Article 50/Brexit Negotiations

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Why are the EU so concerned with keeping freedom of movement (permanent residence) with free trade? I see no correlation.

Why did they not consider freedom of movement (temporary residence up to x no. of months) or, now with security concerns - freedom of movement for only those whose industries heavily benefit from it (EU and UK), such as touring productions (aka. they apply for a EU wide visa pass for so many months with evidence of why needed, in advance).

It does feel very much like a globalist agenda where they want permanent residence available to people that have no connection with the potential country.

I think it's because in the hearts of some of them is the objective of a single European super state.

That's not where we want to go of course, but it is where some of them want to go. Not allowing free movement would be like not allowing people from London to visit manchester, which thinking about it, is a great idea.
 
How do they expect effectively to fix someone's ills if they can't communicate in their language

That's a very very good point mate. But weirdly I haven't come across an NHS nurse who couldn't speak English yet. Maybe it's the reading and writing part that's worrying them?
 
I think it's because in the hearts of some of them is the objective of a single European super state.

That's not where we want to go of course, but it is where some of them want to go. Not allowing free movement would be like not allowing people from London to visit manchester, which thinking about it, is a great idea.
They seem to think they have a right to deciding this without the people's vote in countries that aren't their own and have got mixed up in thinking a continent is a political entity rather than a geographic area. Political nations are necessary to keep the world in balance - people and economy.
 
Why are the EU so concerned with keeping freedom of movement (permanent residence) with free trade? I see no correlation.

Why did they not consider freedom of movement (temporary residence up to x no. of months) or, now with security concerns - freedom of movement for only those whose industries heavily benefit from it (EU and UK), such as touring productions (aka. they apply for a EU wide visa pass for so many months with evidence of why needed, in advance).

It does feel very much like a globalist agenda where they want permanent residence available to people that have no connection with the potential country.
It's a fundamental part of the European superstate. People have to be able to go where the jobs go. So fruit pickers to Spain, engineers to Germany etc. They are attempting to centralise all industries to take advantage of economies of scale and have no care for the mess it leaves behind. See Greece for example.
 
They seem to think they have a right to deciding this without the people's vote in countries that aren't their own and have got mixed up in thinking a continent is a political entity rather than a geographic area. Political nations are necessary to keep the world in balance - people and economy.

Who's the "they"?

There's a European parliament with proper democratic processes. It may not be the same democratic process as ours, but representatives elected by the member states make the final decisions. That's democratic.
 
It's a fundamental part of the European superstate. People have to be able to go where the jobs go. So fruit pickers to Spain, engineers to Germany etc. They are attempting to centralise all industries to take advantage of economies of scale and have no care for the mess it leaves behind. See Greece for example.

I am not advocating it.

However, what I will say is that the reason we have the situation for example, Greece, is because we are in a kind of limbo position where some of the aspects required for a super state are in play; like a common currency and European central bank. But the other necessary components, such as a central federal government, are not. If it was functioning properly, Greece would be given much more support but at the moment this is hindered by nationalistic pressures of member states who do not see themselves as being at one with Greece and who are unwilling to pick up the tab.

The Euro as an idea is flawed without political union. A single currency means a single bank base rate (since there's no exchange rate variations to stop money sloshing around from one country with a low interest rate to another with a high one).

And a single interest rate, with it's one size fits all fiscal implications, cannot work without full political union and central control of monetary policy.
 
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It's a fundamental part of the European superstate. People have to be able to go where the jobs go. So fruit pickers to Spain, engineers to Germany etc. They are attempting to centralise all industries to take advantage of economies of scale and have no care for the mess it leaves behind. See Greece for example.
I see. Comes back around as another byproduct of this version of capitalism - removal of concern for national integrity. The endless pursuit of currency and faux-status, like an arcade for suit-wearing adults trying to hit the high score.
 
It's a fundamental part of the European superstate. People have to be able to go where the jobs go. So fruit pickers to Spain, engineers to Germany etc. They are attempting to centralise all industries to take advantage of economies of scale and have no care for the mess it leaves behind. See Greece for example.
The reason Greece is in the state it's in is very little to do with freedom of movement. It's almost entirely to do with the fact it fraudulently joined the Euro when its economy was too weak to meet the criteria set for joining the single currency. If they had their own currency it would have floated to the correct level in relation to its economy making its exports cheaper and encouraging inward investment and tourism. Unfortunately there's no way out of this mess apart from austerity and bailouts. It does however benefit the stronger Euro economies by dragging the currency down enough to help the likes of Germany to run a huge surplus because their exports look cheaper than they would if they had their own currency. That's why the Euro is fundamentally flawed unless there was actually a United States of Europe, which was presumably why it was introduced in the first place to facilitate this.
 
labour mp barry gardiner on the daily politics today was asked is labour still committed to leaving the single market. his answer was yes and labour wanted to try and get the benefits of the single market. mcdonnel on the robert peston show also said similar. if labour want to remain in the single market, they are going a funny way of showing it. they have a very similar approach as the conservatives it seems.... a bit confusing.



from about 3.15 onwards.
 
Who's the "they"?

There's a European parliament with proper democratic processes. It may not be the same democratic process as ours, but representatives elected by the member states make the final decisions. That's democratic.
It's a sample form of democracy. It's not the will of the people as they aren't voting. The MEPs are the ones voting, who form their own agendas as matters arise which affect a range of other issues. The only influence people of the country have is to vote for a party based on what they say in the country's election run/by-elections, this may or may not reference matters within the EU, but as I say - they each affect a range of issues on such a grand scale as the EU. They aren't voting for MEPs directly, but MEPs are elected based upon party results within different regions of the nation (this is my understanding of how MEPs are elected in basic form). You see how removed the power of influence by the people becomes.

Easy example before you get to the EU - immigration. When Blair pushed for further multiculturalism (aka multiculturalism, not British culture balanced with multiculturalism) - when did they give us a vote on that? He and his advisers took that decision for 60m or so people, without a mandate.

The major, major decisions that affect us/have a knock on effect on all other things affecting us aren't voted on by the people. The ability for the people to influence such matters is very far removed them, to the point of ineffectual and always reactionary.
 
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