City and corners

[blueinsa]

There is so much misinformation in this thread it is quite extraordinary. ALL teams struggle with scoring goals from corners and simply we are not as shit as the rest of them.

In one of the other "corners" threads I wrote last week:

There is this perception that we are shit at corners. Certainly that was the case last season when we were "corner counting" during that long sequence of shit. However, our overall record of goals scored from corners under Pelle is good. In fact no team has scored more in Pelle's time here albeit we are awarded more corners than most.

2013/2014 - Joint 1st ( City 12, Liverpool 12)
2014/2015 - Joint 4th (City 8 behind QPR 9, Chelsea 10, WBA 14)
2015/2016 - Joint 1st (City 6, Palace 6, Bournemouth 6, Norwich 6)

Since that post I've updated the tables so everyone can look at them warts and all. The tables are based on Premier League games only (2 1/2) seasons since Pelle took over at the start of 2013/2014. I've only included the 16 teams who have featured in all 3 seasons - 13/14, 14/15, 15/6.

1. Table 1 filtered by total goals scored from corners

From this you can see we have scored the most goals from corners since Pelle arrived - 26 goals in total from 697 corners. If you look at the C TOTAL column you will see that the figure of 697 corners is far, far higher than anyone else.

2. Table 2 filtered by goals scored per corner taken - GPC (reference to Ferguson unintended :) )

So the most efficient team is West Brom who score from a corner every c19 corners. As you can see we are a very healthy 3rd in the list with a goal every c27 corners.

Maybe we do practise them afterall :)

Excellent post mate.

Unfortunately its yet another stick to beat the manager with now and any corner taken that doesn't result in a goal obviously means he is a corpse/clown and needs to be sacked immediately with several witty fuckers on here claiming they will drive him to the airport themselves.

We cant defend either apparently despite proof we obviously can.

Bluemoon, you just have to love this place.

 

[01cravend]

Last season by Febuary we had two goals from corners....Also we only scored 5 headers all season... Where did the other six come from?

 

[the plasterer]

Excellent post mate.

Unfortunately its yet another stick to beat the manager with now and any corner taken that doesn't result in a goal obviously means he is a corpse/clown and needs to be sacked immediately with several witty fuckers on here claiming they will drive him to the airport themselves.

We cant defend either apparently despite proof we obviously can.

Bluemoon, you just have to love this place.

utter bollox!!, its not a thread to beat the manager at all, its pointing out how we persist with out swinging corners which we rarely threaten off rather than trying something different, which most city fans find frustrating

 

[richards30]

utter bollox!!, its not a thread to beat the manager at all, its pointing out how we persist with out swinging corners which we rarely threaten off rather than trying something different, which most city fans find frustrating

Agreed!! I think blueinsa is a really good poster but his constant assumption that everyone is always having a go at Manuel is misplaced. Our corners are appalling and either never beat the first man or are constantly out swinging to fucking no one

 

[Pablo ZZZ Peroni]

Agreed!! I think blueinsa is a really good poster but his constant assumption that everyone is always having a go at Manuel is misplaced. Our corners are appalling and either never beat the first man or are constantly out swinging to fucking no one

In fairness to blueinsa one of the many sticks used to beat Manuel with is our "appalling" corners records. The reality is that our corners in overall terms are not "appalling" relative to everyone else and even when the hard facts are staring you in the face people still ignore them. Every team is shit at corners we are just less shit than the rest.

 

[cibaman]

There is so much misinformation in this thread it is quite extraordinary. ALL teams struggle with scoring goals from corners and simply we are not as shit as the rest of them.

In one of the other "corners" threads I wrote last week:

There is this perception that we are shit at corners. Certainly that was the case last season when we were "corner counting" during that long sequence of shit. However, our overall record of goals scored from corners under Pelle is good. In fact no team has scored more in Pelle's time here albeit we are awarded more corners than most.

2013/2014 - Joint 1st ( City 12, Liverpool 12)
2014/2015 - Joint 4th (City 8 behind QPR 9, Chelsea 10, WBA 14)
2015/2016 - Joint 1st (City 6, Palace 6, Bournemouth 6, Norwich 6)

Since that post I've updated the tables so everyone can look at them warts and all. The tables are based on Premier League games only (2 1/2) seasons since Pelle took over at the start of 2013/2014. I've only included the 16 teams who have featured in all 3 seasons - 13/14, 14/15, 15/6.

1. Table 1 filtered by total goals scored from corners

From this you can see we have scored the most goals from corners since Pelle arrived - 26 goals in total from 697 corners. If you look at the C TOTAL column you will see that the figure of 697 corners is far, far higher than anyone else.

2. Table 2 filtered by goals scored per corner taken - GPC (reference to Ferguson unintended :) )

So the most efficient team is West Brom who score from a corner every c19 corners. As you can see we are a very healthy 3rd in the list with a goal every c27 corners.

Maybe we do practise them afterall :)

There have been other studies which have put the average conversion rate from corners at between 3% and 5% (depending on when you define a corner as being over). Interestingly, the standard of football doesn't make much difference (the conversion rate at the 2010 WC being identical to a study in the US involving college teams.)

It does seem to me that City tend to score from corners in clusters. The barren spells tend to stand out more than if we were scoring at regular intervals.

