#47 | Phil Foden - 2019/20 Performances

[EL APACHE TEVEZ]

Foden should be playing that’s all.

 

[BlueLook]

Someone was wondering why Sane did not play more last season. I guess he forgot that we have WON the English league with Bernardo Silva who was in a better form. Club interest is first and foremost.

 

[itisrising]

I want City to do good more bthan Foden, tbh. Better if he does it good at City too, actually it would be great, but if him doing good would mean City would be worse, than sorry, it's a barrier and excuse I'm putting without feeling guilty.

But Foden succeeding is good for City, even if there was a slight drop off both financially and our long-term ability to keep our best youngsters. This short-termism is going to cost us more and more top young players as it did with Sancho.

And it's not even Foden, it's a chronic problem at this club and it's going to keep continuing unless we as a club are prepared to take a risk and place some faith in our academy. We've had numerous players that were good enough to be part of the first-team picture at the time that we sold for financial gain. Players like Lopes,Trippier, Suarez, Denayer etc who could have all done a job for us at a certain time ala the Barcelona model which promoted even less talented players like Tello, Jefferen, Montoya etc and managed to win virtually everything. There is literally no excuse for it anymore, it's a real issue we have with our current model and losing Foden would compound that fact.

 

[ADegenerate]

But Foden succeeding is good for City, even if there was a slight drop off both financially and our long-term ability to keep our best youngsters. This short-termism is going to cost us more and more top young players as it did with Sancho.

And it's not even Foden, it's a chronic problem at this club and it's going to keep continuing unless we as a club are prepared to take a risk and place some faith in our academy. We've had numerous players that were good enough to be part of the first-team picture at the time that we sold for financial gain. Players like Lopes,Trippier, Suarez, Denayer etc who could have all done a job for us at a certain time ala the Barcelona model which promoted even less talented players like Tello, Jefferen, Montoya etc and managed to win virtually everything. There is literally no excuse for it anymore, it's a real issue we have with our current model and losing Foden would compound that fact.

I completely understand your position but I'd much rather have Bernardo, Laporte, Mahrez, Walker/Cancelo (the signing players model over youth promotion). Sancho is the first player that might be world class who got away. Denayer, Lopes, Foden, and Brahim all had chances to play and they never caught the necessary lightning (foden undecided) so I think it's a bit premature to complain or question our model/method of doing things at this stage in our progression. We're a CL and 1 or 2 PL titles away from becoming the greatest side in premier league history so personally I'm completely content with the model we've been using.

Part of, and arguably the primary reason for playing the youth is financial and that's fortunately not a burden for us so there isn't a reason to force that through when there is clearly a better way. For arguments sake here, I'd actually prefer to acquire the best young players (20-24) and maximize our chances for each title rather than rolling the dice on our 18/19 year olds. We have the facilities, the coaches, and the stature to attract the best young players (14-17) in the world for the foreseeable future so that won't be an issue either. There will be plenty more Sancho's / Foden's / Brahim's / Garcia's in the short and probably long term.

It's a touchy debate with arguments for both sides. Not really trying to critique or "@" you in particular by the way, just trying to throw out a different perspective.

Also, let's not forget that we do moderately shrewd business and nearly every signing we make raises the value of our club (worth much more than we pay like Gabby, Sane, KDB, Rodri, etc).

I think what we're doing now is the most optimal long term plan as it has been since the takeover. It's been about as perfect as it could possibly have been since the takeover...

Edit: Also, Barcalona isn't exactly in an ideal situation either. They've made panic buys and they're nowhere near the level that they've been. It's probably trending even more downward so that model isn't necessary something to be thrilled about from a 30 year model dating back to 10 years ago.

 

[BosnianBlue]

People are quoting Barcelona based on their single purple patch with youth production. They were always full of Brazilians, Dutch etc.. and they will never do it again. They haven't brought anyone remotely good to the team probably close to a decade. While spending probably 600-700 million on their current team. And lost full bus of solid players from their youth to teams like City. La Masia is a myth for some time now and what's good from it's production usually leaves the club before they are 15. It's similar with Bayern who at one moment 7-8 years ago were enjoying the fruits of German football success. In t heir case it wasn't only from their academy, but from buying all German products early and cheap. Now they're forced to spend big as even teams like West Ham or Leicester can compete with them financially and more and more German young players will get wise and move to England for bigger money and chance to win something.

Nobody ever made continuous success with youth players. Not in the big leagues, not in the Europe. Ajax did it few times, but had periods of 2-3 decades of averageness inbetween, Monaco did it recently but barely avoided relegation last 2 seasons. I don't think that's the way we want to be.

Promoting youth in masses is only for small clubs to sell them later and live on that money. The big clubs we want to be will promote youth only when they are extraordinary and when timing fits them. The easier path to the first team with less competition at their position and stuff like that. As I wrote in one earlier post, we bought the likes of De Bruyne, Bernarrdo and Rodri from money made on sales of our Lopezs and Suarezs. Great job, if you ask me.

