15/16 financial results - £20.5m profit announced

Prestwich_Blue said:
Just had a quick scan through the annual report and saw that we made a £20m profit on the sale of players so these results are, in my view, disappointing in many ways.

But there is one hugely exciting thing in there that no one appears to have picked up. The Sheikh hasn't put one single penny in for the first time since the takeover. We've bought players like KDB and Sterling entirely out of our own resources. Now that is great news. We are truly self-financing.
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Er, I did spot that Mansour had not put in any cash in the year and have already commented on that in this thread. I even emphasised the point in bold type.

You are right though: that is the most exciting thing in the accounts. I don't share your disappointment on the numbers because they are an improvement on the prior year and I believe that commercial revenue will keep growing.
 
OB1 said:
Er, I did spot that Mansour had not put in any cash in the year and have already commented on that in this thread. I even emphasised the point in bold type.

You are right though: that is the most exciting thing in the accounts. I don't share your disappointment on the numbers because they are an improvement on the prior year and I believe that commercial revenue will keep growing.
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In that case my humble apologies. I would have expected your keen eye to have picked that up.

I'm only disappointed as I expected an underlying profit (excluding player trading) of £30m or more and we've just broken even. Also ticket revenue is a lot lower than I'd hoped as I'd have expected that figure without the League Cup & CL extra games, which I'd imagine bringing in around £7m. Taking that out means that a 20% increase in capacity hasn't brought in very much money on a life-for-like basis.
 
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OB1 said:
Here's a test for you: can you balance that profit on disposal against the relevant movements on intangibles, cash flow and debtors?
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No. Have you? Even the renowned Swiss Ramble reckoned profit on sale of players would be a lot higher than it actually was. He said £40m, I said £30m and we were both too optimistic.

I'm going to try to track everything through when I'm back from the USA as my figure for amortisation (which I thought I'd got pretty well sorted out) is way out so something isn't rigt. The problem is that we don't really know when these outgoing loan-with-obligation-to-buy deals have crystallised. We might need to put our heads together.

Question for you. If we loan a player out with an obligation to buy at a certain price and date, would we class that sale price as a debtor?
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
My humble apologies in that case. I'm just catching up intermittently.

In that case my humble apologies. I would have expected your keen eye to have picked that up.

I'm only disappointed as I expected an underlying profit (excluding player trading) of £30m or more and we've just broken even. Also ticket revenue is a lot lower than I'd hoped as I'd have expected that figure without the League Cup & CL extra games, which I'd imagine bringing in around £7m. Taking that out means that a 20% increase in capacity hasn't brought in very much money on a life-for-like basis.
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I reckon more like a 17% increase in capacity v 21% increase in revenue. Not that I did precise calcs. An interesting number would be a comparison of match day revenue per head (i.e. total match revenue over aggregate attendance for season) - that trend, season by season, alongside same figure per available seat would tell you whether or not it is disappointing.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
No. Have you? Even the renowned Swiss Ramble reckoned profit on sale of players would be a lot higher than it actually was. He said £40m, I said £30m and we were both too optimistic.

I'm going to try to track everything through when I'm back from the USA as my figure for amortisation (which I thought I'd got pretty well sorted out) is way out so something isn't rigt. The problem is that we don't really know when these outgoing loan-with-obligation-to-buy deals have crystallised. We might need to put our heads together.

Question for you. If we loan a player out with an obligation to buy at a certain price and date, would we class that sale price as a debtor?
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I had a quick try yesterday and it didn't tie out but I got pretty close on the flip side (purchases). Fx might be a factor but not enough of one on sales. I have gone back and checked my workings, which were on a scrap of paper and I tend to rely on using a spreadsheet so much! So it could be me but I wonder if loan fees muddy the water?

Interesting question on loan with obligation to buy. I'm going to have a think on that. I have wondered in past what they do but not attempted to discover the answer. Also, I have so far managed not to have much to do with IFRS so I should tread carefully on this. My first thought though, on a good old fashioned substance over form approach, is that the player has in substance been sold if neither side can revoke the deal and what you have is a sale on extended credit.
 
Fantastic news.

What a far cry from the £197 million loss just five years ago.

Whoever it was - Khaldoon Al Mubarak, I think - said that HRH Sheikh Mansour was here for the long run and that he and his team are building for long-term sustainability was certainly spot on.

We have the best owner and back room staff in football, IMHO.
 
Vienna_70 said:
Fantastic news.

What a far cry from the £197 million loss just five years ago.

Whoever it was - Khaldoon Al Mubarak, I think - said that HRH Sheikh Mansour was here for the long run and that he and his team are building for long-term sustainability was certainly spot on.

We have the best owner and back room staff in football, IMHO.
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I completely agree. What an owner we have, I still have to pinch myself, just to make sure it's not a dream.
 
ManCityX said:
I wonder how this prick is feeling

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I'd tell you but that twunt blocked me when we released our figures last year and I took him to task on it.
 
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