Anti Vax Demonstration outside South Stand

Psychedelic Casual said:
Indeed.

There is higher risk of an adverse reaction to a shot anaesthetic at the dentist (1 in 10,000 chance of reaction) than there is to a Covid vaccine (1 in 450,000 chance of reaction).

Has anyone ever seen groups of people outside dentists demonstrating about anaesthetic injections or a load of social media experts all over Twitter and Facebook spreading conspiracy shit about dentists and what they really want with our teeth?

Has anyone who has refused the Covid vaccine on safety grounds ever refused an injection of anaesthetic at the dentist for the same reason? Do they march into the dentist and brave having their tooth pulled out or having root canal surgery with no pain-reducers at all? Or has it never even crossed their minds because it’s never been the flavour-of-the-month topic to get all hyped up about, I wonder?
Click to expand...
Brilliant post, one of several that you have contributed to this thread.
 
ZenHalfTimeCrock said:
The conspiracy theorising that goes on with some anti-vaxxers is intriguing.

It reminds me a bit of the eschatological beliefs that can be found in some world faiths, namely, those that envisage the world as a cosmic battleground between the forces of good and evil. With the anti-vaxx movement, a shadowy global elite and big pharma appear to stand in for the powers of darkness.

I am additionally not persuaded by the anti-vaxxer claim that we are on a slippery slope that will culminate in the death of democracy and the institution of a new, authoritarian world order, for the simple reason that slippery slope arguments are not especially compelling anyway.

According to the sceptical author Michael Shermer, the slippery slope fallacy typically involves constructing a scenario in which one thing leads ultimately to an end so extreme that the first steps should never have been taken.

For example, ‘Eating Ben & Jerry’s ice cream will cause you to put on weight. Putting on weight will make you overweight. Soon, you will weigh 350 pounds and die of heart disease. Eating Ben & Jerry’s ice cream leads to death.’

Certainly eating ice cream may contribute to obesity, just as the introduction of rules to restrict the spread of Covid may temporarily curtail our freedoms, but the eventual consequences in each instance (physical death/the death of democracy) do not necessarily follow from the premise.

Lastly, twenty years ago Jon Ronson wrote a book about conspiracy theories called Them: Adventures With Extremists. In it the author looks at different examples, such as ones involving the Bilderberg group, David Icke's view that the world is being taken over by shape-shifting alien lizards, and the claim made by some Muslim radicals that the West has got it in for Islam.

At the end of the book - if I remember it rightly - Ronson concludes by suggesting that conspiracy theories help those who subscribe to them to make sense of a world which might otherwise seem unstable, random, more than a little chaotic, and therefore threatening.

This seems plausible to me. With the anti-vaxxers, as with the examples mentioned in the previous paragraph, there sometimes is a factual component to the narrative that is latched onto and built upon. For example, isn't it occasional deaths from myocarditis/blood-clotting that have been highlighted when it comes to the vaccines?

But then this gets blown out of proportion. Of course, all treatments have a risk and, apparently, around 60% of deaths from allergic reactions are from medicines (often an antibiotic). Plus, anaesthesia is sometimes more dangerous than the surgery being undertaken. Nevertheless, this does not mean that antibiotics should be eschewed, nor should anaesthesia be avoided in surgery.

All in all then, where anti-vaxx beliefs get accompanied by a conspiracy theory, I do not find the content of the theory to be in any way convincing. Instead, it seems to me to be a classic case of people putting two and two together and making five.

For anyone wishing to look more deeply into this territory, in addition to Ronson's excellent book, I would recommend the following titles that are also highly readable and entertaining:

Will Storr Heretics: Adventures With the Enemies of Science
Michael Shermer Why People Believe Weird Things
Stephen Law Believing Bullshit

An amusing extract from Law's book (he is a philosopher) entitled 'The Strange Case of Dave: Dogs are Spies from Venus', can be found here:

The strange case of Dave

Dave believes dogs are spies from the planet Venus. He views any canine with great suspicion, for he believes they are here from Venus to do...
stephenlaw.blogspot.com stephenlaw.blogspot.com
Click to expand...
Brilliant post.
 
JASR said:
Luckily I have Mrs JASR to do my "research", who has access to thousands of UK doctors. A proportion of those thousands of doctors are from the relevant areas - virology & immunology, rather than just a random unrelated to the specialty Doc.

That 'Research' continues to conclude, get vaxxed, and has done since they became available, because it offers the best longterm general population health solution to covid. It's unequivocable.

My own 'research' is purely on the numbers being hospitalized/death. And again that's unequivocable: Vaxxed far less likely to be hospitalized. - And that figure came from a prominent anti-vaxxer quoting official UK figures, who was trying to argue that recently 'only' 48% of the patients in hospital due to covid are unvaxxed. Basic maths 101 failure...

