Coronavirus (2021) thread

[Octavian]

Seems that way:

Austria plans compulsory Covid vaccination for all

Country goes into fourth lockdown amid soaring cases and announces jab mandate from February 2022

www.theguardian.com

I've mixed feelings on it to be honest. I'm not fully on board with the idea of mandatory vaccinations but I can't help thinking it will be funny as fuck seeing the anti-vaxxers and Covid deniers lose their shit over it.

As for legalities, I'd have thought as long as Austria follow whatever protocols their own country has with regards to making it legal then it won't be an issue.

I can see it helping the nut jobs to be honest.

 

[grunge]

The countries with such mandates you were using as shining examples are now seeing surges.

1 question to ask yourself. How many people died of Covid in those countries over summer while having masks mandated vs the UK?

Granted they are having a spikes now and those spikes could match the aggregated amount over a 12 month period. Only time will tell on that one.

 

[Bluewonder]

So are you saying that science is wrong and mask-wearing doesn't reduce spread?

The countries where people are wearing masks are actually coping better right now:

• Masks in Europe 2020 | Statista

You've clearly made your mind up though - ignore science and facts if that's what you want. Don't complain when further restrictions are imposed though, because if everyone wears masks now there's a better chance we avoid that.

Do you agree or not that weeks ago, when you were campaigning for the UK to issue a mask mandate, under the false dichotomy of it preventing further restrictions in the future, that the countries you were using as examples of successful 'plan B' implementation are now experiencing the surge you forecast for the UK?

 

[west didsblue]

Seems that way:

Austria plans compulsory Covid vaccination for all

Country goes into fourth lockdown amid soaring cases and announces jab mandate from February 2022

www.theguardian.com

I've mixed feelings on it to be honest. I'm not fully on board with the idea of mandatory vaccinations but I can't help thinking it will be funny as fuck seeing the anti-vaxxers and Covid deniers lose their shit over it.

As for legalities, I'd have thought as long as Austria follow whatever protocols their own country has with regards to making it legal then it won't be an issue.

I don't agree with vaccine mandates. If people want to risk their own lives that's up to them. I am in favour of vaccine passports to be much more widely used though so that those happy to risk their own lives are kept away from places where they will be unnecessarily risking the lives of others.

 

[Bluewonder]

1 question to ask yourself. How many people died of Covid in those countries over summer while having masks mandated vs the UK?

Granted they are having a spikes now and those spikes could match the aggregated amount over a 12 month period. Only time will tell on that one.

There was a conscious decision made to bring our 'exit wave' into the summer.
I am not defending a government which I cannot stand but that was the thought process.
There were also substantially more economic and educational restrictions elsewhere, to the detriment of wider society.
As you said, we shall how the winter pans out across the board.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

was a conscious decision made to bring our 'exit wave' into the summer

Alternatively, there was a conscious decision to cross fingers and hope for the best because of the headbangers on Conservative back benches rebelling against government.

 

[Manchester33]

Do you agree or not that weeks ago, when you were campaigning for the UK to issue a mask mandate, under the false dichotomy of it preventing further restrictions in the future, that the countries you were using as examples of successful 'plan B' implementation are now experiencing the surge you forecast for the UK?

You're talking rubbish now. Avoid the question I asked because you know you can't answer it in a credible way. Can you give me quotes I've used for the bold part? (I'll save you the hassle, you can't).

Science proves mask-wearing reduces transmission. It's not difficult to understand. The countries whose populations wear masks more frequently and who have a higher % of fully vaccinated residents are fairing better.

If we had been forced to wear masks (which is such a minor inconvenience I don't see why you're getting so upset about it), our cases would unquestionably be lower (science proves this) meaning the NHS wouldn't have been under as much pressure (backlogs reduced, better care for those who do fall ill) and the levels of COVID would be lower (slowing the speed of an inevitable winter peak). All I wanted to see was people wearing a mask during the 15 minute commute on a packed train, or people who are easily able to work from home to be encouraged to do so. But, there are lots of selfish idiots who think their right to avoid minor inconvenience trumps saving the life of someone's parent or grandparent.

