10 | Jack Grealish - 2021/22 Performances

[discopop]

I like the lad, he’s slowly getting there, next year should be the one to judge him on, like it was Bernie and most of our signings. As for diving you only had to look what was being dished out on Saturday to know that accusation is mainly bollocks.

 

[mccity]

While I agree with most of what you ahve written we dont know if Pep is happy or not...Pep rarely if ever calls players out publicly

I should add in here, that we do generally have an idea of when Pep is happy based on whether they get picked or not.

Grealish is getting picked frequently. Not to the level of our best players but he's getting as many minutes as other attackers did in their first year under Pep.

In fact he's had more league minutes than either Mahrez or Bernardo did in their first years and we've still got 4 games to go.

This isn't me saying Pep is super happy or anything, maybe he wanted more. But there's no way he's going to watch him in games and in training, and then on rewatches for analysis, and say 'This guy isn't good enough' and then continue to pick him anyway.

We saw in 16/17 with the fullbacks that if he isn't happy you don't play. We saw with Touré in 17/18 that if he isn't happy you don't play. Sané in 18/19 went through a spell where he got significantly decreased minutes because Pep wasn't happy. Aguero got reduced time towards the end of his tenure.

As long as Grealish keeps playing we can be fairly sure Pep is happier than not.

 

[OB1]

Stats can be very very misleading....especially on passes.....and possession....its easier to keep possession/have more passing accuracy when making simple sideways and backwards passes....which ive already said as well and its what Grealish does

If you dont like my previous answer dont be so dismissive of peoples posts by just posting "PMSL"

Manchester City Stats, Premier League | FBref.com

Check out Manchester City's latest scores, goals, shooting, passing, defense, possession stats and more for the 2022-2023 Premier League.

fbref.com

If you like stats the above show foden, KDB, and others are ahead of him (prem league stats)

Grealish-----Foden----KDB-------Mahrez----Silva------Sterling---Cancello-----Jesus

Goals--------2.----------8. ------11-----------11------- 8----------- 10-------------1----------- 8

Assists-------2 -----------5--------6------------5---------3------------3-------------6------------8

Exp Assist--5.2----------5.7-----7.3----------3.4-------4.9---------3.9------------4.1--------5.3

So no it isnt just KDB that is better in the expected assists....its also foden and Jesus (and I dont think it includes this weekends data either where foden will have at least one more assist to his name as well and Jesus has one more goal to this as well) and Silva aint far behind while contributing more goals by far and one more actual assist

David Silva was arguably the most creative player we have had but what SIla wasnt as recognised for was that pass before the assist......thats where stats also fail.....I suspect the likes of foden, bernardo and even KDB are higher up on that than him as well

In terms of actual goals and assists he is by far the worst

I didn't refer to expected assists, I referred to avarage key passes per game, so yes it is only KDB that is better on that metric (although tbf I did leave out he who shall not be named, which I think is fair).

Thanks for sharing the expected assists, Jack hardly fares badly on that one.

As far as extended assists go, Yaya was the king of that and those stats are available if you have detailed Opta etc data. You might find Jack does very well on that, given comments Pep and Guardiola made not too long ago.

Oh and your assertion about Jack just having been an average player in the past is not backed up by stats, given that his numbers were top 20 in both the last two seasons (top 5 last season). That will be one of the reasons City paid so much money for him. Do you think our Club is so stupid that it would splash £100m on a player that is just average?

 

[Blue Coop]

I like what I see to be honest. He’s starting to be more aggressive in his game and when he runs at players he has a lot of success. He also doesn’t give the ball away a great deal which is fundamental to Peps system. I’d actually like to see him take more risks like KDB/Foden, at the expense of ball retention, but I think that’ll come with more confidence in the team. It’s coming.

I like others don’t care he’s not scoring lots of goals at this stage, but I would like to see that improve. I thinks it’s important all of the front line are capable of being regular match winners.

 

[simon23]

I didn't refer to expected assists, I referred to avarage key passes per game, so yes it is only KDB that is better on that metric (although tbf I did leave out he who shall not be named, which I think is fair).

Thanks for sharing the expected assists, Jack hardly fares badly on that one.

As far as extended assists go, Yaya was the king of that and those stats are available if you have detailed Opta etc data. You might find Jack does very well on that, given comments Pep and Guardiola made not too long ago.

Oh and your assertion about Jack just having been an average player in the past is not backed up by stats, given that his numbers were top 20 in both the last two seasons (top 5 last season). That will be one of the reasons City paid so much money for him. Do you think our Club is so stupid that it would splash £100m on a player that is just average?

What do you mean he doesnt fare badly.....he is less than both KDb, Foden ( a player 5-6 years his junior and considerably less experience and also Jesus (who again has less prem experience and is younger and plays out of position)

His actual contribution to the team in terms of goals and assists is considerably worse which you conveniently miss out.....what actually happens compared to what might happen is far ore important as well.

