Caroline Flack - rest in peace

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Whymewhynot said:
That’s what’s wrong with society. A woman doing it isn’t as bad due to “size” yet they want equality in any other way. She didn’t throw a lamp in a row, she smashed it over his head whilst he slept. Very easily could have ended much worse for him in that scenario. If you’re in the limelight and behave that way you rightly get what you give. Everyone moaning that people need to be nicer is a load of shite. I said it before and I’ll say it again; if that copper tops himself who twatted the football fan last week, would everyone call on the world to be nicer? No, he got shit for being an aggressive thug. The end.
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I don’t expect people to agree with that view but it’s my honest feeling nonetheless.

Do you know for sure that’s what happened?

A police officer, who is there to do a job, attacking a young lad by smashing him over the head with a truncheon is slightly different than a woman overreacting and attacking her boyfriend because she thinks he’s cheating. Both are very bad and illegal, don’t get me wrong but I just think there’s a slight difference.

I’m not excusing what she did and the law was quite rightly prosecuting her, I just think you can think that, condemn her actions, but whilst being sympathetic to a woman with lots of issues who has taken her own life.

I certainly don’t think it is “unforgivable”.
 
Ban-jani said:
I don’t expect people to agree with that view but it’s my honest feeling nonetheless.

Do you know for sure that’s what happened?

A police officer, who is there to do a job, attacking a young lad by smashing him over the head with a truncheon is slightly different than a woman overreacting and attacking her boyfriend because she thinks he’s cheating. Both are very bad and illegal, don’t get me wrong but I just think there’s a slight difference.

I’m not excusing what she did and the law was quite rightly prosecuting her, I just think you can think that, condemn her actions, but whilst being sympathetic to a woman with lots of issues who has taken her own life.

I certainly don’t think it is “unforgivable”.
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They are both violent acts which shouldn’t have happened. He’s been rightly abused, as she was. If he now tops himself it doesn’t change what’s happened
 
Gelsons Dad said:
There would be an outcry from "celebs" if social media was banned. It is their #1 platform for feeding their narcissism. Reality tV the same, it's the step ladder to social media stardom. The same type of people thrive on both. "the whole of society" doesn't care about either, but that part of society that does care are the same personality types that use it to feed their need.
What social media and the internet in general does is provide a conduit, how people use it is entirely based on their personality. Many of the most brilliant people on earth don't use it for self promotion. You haven't heard of them because the don't court fame.

Flack was one of thousands of showbiz types driven by narcissistic tendencies which were both her strength and her weakness. She did something terrible in circumstances which we don't fully understand but she did, and the impending trial appears to have been more than she could cope with.

A sad loss but I don't blame anyone or anything else for her actions.
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Social media doesn’t need to be banned.
A lot more should be done to punish those who post extreme vile abuse at anyone online.
 
Looks like the CPS were out to make an example of her. To show they can be tough on female domestic abuse too. Poor girl was a scapegoat and another victim of the moral less scum bag media.

Very much doubt she lamped him for no reason.
 
mancityvstoke said:
Out of interest how do you know exactly what happened?

He said ""What I witnessed today was horrible. She did not hit me with a lamp.. Arguments do happen every day in every relationship. Gutted I am not allowed to protect her right now."
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To be fair it is in the public domain because it has already been to court once. The 999 call records him say that she tried to kill him and body cameras record him saying him saying that she twatted him with a lamp while he was asleep. She found texts on his phone while he was kipping. While the police were there she went off on one saying she was going to kill herself, throw a table over and got violent and the police officers there had to physically restrain her on the ground
 
Uncle Wally One Ball said:
To be fair it is in the public domain because it has already been to court once. The 999 call records him say that she tried to kill him and body cameras record him saying him saying that she twatted him with a lamp while he was asleep. She found texts on his phone while he was kipping. While the police were there she went off on one saying she was going to kill herself, throw a table over and got violent and the police officers there had to physically restrain her on the ground
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yes but then he took it all back....so has to be disregarded.

just my opinion of course.

She will never be found guilty now anyway.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
As soon as he said he didn't want to press charges the CPS should have dropped the case. Pointless excercise that has no doubt partly resulted in Flack taking her life. Tragic and avoidable. I see the CPS has closed ranks like all public bodies do when under under criticism. No doubt they will offer some mealy mouthed statement saying no one was to blame but lessons will be learned in a month or so.
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Okay.

This was an evidence based prosecution and is pursued in the public interest if the victim does not or cannot support the case. Sometimes you need to protect someone when they cannot see it themselves.

