Marc-Andre ter Stegen

Status
Not open for further replies.
Some people on here are talking like the issue is just Joe's ability to kick a ball with his feet.

It clearly isnt the issue.

I'm a big fan on his strengths, but he does not have a tactical brain. He cant even pick out someone when throwing the ball out. I've never seen a keeper more indecisive tbh.

How many times has he caught the ball and then hesitated to throw the ball to the available man. He overthinks this simple thing 9 times out of 10.

He's looked very shaky since we mentioned Guardiola was coming tbh and his form was extremely inconsistent since that announcement. This low to the left thing is getting worse and every player worth a damn knows to do aim there now.

We should sell now, cold as that is. But we should. The issue we'll have is it may be too late in the day to get a decent price.
 
twoddlehopper said:
I agree with you in the fact that no one really a knows if Joe will find a new level of footballing skills, I've said in a few post though, I think getting rid of a keeper who's won the golden glove 4 out of the last 6 seasons before he's even given a chance to prove himself is crazy.
We ain't talking about silva esk passing required here, just a 12-20yrd roll on. I'd also caution anyone sighting last nights game as proof of his short falls, because it was a makeshift defence and the system wasn't exactly flowing majestically around him, they're was rarely more than one option open to him for a pass.
I'd always put more stock in a keeper being able to save than pass, just like I would defender tackling/intercepting over passing and a striker scoring before passing...but then again I ain't Pep, I've got my own sky documentary, Guardiol
Click to expand...

It's not that he needs to pass like Silva, it's composure with the ball under pressure and decision making with it. These are not one of his strengths at all. Teams will press us to death like Arsenal was doing yesterday.
 
PrezIke said:
It's not that he needs to pass like Silva, it's composure with the ball under pressure and decision making with it. These are not one of his strengths at all. Teams will press us to death like Arsenal was doing yesterday.
Click to expand...
Teams will look to press, when they think they will get success high up the pitch. Like Liverpool did last season. Teams will know Pep plays from the back and does not like long balls. It does not help when defenders who are unfamiliar with passing out short, repeatedly give the ball away. It must be difficult for the keeper to give a short ball when the defender is lacking experience and confidence.
 
This passing from the back...mmmm hell of a lot of long diagonal balls pinged from left to right yesterday against Arsenal
 
Plain Speaking said:
Teams will look to press, when they think they will get success high up the pitch. Like Liverpool did last season. Teams will know Pep plays from the back and does not like long balls. It does not help when defenders who are unfamiliar with passing out short, repeatedly give the ball away. It must be difficult for the keeper to give a short ball when the defender is lacking experience and confidence.
Click to expand...

If you watched Bayern last year, they easily beat teams who tried to press them by playing long balls. Either diagonals to the wingers or with Boateng passing from CB through to the attacking midfielders.
 
domalino said:
If you watched Bayern last year, they easily beat teams who tried to press them by playing long balls. Either diagonals to the wingers or with Boateng passing from CB through to the attacking midfielders.
Click to expand...
We did try a few long diagonal balls against Arsenal, but with limited success.
IMO we need someone with the passing ability of say Yaya to accurately deliver such balls. I suspect this will be a difficult season. Pep has not got the players he wants to play his style of football and the PL is played at a different intensity to what Pep will be used to.
 
mosssideblue said:
Is that the issue. You are looking at Joe as a traditional keeper, in which case most on here would agree we would be barking at thinking of replacing him
Click to expand...
I just think he is a top keeper proven in the prem. Clearly loves the club. More importantly we have bigger concerns than our keeper in terms of areas for improvement. As you say though, it matters little if pep isn't impressed.
 
Plain Speaking said:
We did try a few long diagonal balls against Arsenal, but with limited success.
IMO we need someone with the passing ability of say Yaya to accurately deliver such balls. I suspect this will be a difficult season. Pep has not got the players he wants to play his style of football and the PL is played at a different intensity to what Pep will be used to.
Click to expand...
Gundogan can play them and he'll be fit in 3 weeks.

And the premier league is not played at a higher intensity than Champions league games or clasico's.

If people really think he's going to be taken aback by the level of the premier league, they've been watching too much sky sports bigging up "the best league in the world"
 
domalino said:
Games are not the only place Joe is going to be evaluated by Guardiola and co. though.

