Can We Use A 3 Man Midfield?

[Sam W]

I think its an awful idea.

Too congested. The threats posed by Yaya and Fernandhino stem from their ability to get forward from deep. Start them 20m ahead of a defensive midfielder and they will be easily nullified.

Can you imagine us playing Palace at home with Garcia, Yaya and Fernandhino in midfield and Aguero relegated to the bench?

I'm not talking about playing them as attacking midfielders, I'm talking about playing them either side of a better tackler, that way they can both get forward without having to worry that as soon as we lose the ball it's up to the defenders because Javi Garcia or whoever it may be just stays back in front of the defence.

Agreed, that's why I asked whether it should only be used for away games.

-- Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:52 am --

I agree with the three man midfield but the answer is to drop Silva deeper to play just in front of Ya Ya and Dinho. He has the ability to turn defence into attack with a single pass but is also great at keeping possession.

That way, an attacking three of say Jovetic, Negredo and Aguero could concentrate on doing what they do best.

But does that solve the problem of being left exposed? All three of those midfielders like getting forward and have limited defensive capabilities.

I don't disagree with playing 3 in midfield. Just not Yaya, Fernandhino and Garcia. Not even just in away games. There has to be some creativity there.

Garcia allows both Yaya and Fernandinho to break forward quickly and also press higher up the field.

Will be a good option in away games and defending a lead.

 

[BigOscar]

If you look at Barca's team that was so succesful

Busquets-Xavi
Iniesta
Pedro-Messi-Villa

only really Busquets is a real defensive presence, but the other 2 (and the wingers) press as a team closing off the space. Our equivalent of that would be something like

Garcia-Yaya/Fern
Silva/Nasri
Navas-Negredo-Aguero/Jovetic

Obviously Negredo is not Messi, but he can press like Messi (better than really, as Messi has decided he's too good to defend these days) but other than that it's just about getting the players we have to actually press high and effectively as a team. We could easily defend like Barca, but attack in our own style?

 

[The-Dogs-Pollocks]

Silva will start on the left but will naturally drift in

I'd go with:


Hart

Micah. Nasty. Vinnie. Clichy.

Fernan. Rodwell.

Yaya.

Navas. Silva.

Aguero.

You could easily change Milner for Rodwell and rotate the front three with nasri, jovetic and negredo when injuries or loss of form come in to play.

I think as long as the fullbacks were encouraged to overlap we would still have width, but we wouldn't be so open in midfield with two mobile box to box midfielders making up for yaya's lack of mobility and allowing him to make his trademark runs forward without leaving us too vulnerable at the back.

I also thought silva was a bit wasted stuck out on the left wing against hull. Playing him in behind the striker where he can hurt the opposition seems more logical to me. Ideally the front three could just interchange and try and find space to hurt the opposition without playing in too much of a rigid structure.

I really hope Pellers changes his plans and adopts something like a 433 from now on, as I can't remember too many worse home performances in the last couple of years watching city.

I just can't see how we will be able to retain possession of the ball with the formation and personnel we had out on the pitch against Hull, Yaya and Fernandinho against 5 opposing midfielders is going to be a massacre no matter if its Hull or Barcelona.

 

[Mr Ed (The Stables)]

I think it is quite clear to everyone that the two man midfield of Yaya and Fernandinho isn't working as neither of them have brilliant defensive capabilities and are fairly similar players in that they are both 'box to box'.

In our first few games against relatively poor opposition we have looked exposed as soon as one of Yaya or Fernandinho misplace a pass. Yaya takes an age to get back in position whilst Fernandinho has to cover a ridiculous amount of ground to clear it up.

The obvious solution would be to play a defensive midfielder in behind them. My personal choice would be Javi Garcia (yes, I know). We have only seen Garcia play in a two man midfield and it is clear that he is too slow for that formation. However, he continually gets selected for the World and European champions, Spain, who use a three man midfield. This way Javi doesn't have to cover too much ground and does what he does best, tackling.

However, the question I ask is: Is playing this formation practical?

Although it seems like the best solution, I fear that we have too many attacking players competing for just three more positions on the pitch.

Silva and Aguero I think it can be agreed should be guaranteed starters, leaving one position to be competed for by Jovetic, Negredo, Dzeko, Navas, Milner and Nasri.

Personally I can't see Manuel going for the three man midfield although in my opinion it would give us a lot more balance and would ease the pressure on the defence.

Maybe we should only use it for away matches?

Thoughts?

I agree we need Barry or Nigel De Jong holding it all together......whoops both of them no longer play for us.

Ermmmm Milner is only the other one.

Seriously in some games this season especially away if we just go with Yaya and Ferndandinho we'll get well and truly spanked especially with this high defensive line.

We can't always play the four fancy dans of Silva, Nevas, Aguero + another striker, in some games we will be able to play it especially at home.

As always only my opinion for what it's worth!!

 

[ROCKET80]

We all know it’s going to take a while for the players to become fully comfortable with the new system.

IMO the main difference between the performance against Newcastle and those v Cardiff and Hull was the absence of Kompany.

Our captain is one of (if not the) best centre-backs in the world and is able to adapt to any defensive system with ease. His ability to read the game along with his technique and ability on the ball means he can cope easily with the high defensive line allowing the 2 centre mids to support the attack. The current system basically calls for a CD to act as the defensive midfielder during opposition counter attacks. Kompany’s leadership was also missing, too many times against Hull Lescott and Nastasic looked unsure as whose responsibility it was to attack the ball in the middle of the park.

