52% of those who did vote could have not spent two minutes in the polling booth and saved us from a world of pain.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
Alexandole Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
- Thread starter hilts
- Start date
Rascal
El Presidente
The idea that you associate dictators with being left wing is even more laughable. More people have died at the hands of Capitalism than any other political system, people convieniently ignore this, as you have by not including the likes of the social conservative friend of Thatcher, Pinochet in your listThe idea that being left wing makes you a good person is laughable, and the millions of people who died at the hands of the likes of Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Amin and Castro bear witness to this.
Trotsky labelled the Stalin regime as a “totalitarian” dictatorship , a concept still relatively new in political thought at that time. Thus, Stalinism, is a form of totalitarianism, a bureaucracy, a privileged caste, at the top of which Stalin was in effect an absolute monarch who lorded it over the working class, you could make a comparison with North Korea today.
Idi Amin seized power from the left wing Obote, who was nationalising industries that meant many British companies were going to lose money so Britain backed Idi Amin's coup. It was a capitalist coup.
Castro's coup was as much a victory against US Imperialism than anything and many would argue that him going to the USSR was because Cuba had been backed into a corner by the US. Castro's coup was not a Communist coup, it included liberals, socialists and was anti imperialist. It is estimated Castro had about 15,000 people executed.
Pol Pot. I know little of apart from the KR regime did murder thousands of people. Pol Pot was a Nationalist initially who later turned to his own interpretation of Marxist/Leninism.
Mao, I find it difficult to describe China as Communist, it is more an Authoritarian state capitalist regime.
As for does being left wing make you a good person, No it doesn't, the same applies for every political ideology, it does mean though imho you are more likely to be a humanitarian.
stonerblue
Well-Known Member
Odd that as 'the family unit' and all that goes with it was decimated in the thatcher years.Well we’ve already been over some. I’ll give you a fexamples for now but can give more if you want:
- The family unit being the centre piece of society. Every study shows a breakdown of this leads to crime and poverty.
- Tough on crime. Doesn’t need explaining.
- Tighter immigration controls. Doesn’t need explaining.
- Preservation of our institutions. Doesn’t need explaining.
- A view of liberty under law. Having a strong sense of law but allowing freedom beneath that is a cornerstone of western civilisation.
- A private sector that can trade freely, which lifts people out of poverty and allows them to own their own property. (Worth noting I am not neoliberal and I support a big safety net to help those that the private sector fails)
Now, I’m going to counter two points I think you might make:
1) “but the Tories...” yes I know, they don’t have a monopoly on conservatism as an ideology and they certainly don’t live up to my standards of it.
2) “some of these aren’t exclusive to the right” again, yes I know, traditional Labour governments of the mid 20th century supported some of these ideas and that’s why I admire Bevan, Attlee etc.
The bedroom tax has done / is doing a lot of damage to families, and that was the coalition. True, the LibDems regret it.Odd that as 'the family unit' and all that goes with it was decimated in the thatcher years.
west didsblue
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- 2 Oct 2011
- Messages
- 32,307
Can’t really work out what it’s to do with Johnson other than he is the very opposite of what they stand for with his two wives 5/6 kids, bits on the side etc etc. I suspect he’ll happily dribble on about family values though before shagging the Au Pair.My fault. I did ask what he meant by social conservative, and I've not read every word, but is anyone any wiser? Other than he doesn't think Stalin and Hitler were social conservatives.
The sexual revolution was the beginning of the issues and it snowballed.Odd that as 'the family unit' and all that goes with it was decimated in the thatcher years.
If you listen to people like Sir Roger Scruton and Peter Hitchens, they said Thatcher got the social aspects of Conservatism badly.
This just sums you up mate.My fault. I did ask what he meant by social conservative, and I've not read every word, but is anyone any wiser? Other than he doesn't think Stalin and Hitler were social conservatives.
You’re rude and ignorant and happy being both.
You don’t debate on here with good intentions, it’s all about trying to get one over on people and try and bully people.
Grow up mate, you’re not at school any more.
stonerblue
Well-Known Member
1985;The sexual revolution was the beginning of the issues and it snowballed.
If you listen to people like Sir Roger Scruton and Peter Hitchens, they said Thatcher got the social aspects of Conservatism badly.
The House of Commons approved revisions of the country's divorce laws today, voting to allow couples to start proceedings after only one year of marriage instead of three.
The Matrimonial and Family Proceedings Bill, approved in a 119-16 vote, also ends the alimony right of divorced wives that ex-husbands have complained amounted to virtual lifetime support.
The bill, introduced by Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher's Conservative Government, is expected to take effect next fall despite bitter attacks on it by church leaders.
THen we've got the 'right to buy' scheme which saw families saddled with debts they couldn't afford.
Add the rise of availability to get easy credit.
Kids growing up in one parent households (i know that's a fave of yours).
Conservative policy