 

[Pablo ZZZ Peroni]

There have been other studies which have put the average conversion rate from corners at between 3% and 5% (depending on when you define a corner as being over). Interestingly, the standard of football doesn't make much difference (the conversion rate at the 2010 WC being identical to a study in the US involving college teams.)

It does seem to me that City tend to score from corners in clusters. The barren spells tend to stand out more than if we were scoring at regular intervals.

Yep, I'd seen your earlier post and almsot commented in my broad agreement. I also suspect we've read some of the same articles :)

In the tables I've put up the total number of corners is 8337 with 241 goals scored - a conversion rate of 2.89%. This is a bit lower than your range of 3% to 5% but broadly in the same ballpark and accept totally it depends on the definition of when the corner is over. The figures I'm using are pulled through from sites using OPTA feeds and IIRC their definition is it is a goal within 3 touches of the corner being taken.

I agree to an extent about the barren patches and that was highlighted in no uncertain terms during the "corner counting" sequence last year! City's record of conversion is good as per the tables but perception is skewed because all teams have a low conversion rate. In the example we have failed 671 times out of the 697 corners taken so it is human nature to see the negative from what they consider is repeated failure. This is then probably compounded from the likes of MOTD highlights and seeing a team scoring from a corner.

The inswinging/outgoing debate is another interesting one as well and this was prominent under Mancini as well.

 

[zandvoort blue]

And there my good friends is what you get if you play in-swinging corners

 

[zandvoort blue]

And there my good friends is what you get if you play in-swinging corners

I take it back. Out-swingers can also work.

 

[mad zab]

Even though we scored our first from an out-swinging corner, I do believe we would have more joy overall if we used the in-swinging corner. A right footer should take it from the left and a left footer from the right. If they are on the pitch then that would be De Bruyne and Kolarov, as they are our two best crossers of the ball.

 

[cibaman]

Yep, I'd seen your earlier post and almsot commented in my broad agreement. I also suspect we've read some of the same articles :)

In the tables I've put up the total number of corners is 8337 with 241 goals scored - a conversion rate of 2.89%. This is a bit lower than your range of 3% to 5% but broadly in the same ballpark and accept totally it depends on the definition of when the corner is over. The figures I'm using are pulled through from sites using OPTA feeds and IIRC their definition is it is a goal within 3 touches of the corner being taken.

I agree to an extent about the barren patches and that was highlighted in no uncertain terms during the "corner counting" sequence last year! City's record of conversion is good as per the tables but perception is skewed because all teams have a low conversion rate. In the example we have failed 671 times out of the 697 corners taken so it is human nature to see the negative from what they consider is repeated failure. This is then probably compounded from the likes of MOTD highlights and seeing a team scoring from a corner.

The inswinging/outgoing debate is another interesting one as well and this was prominent under Mancini as well.

I also think that when this subject is debated fans tend to only remember goals that are scored from headers. I'll bet that when this subject is debated again in a few months, many fans will have subconsciously discounted Yaya's goal. Just as Fernandhino's winner against Villa last season, Kompany's title clincher etc are not taken into account when people discuss the quality of our corners.

 

[Marvin]

Even though we scored our first from an out-swinging corner, I do believe we would have more joy overall if we used the in-swinging corner. A right footer should take it from the left and a left footer from the right. If they are on the pitch then that would be De Bruyne and Kolarov, as they are our two best crossers of the ball.

Silva's corners are generally poor. Kolarov and De Bruyne should take them all

 

[Keepingthefaithsince1976]

I think out swingers work better. It makes the goalie work harder as the ball is going away from him. It is easier for the attackers as heading the ball back the way it came from increases the ball speed. If the corner taker aims to get the ball at about 6.5-7 feet in the air at the penalty spot area we will undoubtedly score more.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

So let me get this right. The tables I posted suggest we get just about the best results than any other team in terms of goals scored from corners and that has been consistently the case for some time. So you completely ignore that and infer a complete lack of planning or working on anything. Your viewpoint doesn't make sense mate.

I've looked at the 6 league goals we scored from corners this season:
1) Kompany v West Brom - hit straight and delivered in front of the near post. Looped over the keeper to just inside the far post
2) Kompany v Chelsea - similar to (1) in delivery and headed across the keeper.
3) Otamendi v Norwich - out-swinging and delivered just in front of the penalty spot.
4) Delph v Southampton - Kept on the floor. Everyone missed it and it came to Delph just outside the 18-yard box. Got a deflection on the way in.
5) Bony v Swansea - In-swinger delivered to the near post
6) Toure v Watford - low one to the near post.

The only one which you could describe as a "traditional" corner was number 3, which was an out-swinger that landed in front of the penalty spot. Of the others, apart from 4, all were delivered to or in front of the near post. The ones we've not scored from, which have been the overwhelming majority, have been out-swingers delivered past the penalty spot.

The moral of the story is that 5 out of the 6 we've scored from have involved us doing something different. If we have 12 corners in a game, I'd expect to see maybe 4 to the near post, 6 towards the far post (but split between in and out-swingers and maybe a couple involving something like the one at Watford. But what we'll get is 11 out-swingers to a place beyond the penalty spot, where the chances of scoring are minimal. A corner is a chance to get the ball into the area on your terms. We should make more use of that opportunity and we don't.