City & FFP | 2020/21 Accounts released | Revenues of £569.8m, £2.4m profit (p 2395)

[Matty]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Here's this:

Has there been any clarification on this, that as well as a net spending limit of 60m euros, we can't add any new signings to our Champion's League squad for next season?
Marcotti seems to be claiming that, even though the sanctions make no reference to this punishment, that is because if it was public knowledge it would have a detrimental effect on our summer transfer dealings.
Personally I can't see us having accepted such a sanction, as it would leave us really struggling to attract the targets we'd be after. Would people be willing to join us and then watch a seasons champion's league go by with them in the stands?

I read it as saying we can only register £49m net of new players in the CL squad each year.

Just for next season though right (assuming we meet all the other sanction criteria)?

 

[TonyM]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

It all boils down to the fact that we are not sponsored enough. Football will end up like Tour de France eventually the way Uefa are going.

 

[Mikeegrini]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Apart from when he's got his maths fundamentally wrong you mean?

Nothing is stopping you from actually reading my post and understanding it.

I've read it, and I understand it. That doesn't change the fact it's actually wrong. Quite simply there is NO £50m payment. There are 2 10m Euro payments (withholding of prize money to be more accurate), the remaining 30m you are claiming is a payment we need to make is actually no such thing. It's actually an amount of "acceptable loses" for subsequent years. The 2 year period we're being assessed on currently had a 45m euro acceptable loss figure. For the assessment period using the 2013-14 and 2014-15 accounts clubs will be able to lose 30m euros, made up by whatever combination of profits/loses they like in those 2 years. It doesn't matter if the lose 40m euros in 13/14, and then make a 10m euro profit in 14/15, as long as the total loses aren't more than 30m euros they are fine. City don't have the same freedom. We must lose no more than 20m in the 13/14 year, and no more than 10m in the 14/15 year. Still makes a 30m loss overall, but with an enforced downward trend applied. This is not, and never will be, a 30m euro payment we have to make to UEFA. So therefore we do NOT have to pay them 50m euros overall, we just have to pay them 10m for the 13/14 season and 10m for the 14/15 season, to be paid out of withheld European prize money.

You can state you're right and I'm wrong as often as you like, doesn't make it true.

Am i correct in thinking the two 20mil " payments" will only be paid if we fail to meet the financial criteria for the next seasons?

 

[aguero93:20]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

@Matty, no for both years I reckon, £49m net this summer and £49m again next summer but since we don't need new attacking players we should be fine.
This it's just how I read it, your other post will be close at the least anyway, we'll have to deregister players to come within the squad size limit if we sign more than 2/3 players anyway and if we take somebody off the squad list they'll probably be sold anyway.
I'd expect to see Barca transfers as well, lower initial fees with add ons as it's a way around the net spend.

 

[Big Dave Watson]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

So as I understand it they withhold 10M this year and 10M next year. A further 30M will be withheld only if we fail to meet certain conditions. Could we therefore break the transfer limit condition an therefore forfeit the 30M suspended bit? If you see what I mean.

 

[Matty]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Nothing is stopping you from actually reading my post and understanding it.

I've read it, and I understand it. That doesn't change the fact it's actually wrong. Quite simply there is NO £50m payment. There are 2 10m Euro payments (withholding of prize money to be more accurate), the remaining 30m you are claiming is a payment we need to make is actually no such thing. It's actually an amount of "acceptable loses" for subsequent years. The 2 year period we're being assessed on currently had a 45m euro acceptable loss figure. For the assessment period using the 2013-14 and 2014-15 accounts clubs will be able to lose 30m euros, made up by whatever combination of profits/loses they like in those 2 years. It doesn't matter if the lose 40m euros in 13/14, and then make a 10m euro profit in 14/15, as long as the total loses aren't more than 30m euros they are fine. City don't have the same freedom. We must lose no more than 20m in the 13/14 year, and no more than 10m in the 14/15 year. Still makes a 30m loss overall, but with an enforced downward trend applied. This is not, and never will be, a 30m euro payment we have to make to UEFA. So therefore we do NOT have to pay them 50m euros overall, we just have to pay them 10m for the 13/14 season and 10m for the 14/15 season, to be paid out of withheld European prize money.