I'm sorry, but some of you still have a mindset of City of 30 years ago in this issue. You won't admit it but it's that. You're also bending under media and your Rag/Dipper mates pressure of City buying everyone and not promoting their youth, but you won't admit that too. They would love if City would stop competing at the market and play it cheap with their youth. They'd happily write articles about worldfuckingstarness of our Greenwoods if we would be 8th in the league. They don't give a shit about Foden, they want to create problems at City. I know you will think about me as a Johy comes lately foreigner who doesn't understand blah blah, but I have a perfect distance from everydays English fan football pressure to think about this rationally. Emotions are success killer. Modern football rulez :)

 

[Tugay One Cup]

I know you will think about me as a Johy comes lately foreigner who doesn't understand blah blah, but I have a perfect distance from everydays English fan football pressure to think about this rationally. Emotions are success killer. Modern football rulez :)

To be perfectly honest, I find this bullshit patronising and insulting. All you're doing is trying to convince everyone that one of your insecurities is actually a strength.

You certainly wouldn't be the the first to make the insinuation that you're in a better position to judge the situation because you have no real emotional connection to the club or its surrounding area but it's always just a daft way of discrediting an opposing view. You even laid the groundwork for it a couple of pages ago by suggesting it's a "touchy subject" because Phil's a local lad.

Many of us have been watching players come and go long before you would have started following the club. Plenty of those players have been local lads who we can recognise as being not good enough. Phil being from Stockport would mean absolutely fuck all if he wasn't as talented as he is and many of us have been watching him long enough to know exactly how much potential he has, Pep and Txiki included.

It's not even about them being local. Do you think I cared more about us losing Brandon Barker than I did about Brahim Diaz?

This "I'm a foreign fan which actually means I'm in a better position to judge" crap needs to die a death.

 

[mosssideblue]

I don’t know. Probably too late to loan him now. He should have gone to a Bournemouth or Southampton in the summer... City and Pep are under big pressure to promote and produce an academy prospect; just hope that’s not to the detriment of Foden.

pressure from who

 

[ADegenerate]

People are quoting Barcelona based on their single purple patch with youth production. They were always full of Brazilians, Dutch etc.. and they will never do it again. They haven't brought anyone remotely good to the team probably close to a decade. While spending probably 600-700 million on their current team. And lost full bus of solid players from their youth to teams like City. La Masia is a myth for some time now and what's good from it's production usually leaves the club before they are 15. It's similar with Bayern who at one moment 7-8 years ago were enjoying the fruits of German football success. In t heir case it wasn't only from their academy, but from buying all German products early and cheap. Now they're forced to spend big as even teams like West Ham or Leicester can compete with them financially and more and more German young players will get wise and move to England for bigger money and chance to win something.

Nobody ever made continuous success with youth players. Not in the big leagues, not in the Europe. Ajax did it few times, but had periods of 2-3 decades of averageness inbetween, Monaco did it recently but barely avoided relegation last 2 seasons. I don't think that's the way we want to be.

Promoting youth in masses is only for small clubs to sell them later and live on that money. The big clubs we want to be will promote youth only when they are extraordinary and when timing fits them. The easier path to the first team with less competition at their position and stuff like that. As I wrote in one earlier post, we bought the likes of De Bruyne, Bernarrdo and Rodri from money made on sales of our Lopezs and Suarezs. Great job, if you ask me.

I'm sorry, but some of you still have a mindset of City of 30 years ago in this issue. You won't admit it but it's that. You're also bending under media and your Rag/Dipper mates pressure of City buying everyone and not promoting their youth, but you won't admit that too. They would love if City would stop competing at the market and play it cheap with their youth. They'd happily write articles about worldfuckingstarness of our Greenwoods if we would be 8th in the league. They don't give a shit about Foden, they want to create problems at City. I know you will think about me as a Johy comes lately foreigner who doesn't understand blah blah, but I have a perfect distance from everydays English fan football pressure to think about this rationally. Emotions are success killer. Modern football rulez :)

I've been here for almost five years and supported City for over a decade now. Before we won the FA cup, before I knew about the takeover, etc. This is your club, mine, and everyone else's that is a blue. Try not to forget this is the main spot for the locals and that the club means more than just football for a large majority of the posters here. I think you make good points and I agree with the majority of them but some perspective is needed at times when you post here. @Tugay One Cup is right here, I think you were out of line.

Stick around, keep posting. This is a great community with really good people.

 

[mosssideblue]

Foden should be playing that’s all.

And he will be, that's all too

 

[mosssideblue]

Everyone in this thread wants the best for him and everyone in this thread wants him to succeed here.

That is without question. It is just some actually believe they could manage Foden's development better than what is currently happening with him.

As far as I see it, he is developing a lot quicker than he may of if Pep (and his coaching team) wasn't around, so I am not fussed one bit about his game time as he will get that as and when to continue that development.

What I do know, is that he hasn't stagnated these last couple of seasons, so as much as it might not align with what some BM posters want for him now, he is improving and learning from the best coach and players, (he defo will not get that out on loan) and we should just sit back and enjoy that.

Foden's time will come and I believe it will be with us.