So, in summary. I've 'done my research' by getting information direct from people qualified to understand virology and immunology, and direct from people who don't follow MSM, ie Anti-vaxxers, who happen to not understand basic maths.

NB This is nothing to do with how govt has acted throughout. That's an entirely different mass of questions.
Click to expand...

enjoy your 4th booster
 
10% of people have an adverse reaction to getting a tattoo. 1 in 10! Versus 1 in 450,000 to a Covid vaccine.

Same thing again, have you ever seen demonstrators outside tattooists complaining about tattoos or conspiracy theories on social media about what tattooists are really doing to us? Do you reckon any anti-vaccers have tattoos? Do you think it ever crossed their minds that they’re 45,000 times more likely to have a bad reaction to their tattoo than the Covid vaccine?
 
Psychedelic Casual said:
Indeed.

There is higher risk of an adverse reaction to a shot anaesthetic at the dentist (1 in 10,000 chance of reaction) than there is to a Covid vaccine (1 in 450,000 chance of reaction).

Has anyone ever seen groups of people outside dentists demonstrating about anaesthetic injections or a load of social media experts all over Twitter and Facebook spreading conspiracy shit about dentists and what they really want with our teeth?

Has anyone who has refused the Covid vaccine on safety grounds ever refused an injection of anaesthetic at the dentist for the same reason? Do they march into the dentist and brave having their tooth pulled out or having root canal surgery with no pain-reducers at all? Or has it never even crossed their minds because it’s never been the flavour-of-the-month topic to get all hyped up about, I wonder?
Click to expand...
A number of people I have come across as listening too much to the anti vax rubbish, I asked, ‘Did you have your childhood inoculations and have you got a scar on your arm from BCG?
The answer has invariably been Yes.
It seems when this is pointed out and that they have yet to die of, or even get, TB, MMR, diphtheria, polio or suffered from the vaccine they have had, they can be inclined to get Covid-19 vaccinated….
 
CambridgeExileBlue said:
A number of people I have come across as listening too much to the anti vax rubbish, I asked, ‘Did you have your childhood inoculations and have you got a scar on your arm from BCG?
The answer has invariably been Yes.
It seems when this is pointed out and that they have yet to die of, or even get, TB, MMR, diphtheria, polio or suffered from the vaccine they have had, they can be inclined to get Covid-19 vaccinated….
Click to expand...
Maybe they are slightly more intelligent and less selfish than the others (including some we have on this forum).
 
Psychedelic Casual said:
Indeed.

There is higher risk of an adverse reaction to a shot anaesthetic at the dentist (1 in 10,000 chance of reaction) than there is to a Covid vaccine (1 in 450,000 chance of reaction).

Has anyone ever seen groups of people outside dentists demonstrating about anaesthetic injections or a load of social media experts all over Twitter and Facebook spreading conspiracy shit about dentists and what they really want with our teeth?

Has anyone who has refused the Covid vaccine on safety grounds ever refused an injection of anaesthetic at the dentist for the same reason? Do they march into the dentist and brave having their tooth pulled out or having root canal surgery with no pain-reducers at all? Or has it never even crossed their minds because it’s never been the flavour-of-the-month topic to get all hyped up about, I wonder?
Click to expand...

Psychedelic Casual said:
10% of people have an adverse reaction to getting a tattoo. 1 in 10! Versus 1 in 450,000 to a Covid vaccine.

Same thing again, have you ever seen demonstrators outside tattooists complaining about tattoos or conspiracy theories on social media about what tattooists are really doing to us? Do you reckon any anti-vaccers have tattoos? Do you think it ever crossed their minds that they’re 45,000 times more likely to have a bad reaction to their tattoo than the Covid vaccine?
Click to expand...


Dentists and tatooists in cahoots with Bill Gates & big pharma!

We need to shut them all down, who's with me?
 
bluemc1 said:
I’ve posted the Dr Peter McCullough interview on the COVID political thread and he’s explaining how nobody gets it twice and natural immunity give lifelong immunity
It’s all to do with the way the PCR test was being used

over 135 studies done show lifelong immunity and to quite “ getting it twice is more rare than hens teeth “

it’s a 2hr interview but some very interesting stuff
Click to expand...
I'm currently isolating having tested positive this morning (yes, Christmas for us is effectively cancelled). Coincidentally, my brother called me just as the dreaded red line emerged to say he'd also tested positive. Almost certainly, we were both infected at some point during the Newcastle away trip at the weekend. I only mention it because my brother tested positive by way of a PCR test back in late 2019 giving a lie to the theory that reinfection is impossible. While admittedly anecdotal, this is just one incidence of many I know of. With all due respect, you might wish to choose your sources more carefully.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top
✖
  AdBlock Detected
Bluemoon relies on advertising to pay our hosting fees. Please support the site by disabling your ad blocking software to help keep the forum sustainable. Thanks.