There are a great many reports of domestic violence to the police, only a fraction of which are prosecuted and only a fraction of that are convicted.

There were 173 domestic violence murders in 2018 (https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-49459674)

It is to avoid the latter that the CPS pursue the former.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
As soon as he said he didn't want to press charges the CPS should have dropped the case. Pointless excercise that has no doubt partly resulted in Flack taking her life. Tragic and avoidable. I see the CPS has closed ranks like all public bodies do when under under criticism. No doubt they will offer some mealy mouthed statement saying no one was to blame but lessons will be learned in a month or so.
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Then 90%+ of domestic violence cases might be described as “pointless”. Victims routinely withdraw their complaint, often due to intimidation from their abuser. It’s quite rare when the CPs have independent evidence such as a 999 call that allows them to pursue a prosecution. Most of the time they’re banging their head against a brick wall. But still worth persevering in my opinion.
 
Whymewhynot said:
They are both violent acts which shouldn’t have happened. He’s been rightly abused, as she was. If he now tops himself it doesn’t change what’s happened
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First sentence I agree, 2nd I do not, 3rd I agree.

She was being abused on Twitter well before this incident and it’s not for the media to take the piss and ridicule people, prior to their trials.

Whilst I’m for a free press - they seriously need to have a moral rethink.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
As soon as he said he didn't want to press charges the CPS should have dropped the case.
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Maybe, maybe not. It depends what evidence was gathered on the night to prove that an assault did take place.

Either way, I'm not sure relying on alleged victims to press charges is the right way to get tough on domestic violence.
 
Dubai Blue said:
Maybe, maybe not. It depends what evidence was gathered on the night to prove that an assault did take place.

Either way, I'm not sure relying on alleged victims to press charges is the right way to get tough on domestic violence.
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So how do you prove without doubt what actually happened if the witness/victim says nothing happened?
 
cibaman said:
The vast majority of domestic cases fail because the complainant decides they don’t want to press charges. In many cases they may have decided that the incident was just a row that got out of hand and and don’t consider it serious enough for court action. But it’s also true that many complainants are pressured by their abuser to withdraw their complaint. I’m absolutely not saying that’s what happened in this case. But it seems to me to be quite right for the CPS to pursue a case where a complainant withdraws their complaint, if they believe that they have sufficient evidence to secure a conviction, even without the cooperation of the complaint.

it can’t be right that complainants should be able to veto a prosecution, because that would just increase the incentive for abusers to intimidate their victims into refusing to press charges.
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I do not disagree with a word you’ve said there. I have absolutely no problem with her being prosecuted and the CPS pursuing it.

My point is that the public and media should have acted differently towards her.
 
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mancityvstoke said:
So how do you prove without doubt what actually happened if the witness/victim says nothing happened?
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You present the original version of events from the 999 call and the body camera footage and let a jury decide whether they want to believe what he was saying at the time or what he eventually changed his story to.
 
Dubai Blue said:
You present the original version of events from the 999 call and the body camera footage and let a jury decide whether they want to believe what he was saying at the time or what he eventually changed his story to.
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Yes well that will never happen now....she's dead
 
mancityvstoke said:
yes but then he took it all back....so has to be disregarded.

just my opinion of course.

She will never be found guilty now anyway.
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It cant be though because it was all recorded on a phone call and on body worn cameras by the coppers who went there. Things cant be deleted and just ignored, and they are used to record things for exactly these circumstances. Plenty of victims down the years will have been coerced by abusers to drop charges, though not in this case, but things cannot just be disregarded as you suggest. The fact that he was fast asleep when smashed across the head with something will be the reason the CPS were running with this, with recorded evidence of her going mental at the scene.
It is a terrible tragic shame that he was unable to cope with this, and as others have said that will probably be because it is unreconcilable with the image on telly and in the social media stratosphere that celebs have to maintain. It is very sad.
 
Uncle Wally One Ball said:
It cant be though because it was all recorded on a phone call and on body worn cameras by the coppers who went there. Things cant be deleted and just ignored, and they are used to record things for exactly these circumstances. Plenty of victims down the years will have been coerced by abusers to drop charges, though not in this case, but things cannot just be disregarded as you suggest. The fact that he was fast asleep when smashed across the head with something will be the reason the CPS were running with this, with recorded evidence of her going mental at the scene.
It is a terrible tragic shame that he was unable to cope with this, and as others have said that will probably be because it is unreconcilable with the image on telly and in the social media stratosphere that celebs have to maintain. It is very sad.
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The actual event of smashing a lamp over his head whilst asleep was recorded? That makes a huge difference then.
 
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