Top 20 ...is hardly anyting to crow about......that means that is at least one player in every team better than him and everything at Villa went through Grealish so again that is misleading.

So stats do help to back up what some are saying...he isnt performing at the level required....no where near....he is the least productive of the attacking players. (and less productive than Cancello as well (I also left out Gundo as his figures are better but it could be argued that they are skewed by the fact that he has played quite a few less games).

However the evidence is there to watch..... a safe player who keeps it simple and retains possession well...picks up a lot of fouls still. However as a lot of people are saying he needs to be better....especially in taking grip of the game (and not winding other teams and fans up as that doesnt help), providing actual assists and chipping in with goals......how many did Sane get in his first season from wide left....how many does Bernardo and foden get a season - usually around 8-10 mark? Thats where he needs to be aiming for

 

[radcliffe1309]

What do you mean he doesnt fare badly.....he is less than both KDb, Foden ( a player 5-6 years his junior and considerably less experience and also Jesus (who again has less prem experience and is younger and plays out of position)

His actual contribution to the team in terms of goals and assists is considerably worse which you conveniently miss out.....what actually happens compared to what might happen is far ore important as well.

Top 20 ...is hardly anyting to crow about......that means that is at least one player in every team better than him and everything at Villa went through Grealish so again that is misleading.

So stats do help to back up what some are saying...he isnt performing at the level required....no where near....he is the least productive of the attacking players. (and less productive than Cancello as well (I also left out Gundo as his figures are better but it could be argued that they are skewed by the fact that he has played quite a few less games).

However the evidence is there to watch..... a safe player who keeps it simple and retains possession well...picks up a lot of fouls still. However as a lot of people are saying he needs to be better....especially in taking grip of the game (and not winding other teams and fans up as that doesnt help), providing actual assists and chipping in with goals......how many did Sane get in his first season from wide left....how many does Bernardo and foden get a season - usually around 8-10 mark? Thats where he needs to be aiming for

Excellent post

 

[applejuice]

Stats can be very very misleading....especially on passes.....and possession....its easier to keep possession/have more passing accuracy when making simple sideways and backwards passes....which ive already said as well and its what Grealish does

If you dont like my previous answer dont be so dismissive of peoples posts by just posting "PMSL"

Manchester City Stats, Premier League | FBref.com

Check out Manchester City's latest scores, goals, shooting, passing, defense, possession stats and more for the 2022-2023 Premier League.

fbref.com

If you like stats the above show foden, KDB, and others are ahead of him (prem league stats)

Grealish-----Foden----KDB-------Mahrez----Silva------Sterling---Cancello-----Jesus

Goals--------2.----------8. ------11-----------11------- 8----------- 10-------------1----------- 8

Assists-------2 -----------5--------6------------5---------3------------3-------------6------------8

Exp Assist--5.2----------5.7-----7.3----------3.4-------4.9---------3.9------------4.1--------5.3

So no it isnt just KDB that is better in the expected assists....its also foden and Jesus (and I dont think it includes this weekends data either where foden will have at least one more assist to his name as well and Jesus has one more goal to this as well) and Silva aint far behind while contributing more goals by far and one more actual assist

David Silva was arguably the most creative player we have had but what SIla wasnt as recognised for was that pass before the assist......thats where stats also fail.....I suspect the likes of foden, bernardo and even KDB are higher up on that than him as well

In terms of actual goals and assists he is by far the worst

Since you talk about the stats from FBref I want to point out some details.

The data you list here is accumulated data which is heavy influenced by playing time. Grealish and Jesus both suffered weeks of injuries. xA per 90 will reflect the actual performance better.

If we look at xA per 90 min in PL, the ranking is KDB > Jesus > Grealish > Foden. If we look at xA per 90 min across all competitions, the ranking is KDB> Foden = Grealish(tie) >Jesus.

Taking set pieces especially corners will contribute a lot in xA stats and key pass stats. I am not suggesting Jesus or Grealish should start to take set pieces but it is quite outstanding for them to get high xA almost purely from open play and get similar stats closed to regular set pieces taker (KDB/Foden/Mahrez).

You also mentioned "the pass before the assist". Actually FBref has some similar data related to that. SCA - shot created actions and GCA - goal created actions. They take both of the 2 actions before the shot/goal instead of only looking at the assists.

In terms of SCA per 90 in PL.
Grealish ranks 3rd after KDB and TAA
A quite a big portion of KDB/TAA SCA come from "dead pass" which means set pieces.
Grealish ranks 1st in "live pass" SCA even higher than KDB. (Note: not considering some random subs who has less than 2 games time).