Pep and his assistants have coached a lot of goalkeeper who fit their system - and they'll be comparing Hart to what they are used to seeing every day in their 8 seasons of management. They'll have seen him doing drills with the ball at his feet, they'll have seen how much he's improved in the last 3 weeks and if he's improving fast enough. This is not new to them.

If Hart left tomorrow, it wouldn't mean he's only been given 45 minutes to prove himself.
Click to expand...
I agree there's a lot to be said about what the manager sees in training, but training and playing in competitive matches are different.
You talk of the defenders having no faith in Hart, why wouldn't you think that works both ways, how's he suppose to have confidence in a make shift defence he's never played in. If we do manage to get a settled back "4" and we don't have to make wholsale changes every game, you'll see a more confident Hart, and back line. You can't honestly tell me Gundogan is instantly know exactly how his team mates will react when he's on the ball, or pick his runs up etc, these things take time, new systems and new understandings. My point will always be, in Joe we have a world class goalie and I for one firmly believe given time and support will work his back out for city to fit into whatever system Pep wants.
 
twoddlehopper said:
I agree there's a lot to be said about what the manager sees in training, but training and playing in competitive matches are different.
You talk of the defenders having no faith in Hart, why wouldn't you think that works both ways, how's he suppose to have confidence in a make shift defence he's never played in. If we do manage to get a settled back "4" and we don't have to make wholsale changes every game, you'll see a more confident Hart, and back line. You can't honestly tell me Gundogan is instantly know exactly how his team mates will react when he's on the ball, or pick his runs up etc, these things take time, new systems and new understandings. My point will always be, in Joe we have a world class goalie and I for one firmly believe given time and support will work his back out for city to fit into whatever system Pep wants.
Click to expand...

Hart is a great shot-stopper (most of the time) but he's not world class.
 
bondsman said:
I just think he is a top keeper proven in the prem. Clearly loves the club. More importantly we have bigger concerns than our keeper in terms of areas for improvement. As you say though, it matters little if pep isn't impressed.
Click to expand...

He is a top keeper and Prem proven, I doubt you will find any arguments to that on here.
 
twoddlehopper said:
4 golden gloves in 6 seasons in the premier league. What's that if not world class?
Click to expand...

That's as much to do with City's play further forwards as it is Hart's capabilities. He does not command his box, is uncertain on crosses and has mediocre feet. But he CAN be a fantastic shot-stopper. And people tend to notice those types of 'keepers.
 
bondsman said:
I just think he is a top keeper proven in the prem. Clearly loves the club. More importantly we have bigger concerns than our keeper in terms of areas for improvement. As you say though, it matters little if pep isn't impressed.
Click to expand...

That's true. But if he can't distribute the ball that is all moot. Guardiola's style is predicated on a footballing 'keeper. If Hart can't adapt, he's gone.
 
domalino said:
Gundogan can play them and he'll be fit in 3 weeks.

And the premier league is not played at a higher intensity than Champions league games or clasico's.

If people really think he's going to be taken aback by the level of the premier league, they've been watching too much sky sports bigging up "the best league in the world"
Click to expand...
The PL has more games than other leagues and most of them are "competitive". This will be much more so in future seasons with the distribution of the TV money to lower league clubs. La Liga and the Bundesliga have less teams capable of winning the title and have winter breaks. Pep may well have a shock with the intensity of football this season.
 
Ter Stegen appears a better distributor than Hart. However, Ter Stegen's distribution success stats depend on his pass length: 48m=63%, 40m=68%, 29m=86%. Currently Hart's pass length of 48m has a success of 59%.


Ter Stegen has kept less clean sheets than Hart in every season he has played. Granted Hart has played significantly more in the last 2 years, but when Ter Stegen last played a full season in Germany 13/14, Ter Stegen kept 9 clean sheets in 34 games with an average of 1.26 saves per goal, that season Hart kept 18 clean sheets in 38 games with an average of 1.48 saves per goal.


Overall they are 2 very good goalkeepers, Ter Stegen is younger, 3.5 inches smaller with slightly better distribution, Hart appears better at keeping the goals out and has proven PL quality. Personally I wouldn't rush to swap Hart but it is not my decision.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top