Because we weren't proactive, when our inevitable winter spike hits there's a bigger chance that we'll have to face larger more inconvenient restrictions. So if and when that happens, please don't complain because it's people like you who make the rational decision more difficult.

 

[Bluewonder]

You're talking rubbish now. Avoid the question I asked because you know you can't answer it in a credible way. Can you give me quotes I've used for the bold part? (I'll save you the hassle, you can't).

Science proves mask-wearing reduces transmission. It's not difficult to understand. The countries whose populations wear masks more frequently and who have a higher % of fully vaccinated residents are fairing better.

If we had been forced to wear masks (which is such a minor inconvenience I don't see why you're getting so upset about it), our cases would unquestionably be lower (science proves this) meaning the NHS wouldn't have been under as much pressure (backlogs reduced, better care for those who do fall ill) and the levels of COVID would be lower (slowing the speed of an inevitable winter peak). All I wanted to see was people wearing a mask during the 15 minute commute on a packed train, or people who are easily able to work from home to be encouraged to do so. But, there are lots of selfish idiots who think their right to avoid minor inconvenience trumps saving the life of someone's parent or grandparent.

Because we weren't proactive, when our inevitable winter spike hits there's a bigger chance that we'll have to face larger more inconvenient restrictions. So if and when that happens, please don't complain because it's people like you who make the rational decision more difficult.

Countries with vaccine passports, mask mandates, and various other 'Plan B'-type measures have recently seen a surge in cases. How difficult is that to understand?

Making people work from home is not a minor inconvenience. For some getting out to work is great for their career, their mental health, perhaps their own safety. The idea that one's individual choices should be so bluntly dismissed with the vague notion of saving a grandparent's life is just idiocy. Utter idiocy. Especially at a point when they are double vaxxed. If people cannot now make there own choices following the incredibly successful rollout of the vaccine, when?

And once again you use the false dichotomy of no restrictions now making further restrictions later an inevitably. Yet the evidence from across the continent suggests the opposite: restrictions beget restrictions.

 

[hgblue]

You're talking rubbish now. Avoid the question I asked because you know you can't answer it in a credible way. Can you give me quotes I've used for the bold part? (I'll save you the hassle, you can't).

Science proves mask-wearing reduces transmission. It's not difficult to understand. The countries whose populations wear masks more frequently and who have a higher % of fully vaccinated residents are fairing better.

If we had been forced to wear masks (which is such a minor inconvenience I don't see why you're getting so upset about it), our cases would unquestionably be lower (science proves this) meaning the NHS wouldn't have been under as much pressure (backlogs reduced, better care for those who do fall ill) and the levels of COVID would be lower (slowing the speed of an inevitable winter peak). All I wanted to see was people wearing a mask during the 15 minute commute on a packed train, or people who are easily able to work from home to be encouraged to do so. But, there are lots of selfish idiots who think their right to avoid minor inconvenience trumps saving the life of someone's parent or grandparent.

Because we weren't proactive, when our inevitable winter spike hits there's a bigger chance that we'll have to face larger more inconvenient restrictions. So if and when that happens, please don't complain because it's people like you who make the rational decision more difficult.

Two things. Why is the case rate higher in Wales where they retained the mask mandate? The logic behind getting as many people infected during the summer months when the virus is at it’s weakest is clear and obvious, we now have many more people with immunity should a winter wave hit.

 

[True_Blue69]

Unless you can claim to understand the reasons behind the "same levels for months" then I don't think you can claim it's likely to continue. And there were a few rapid up and down turns within those months too.

After all, Germany could claim similar through August, Sept, Oct.

There's a complex interplay between weather, behaviour, immunity waning, infections and vaccinations. Beware anyone making confident predictions IMO.

My point exactly. The OP made a confident prediction it would be getting worse. Did you tell them the same thing you just told me? No, because you have your own agenda which is to refuse to accept the scientists and government in this country have also done a pretty decent job bar the start of the pandemic and that their decisions might actually be paying off.

Before you start throwing graphs around that could mean anything, are we on the verge of a lockdown? No.

Is our health service under any more pressure than usual? No

Are deaths rapidly rising? No

Are we living a normal life again? Yes

all facts.