If we look at GCA per 90.
Jesus ranks 1st in PL. TAA ranks 9th. Phil ranks 12th. KDB ranks 20th. Mahrez ranks 25. Grealish only ranks 65. It indicates that the convertion rate of chances generated by Grealish are low.

Is it caused by the quality of the chances Grealish generated? I used to think so.

However if we look at GCA per 90 from "live pass". Grealish is actually better than KDB and Mahrez. The ranking is Jesus > Foden > Grealish > KDB > Mahrez. This means the avg quality of the chances Grealish generated from open play are not worse than Foden or KDB while on frequency side Grealish is even better.

All these stats show that Grealish is quite good at "the pass before assist" and maybe even better than KDB if in the open play. He is still the good playmaker we used to see in the past. Let's hope that the new joiners in the summer will help on the conversion side.

If you look at England games since last summer, Grealish actually has a quite good goal involvement status. He is directly involved in goals (either G/A or a goal comes from the penalty or set pieces he wins) in all his starts except one start against Poland. This is a quite amazing status given he is not the main man or focus point like Kane/Sterling in the structure of England team. This also indicates that while his status is not good in the club, his form is actually not THAT bad because he is pulling good stats in the England team at the same time.

I don't think that he will ever be successful in a false 9 system. I never believe that last summer plan was Grealish OR Kane. It was Grealish AND Kane all the way.

 

[applejuice]

He wasn't as influential against top teams i agree,but that is understandable when the quality of opposition is that much greater.He still provided moments of brilliance,gained his team ground,and brought others into the attack with his hold up play,while also winning set pieces with his direct running and dribbling ability - all that has seeminglyand disappointingly,been coached out of his game.

It was a very strange signing if we were never going to play to his strengths.

Actually I don't totally agree here.

At the last season he was at Villa, Villa played slightly better against top teams than mid-lower table teams and had a very impressive away record when he was in the team.

The record - ignoring the games without Grealish, he missed 1/3 of the season.

Man City 2-0 Villa
Man Utd 2-1 Villa
Chelsea 1-1 Villa
Villa 2-1 Chelsea
Villa 7-2 Liverpool
Arsenal 0-3 Villa
Villa 1-0 Arsenal
Spurs 1-2 Villa

Among 8 games he played against the traditional Big6 in the last season, Villa won 5 drew 1 and lost 2. For a mid table team, this is very impressive and Grealish performed very influential in all the games (as he should be because Villa built around him).

Only the lost to us was a honest lost. We broke the dead lock by a smart goal from Mings error. Although FA released a statement after the match saying this should be ruled as offsite in the future.

The lost to Man Utd was quite shady. Oliver allowed Man Utd players kicking him all the time while could not stop him delivering crosses after crosses into dangerous area. In the end Man Utd only won by a shady penalty from Pogba's diving (yeah you know). I watched the game because at that time Man Utd was running the title race with us.

My Villa friend actually complained a lot this season that the team no longer performed against better teams and Philippe Coutinho notably faded badly against better sides.

Whatever he performed for us, the performance he delivered for Villa in his last season was truly outstanding.

 

[applejuice]

He gets fouled a shitload.

I've seen him dive in the past, but much less than people make out. Regardless - anytime anyone does it, whoever they play for, it pisses me off.

He dribbles slightly off-balance which allows him the agility to put himself between the ball and his opponent and force them to either foul him or let him retain possession. Being off-balance means it doesn't take a lot of contact to send him over. So he puts himself at risk of fouls while minimising the risk of injury where he can.

If he played less off-balance, planting his feet firmly on to the floor, Dallas wouldn't have been the only player going off with a broken leg on Saturday.

Yep the off balance thing.

There was a piece written last summer and it explained it well.

Quote:
He is clearly stronger with his right foot, so opponents try to show him on to his weaker left, but Grealish has improved the detail of his dribbling when moving on to his left – usually the outside because he tends to play on the left. He moves the ball to his left, just out of reach of his opponent, before quickly straightening up with his next touch. That touch takes his path back towards goal, in a direction that means if he can get his body across the defender he is suddenly the wrong side of his opponent, who will often have to resort to committing a foul. Grealish is naturally slightly off balance when he does this, and he has become a master of winning free-kicks in these situations, drawing a nudge or a clip from his opponent.

Jack Grealish: Premier League Player Watch - Coaches' Voice

The reputation of Aston Villa captain Jack Grealish continues to grow. We assess a player said to have attracted interest from elsewhere

www.coachesvoice.com

 

[supercity88]

Excellent stats applejuice.

He feeds off movement ahead of him and often, with a false 9 there isn't much. It is a huge challenge to reign in that desire to go towards goal and make things happen. Pep wants control and that is how he has had to adapt. He is, and will be, far better with a striker to play in or pass the ball into and move off.

I still have a feeling his moment is yet to come this season and when he takes it he will kick on.