Nastasic is a fantastic young CB who is still learning his trade and has all the attributes to be able to adapt to this system. Lescott, as much as I like him, is not suited at all to this set up and his talents do not fit the system. We would have looked a lot more comfortable v Hull had it been Garcia/Nastasic partnership (not a popular belief I know) as Garcia would be more comfortable working in the area often patrolled by a DM. I fully expect us to be back to delivering performances like v Newcastle with Demichellis marshalling the back 4 in Kompany’s absence.

 

[AustinBlue]

I think it is quite clear to everyone that the two man midfield of Yaya and Fernandinho isn't working as neither of them have brilliant defensive capabilities and are fairly similar players in that they are both 'box to box'.
?

I reject this premise

 

[Jumanji]

I think it is quite clear to everyone that the two man midfield of Yaya and Fernandinho isn't working as neither of them have brilliant defensive capabilities and are fairly similar players in that they are both 'box to box'.
?

I reject this premise

Likewise. It is myth stemming from two poor collective team performances.

That said, the traditional terrier, Makele role if you will, defensive midfielder is dying amongst the top teams. The lesser teams continue to to employ them, however better sides are looking to get players that can supplement the attack on the pitch.

Look at Pellegrini loaning Barry. Look at Bayern, although they played one before in Gustavo, began phasing him out. It has since intensified under Pep. Opting against a traditional destroyer, they've sold Luis Gustavo and Emre Can. Real Madrid, Barca, Rags, Chelsea all opt for more versatile midfielders, for example.

Limited tough-tackling destroyers like Wanyama these days go to the Southamptons and such of the world. Sure you can find exceptions, De Jong at Milan for example, but these days mainly reactive managers use them...the type that want their team to sit deep, soak up pressure, hit teams on the break, and thus use traditional destroyers as a shield.

What most teams have is either a holding player, a physical presence or an intelligent player in the deep role. The rise of possession football has set a preference for the latter.

If a team does their job, and presses collectively like a Barca, you don't need a tough-tackling destroyer.

Top managers now believe that such a vital position on the pitch shouldn't be wasted on a player that can only tackle (a last resort action that means you did something wrong) or pass the ball 20 metres. You have be somewhat decent defensively, but moreso have a degree of finesse with the ball. That's why teams like Madrid can play Modric and Alonso deep in midfield. Tackling is overrated. Technique is not.

When Yaya and Fernandinho click, and we improve at team pressing (a tactic that all Pellers' side eventually get good at), we will be laughing.

 

[Ducado]

May be we have to give players the time to click?

 

[Deleted member 52846]

If you look at Barca's team that was so succesful

Busquets-Xavi
Iniesta
Pedro-Messi-Villa

only really Busquets is a real defensive presence, but the other 2 (and the wingers) press as a team closing off the space. Our equivalent of that would be something like

Garcia-Yaya/Fern
Silva/Nasri
Navas-Negredo-Aguero/Jovetic

Obviously Negredo is not Messi, but he can press like Messi (better than really, as Messi has decided he's too good to defend these days) but other than that it's just about getting the players we have to actually press high and effectively as a team. We could easily defend like Barca, but attack in our own style?

That Barça team didn't win as many trophies as this Barça team:
--------Yaya-----Xavi-----
-----------Iniesta----------
Messi-----Eto'o-----Henry

This Barça team won two trebles in 2009, one in the Summer and one in the Autumn.

Same sort of formation though.

 

[simon23]

I think it is quite clear to everyone that the two man midfield of Yaya and Fernandinho isn't working as neither of them have brilliant defensive capabilities and are fairly similar players in that they are both 'box to box'.
?

I reject this premise

Likewise. It is myth stemming from two poor collective team performances.

That said, the traditional terrier, Makele role if you will, defensive midfielder is dying amongst the top teams. The lesser teams continue to to employ them, however better sides are looking to get players that can supplement the attack on the pitch.

Look at Pellegrini loaning Barry. Look at Bayern, although they played one before in Gustavo, began phasing him out. It has since intensified under Pep. Opting against a traditional destroyer, they've sold Luis Gustavo and Emre Can. Real Madrid, Barca, Rags, Chelsea all opt for more versatile midfielders, for example.

Limited tough-tackling destroyers like Wanyama these days go to the Southamptons and such of the world. Sure you can find exceptions, De Jong at Milan for example, but these days mainly reactive managers use them...the type that want their team to sit deep, soak up pressure, hit teams on the break, and thus use traditional destroyers as a shield.

What most teams have is either a holding player, a physical presence or an intelligent player in the deep role. The rise of possession football has set a preference for the latter.

If a team does their job, and presses collectively like a Barca, you don't need a tough-tackling destroyer.

Top managers now believe that such a vital position on the pitch shouldn't be wasted on a player that can only tackle (a last resort action that means you did something wrong) or pass the ball 20 metres. You have be somewhat decent defensively, but moreso have a degree of finesse with the ball. That's why teams like Madrid can play Modric and Alonso deep in midfield. Tackling is overrated. Technique is not.

When Yaya and Fernandinho click, and we improve at team pressing (a tactic that all Pellers' side eventually get good at), we will be laughing.

While I agree with what you are saying there is a problem also......yaya isn't dynamic enough consistentlyfor it to work, esp against better teams. If we are going to adopt it then there has ri be a change in personnel and that will bea huge move.

With yaya playing as part of a pair in the middle we will always have big spaces....there needs to be a third player in there to do the dirty work....he isn't mobile enough over short distancesto play that role