Another new Brexit thread

[Vic]

I agree it;'s not ideal, but I suppose the pragmatic thing to do is prepare for no deal.

No shit, sherlock.

Actually, we should do what Gove said and still be in a free trade zone from Iceland to the Russian border.

The only inconvenient truth is that Brexiters lie.

 

[stonerblue]

Will try - but suspect that they are all taken by the Remainers on here that dominate the thread

Shall I post some examples - it would be so easy to do?

Don't need to go back far - check out Dids and Dids buddying up earlier.

I could point out very many - would it be helpful to show that it is far more frequent to see 'buddying up' comes from the Remainer side?

Yet another invented truth to go with 'the pack' and leavers being 'hounded off the thread'

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

No shit, sherlock.

Actually, we should do what Gove said and still be in a free trade zone from Iceland to the Russian border.

The only inconvenient truth is that Brexiters lie.

Politicians lying - really?

 

[Vic]

Don't worry Bobert, according to todays Guardian BJ's best mate Starmer is wipping labour MP's to vote it through. They are not allowed to say the word 'support' though!

Lots of alternatives.

Bail out. Rescue the UK from utter Tory stupidity. Save farming, fishing and factories. Duty to save us from the failed promises. Keep planes flying. Make sure you get your medicines. Shame Johnson for what is not his finest hour. Mitigate the mess. Death to the No Deal destroyers. Ignominy for the inconvenient truthers. Piss off the political willers. Roust Rees-Mogg. Protect the Good Friday Agreement. Avoid never-ending palaver. Terminate the Tories' trash. Restore Britain's reputation for Reason. Unicorns are dead. Cakes have nearly been eaten, we have to save the crumbs.

The nation stands on a precipice - the Conservative Party has led us here and wants to step back from the edge and in the national interest the Labour Party will help dismantle the cliff.

And if Messers Johnson and Gove now want to fulfil their promise that we would be in a free trade zone from Iceland to the Russian border, yes they will have our support.

 

[BobKowalski]

Don't worry Bobert, according to todays Guardian BJ's best mate Starmer is wipping labour MP's to vote it through. They are not allowed to say the word 'support' though!

Johnson is going to torch his premiership with his party by accepting Labour votes on a deal that is fairly thin gruel at best? I see no incentive for Johnson in doing this. A no deal exit binds the party to him. What is the political incentive to do otherwise?

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Johnson is going to torch his premiership with his party by accepting Labour votes on a deal that is fairly thin gruel at best? I see no incentive for Johnson in doing this. A no deal exit binds the party to him. What is the political incentive to do otherwise?

I suppose he gets to say he got a deal and 'got brexit done' -back to what Vic was saying about promises I suppose. He can probably ride out the ERG storm on that basis too.

 

[Vic]

Johnson is going to torch his premiership with his party by accepting Labour votes on a deal that is fairly thin gruel at best? I see no incentive for Johnson in doing this. A no deal exit binds the party to him. What is the political incentive to do otherwise?

To avoid being blamed for the damage of a no deal exit. There's no win for him here. Unless there's a clear personal benefit in damaging the country, even he would choose not to damage the country. And there are no votes now in Brexit.

The real and present danger is that he simply cannot make a decision, or just finds it easier to let us slide into a chaotic no deal rather than go and face Parliament with any deal. It may have been another misjudgment by MPs to insist that our sovereign Parliament should have a final say on any deal - but not to have a vote to approve No Deal.

Bottler Boris's No Deal.

 

[BobKowalski]

I suppose he gets to say he got a deal and 'got brexit done' -back to what Vic was saying about promises I suppose. He can probably ride out the ERG storm on that basis too.

Johnson will become the new ‘Ted Heath’ and be dumped on the roadside like every Tory PM who tried to tackle the Tory Party’s European problem since Heath.

He’s already lost enough Tory MP’s support on Covid, so pushing through a deal, any deal with the EU with Labour support will torch Johnson’s Premiership. Brexit is an internal party issue and internal party politics will decide whether there is a deal or not this year.

Next year we will be back at the negotiating table and the whole thing will start again. SNP will be delighted, Labour will get to use every delayed truck as a stick to beat the Govt, the Tory press will scream we are being punished by the evil EU and issue a call to arms and the EU will beat us over the head with the Withdrawal Agreement with Ireland using EU and US leverage to back it up.

The window for Johnson to do a deal was within the first six months of this year. That window has closed to the point that whatever he does now is a choice between ‘shit’ and ‘really shit’.

Don‘t get me wrong, I hope there will be a deal before 31st Dec, I just think UK internal politics is pushing us in the opposite direction.

 

[BobKowalski]

To avoid being blamed for the damage of a no deal exit. There's no win for him here. Unless there's a clear personal benefit in damaging the country, even he would choose not to damage the country. And there are no votes now in Brexit.

The real and present danger is that he simply cannot make a decision, or just finds it easier to let us slide into a chaotic no deal rather than go and face Parliament with any deal. It may have been another misjudgment by MPs to insist that our sovereign Parliament should have a final say on any deal - but not to have a vote to approve No Deal.

Bottler Boris's No Deal.

Agree. Although I think Tory MPs would now vote for no deal, but it would be good to get that on record via a vote.

 

[BobKowalski]

From the FT, personally I’d laugh...