You can state you're right and I'm wrong as often as you like, doesn't make it true.

Am i correct in thinking the two 20mil " payments" will only be paid if we fail to meet the financial criteria for the next seasons?

No, both the 10m euro payments have to be made regardless of what we do in the next seasons financially. There is an additional 40m euro sanction currently suspended, which will only be applied if we fail to adhere to any of the sanctions handed down to us by UEFA.

 

[Mikeegrini]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

I've read it, and I understand it. That doesn't change the fact it's actually wrong. Quite simply there is NO £50m payment. There are 2 10m Euro payments (withholding of prize money to be more accurate), the remaining 30m you are claiming is a payment we need to make is actually no such thing. It's actually an amount of "acceptable loses" for subsequent years. The 2 year period we're being assessed on currently had a 45m euro acceptable loss figure. For the assessment period using the 2013-14 and 2014-15 accounts clubs will be able to lose 30m euros, made up by whatever combination of profits/loses they like in those 2 years. It doesn't matter if the lose 40m euros in 13/14, and then make a 10m euro profit in 14/15, as long as the total loses aren't more than 30m euros they are fine. City don't have the same freedom. We must lose no more than 20m in the 13/14 year, and no more than 10m in the 14/15 year. Still makes a 30m loss overall, but with an enforced downward trend applied. This is not, and never will be, a 30m euro payment we have to make to UEFA. So therefore we do NOT have to pay them 50m euros overall, we just have to pay them 10m for the 13/14 season and 10m for the 14/15 season, to be paid out of withheld European prize money.

You can state you're right and I'm wrong as often as you like, doesn't make it true.

Am i correct in thinking the two 20mil " payments" will only be paid if we fail to meet the financial criteria for the next seasons?

No, both the 10m euro payments have to be made regardless of what we do in the next seasons financially. There is an additional 40m euro sanction currently suspended, which will only be applied if we fail to adhere to any of the sanctions handed down to us by UEFA.

Cheers matty

 

[Matty]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

So as I understand it they withhold 10M this year and 10M next year. A further 30M will be withheld only if we fail to meet certain conditions. Could we therefore break the transfer limit condition an therefore forfeit the 30M suspended bit? If you see what I mean.

The first 10m is actually withheld from the UEFA prize money from the season we've just had (the 13/14 season), the second 10m will be withheld from the 14/15 prize money. The further sanction/withheld money is 40m euros rather than 30m and will only be applied if we break the transfer spending, or one of the other conditions of our settlement, like the allowable losses figures.

 

[aguero93:20]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

So as I understand it they withhold 10M this year and 10M next year. A further 30M will be withheld only if we fail to meet certain conditions. Could we therefore break the transfer limit condition an therefore forfeit the 30M suspended bit? If you see what I mean.

No, we'll just go round in circles getting more sanctions and they won't let us use the new signings in the champions league.
We don't need a big transfer window for the next few years anyway, strengthen defensive midfield and central defence and then we'd be getting rid of a player every time we brought in somebody new anyway.

 

[Len Rum]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

it's really sad when Joe Bernstein can work it out and some numbnuts on here can't

It's speculation pure and simple, and you are joining the fray, to be honest you having been on the WUM for a few days now, take this as a hint to desist
Cheers

it's not speculation it's simple arithmetic and if pointing out the elephant in the room to those who haven't noticed it is wumming then do your worst - I'm sure the Sheikh Sneerers etc will be delighted.

SSN now reporting the squad restrictions in the same way as the Fail.
On the ' 21 man squad' thread the 13+8 'ers seem to have won the legal argument, so unless we've negotiated something different this doesn't look good and brings into question our acceptance of the sanctions.