Are Labour a total shambles now as an opposition?

[Jalfraag]

Yes.

As most low paid jobs are in the service sectors; what economic impact do you think will result if they are paid £10/hour rather than minimum wage?

 

[Bigga]

Me and the rest of the majority of voters, thanks.

I'm all for a "fair" Britain - who isn't. What we are not for, is shooting ourselves in the foot, making ourselves uncompetitive and everyone worse off. The Labour Way TM.

The "majority of voters" you speak of are older and used to kowtowing to the Thatcher regime.

So, when does your competitiveness end?

Are you willing to undercut another country and keep taking lower wages to keep your job, whilst your employers enjoy the benefits of the profit of undercutting?

You sound like the very epitome of 'dying on your knees' rather than 'dying on your feet'.

Do you not have a worth...?

 

[Fame Monster]

Remind me which of them have decisions to make on political leanings again...

But it applies to politics as well.

David Lammy has a strong tendency to vote for military intervention and, like Tony Blair, voted to go to war with Iraq. Jeremy Corbyn is as close to a pacifist as you can get in politics and in his 40 year political career has never voted for military action and strongly opposed the war in Iraq. On economic policy however, Lammy’s political views are far closer to Corbyn’s than Blair’s. Nevertheless, to say he’s either a Corbynite or a Blairite is an extremely lazy and misleading categorisation of his views, and the same could be said about many of the 170 or so MPs who voted no confidence in Corbyn because a significant number of them dislike Blair’s policies to a very similar degree.

 

[Bigga]

But it applies to politics as well.

David Lammy has a strong tendency to vote for military intervention and, like Tony Blair, voted to go to war with Iraq. Jeremy Corbyn is as close to a pacifist as you can get in politics and in his 40 year political career has never voted for military action and strongly opposed the war in Iraq. On economic policy however, Lammy’s political views are far closer to Corbyn’s than Blair’s. Nevertheless, to say he’s either a Corbynite or a Blairite is an extremely lazy and misleading categorisation of his views, and the same could be said about many of the 170 or so MPs who voted no confidence in Corbyn because a significant number of them dislike Blair’s policies to a very similar degree.

The 'Lammys' of this world are very rare or seemingly so.

Of those "170 or so MPs who voted no confidence in Corbyn", how many of them align themselves with Blair politics?

Corbyn is a 'last resort' politician. He would rather find a way to keep the peace than send thousands of young men and women to their doom.

This is also a Progressive thinking.

I think in terms of Corbyn politics it is also "extremely lazy and misleading categorisation" to think he's entirely a socialist, he's not.

 

[Chippy_boy]

The "majority of voters" you speak of are older and used to kowtowing to the Thatcher regime.

So, when does your competitiveness end?

Are you willing to undercut another country and keep taking lower wages to keep your job, whilst your employers enjoy the benefits of the profit of undercutting?

You sound like the very epitome of 'dying on your knees' rather than 'dying on your feet'.

Do you not have a worth...?

I don't mean to sound rude, and I am sure you mean well, but you strike me as being extremely naive.

 

[Chippy_boy]

As most low paid jobs are in the service sectors; what economic impact do you think will result if they are paid £10/hour rather than minimum wage?

Well first of all, "most" doesn't equal "all" and I am not prepared to dismiss the impact of the ones not in the services sector.

But anyway, it would push costs up, wouldn't it. And doubtless make companies which are already struggling, struggle even more. Businesses not struggling might be able to stand it and others would be forced into bankruptcy to the benefit of no-one.

 

[Bigga]

I don't mean to sound rude, and I am sure you mean well, but you strike me as being extremely naive.

You can take me as you like.

I can get in to the deep nuance and politics of things, but I can't be arsed as it moves you nowhere.

I simplify things is all.

Stand for something or stand for nothing at all.

I stand for the worth of all Human dignity; better pay, better standard of living for us all.

I don't stand for the virtual enslaving of others 'providing better competition'.

Who are you as a person and what do you stand for?

Wait, that's rhetorical, I know...

 

[Jalfraag]

Well first of all, "most" doesn't equal "all" and I am not prepared to dismiss the impact of the ones not in the services sector.

But anyway, it would push costs up, wouldn't it. And doubtless make companies which are already struggling, struggle even more. Businesses not struggling might be able to stand it and others would be forced into bankruptcy to the benefit of no-one.

Which minimum wage jobs do you know of that aren't in the service sector?
Do you think Amazon, Starbucks, Burger King and Pret-a-Manger will be forced into financial difficulties through paying their staff 3 quid an hour more?
Paying their employees better wages reduces the need for tax credits and helps reduce government borrowing.

 

[bluethrunthru]

Which minimum wage jobs do you know of that aren't in the service sector?
Do you think Amazon, Starbucks, Burger King and Pret-a-Manger will be forced into financial difficulties through paying their staff 3 quid an hour more?
Paying their employees better wages reduces the need for tax credits and helps reduce government borrowing.

exactly - the biggest "benefits scroungers " in the UK are the owners of large corporations who's employee's rely on in work benefits to make ends meet whilst they employers make millions and even billions in profits. If your business plan revolves around being unable to pay your staff sufficiently your business is broken. If you are making millions you are taking sufficient profits to pay wages + the equivalent amount they get in benefits. An equal society would include legislation allowing the state to claw back benefits paid from the employers underpaying staff. Maybe thats a way of getting at these off shoring companies?

 

[Jalfraag]

exactly - the biggest "benefits scroungers " in the UK are the owners of large corporations who's employee's rely on in work benefits to make ends meet whilst they employers make millions and even billions in profits. If your business plan revolves around being unable to pay your staff sufficiently your business is broken. If you are making millions you are taking sufficient profits to pay wages + the equivalent amount they get in benefits. An equal society would include legislation allowing the state to claw back benefits paid from the employers underpaying staff. Maybe thats a way of getting at these off shoring companies?

There's nothing I'd disagree with there but I did think the best way would be to cut off the supply of cheap labour but that's for another thread