the EU. Even better let's go back to the days when we got half the population of coastal China addicted to opium so we could screw highly favourable trading concessions out of their government. I'm sure that would work just fine all over again.

Germany is also a net exporter to the UK and aren't likely to lose its largest single export partner.

Ps. He didn't miss the point in the least.

 

[SWP's back]

It is a good job that we are not NORWAY otherwise getting a trade deal with the EU might require us to sign up to Shengen. So much for controlling our own borders then!!

Yes we have helped to subsidise the French farmers but I think the German car industry will do just fine without us. We will end up buying their cars anyway but probably paying higher taxes. Our car industry might be hit harder as some manufacturers nigh relocate into the EU area over time!

Well I'm not shocked you think that nor that I am in disagreement.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

The unelected commissioners make the law the meps talk about it

The MEPs vote and are at least as powerful as other arms of the EU. The legislators won't propose laws that have no chance of being agreed!

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

I'm afraid this is total nonsense. As I posted earlier I worked all my adult life in exports and travelled to and worked the markets in the Middle East, Near East, Indian subcontinent and southern Africa with no such restriction.

Agreed it's utter bollox, exports means selling stuff globally which our economy does everyday. Honestly it's tiresome to think it's more complex than that either in the eu or outside it.

Unless you are selling arms or drugs or trading with countries which the United Nations has placed sanctions on , crack on.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

The MEPs vote and are at least as powerful as other arms of the EU. The legislators won't propose laws that have no chance of being agreed!

Have a look at a few pages back about a video of what meps are allowed to see on the new ttep law someone posted a YouTube video of an Irish mep and what he could do in relation to the proposed law. Seemed very democratic.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

Have a look at a few pages back about a video of what meps are allowed to see on the new ttep law someone posted a YouTube video of an Irish mep and what he could do in relation to the proposed law. Seemed very democratic.

I will have a look for the TTIP video thanks.

I assume that the Council of Ministers (including our elected Government) have a say, otherwise Caneron could not have promised that the NHS would be exempted from TTIP - as he did last week! France have done likewise with their film industry!

 

[blueish swede]

We are a trading nation and have managed perfectly well for the nine hundred years before the EU was dreamed up...

For most of that 900 years there was no trading block in Europe. Britain didn't "manage perfectly well" when it was outside the European trading block and other nations were in the block. That is why Britain joined, and that will be the position again if Britain chooses to exit the EU.

 

[blueonblue]

You seem unaware that Germany and France are also nett contributors to the EU. They don't rely on subsidies from the UK but do understand that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts.

Except without our contribution the French farming industry subsidies would drop as a matter of course (Less money in the pot to go around) leaving them to try and compete with east European farmers on price alone.
Germany does indeed pay more than it gets (Think it will increase its own contributions to make up a UK exit do you ?), but its industries sell a lot to Britain, and according to you that will cease without a trade deal in place (Again a load of bollocks, the simple fact is there is no major market place waiting to take all their cars, so its lay off time or trade freely).

If thats your grasp on history then ignorant clap trap is a description best applied to your infantile uttering.

 

[grunge]

Nice shot, sir. Right in the foot.

If it really is "anything but EU", what the fcuk does that say about over 40 years experience of EEC/EU?

Still missed the point I was making,

Brexiter "a" votes out thinking they will get x/y/z.

Brexiter "b" votes out thinking they will get a/b/c.

When in reality the result is s/t/u.

This isnt suggesting brexiters are wrong, it's suggesting that the government has hidden information from us so there can be no educated vote. Most face to face Brexiters I've met have different expectations of what they want.

If brexit happens there are going to be a lot of very disappointed voters out there.