Discussion: Manuel Pellegrini 2015/16

[Abattoir Blue]

Although I get the reasoning, I personally struggle that anyone could have their role in question when they have either completed all of the targets given to them, or likewise haven't had the opportunity to fail at at least one of them yet.

get behind Prllegrini whilst we are still challenging in every single competition we entered this season. Once they are unrealistic then absolutely. The club may well have already got a deal with Guardiola. As fans, then rather than think about that already and how much better it might be, let's support the current manager so he doesn't play out the rest of the season knowing he's unwanted or a dead man walking, as that just helps it come true [QUOTE/]

3rd in Prem, 3 points off the top.
Last 16 of CL, with a seeded berth in the draw
Semi Final of the LC
3rd round of the FA Cup

Some people need to wind their necks in a little.

Yes it's disappointing to lose games (especially the Stoke performance), but we are never playing against 11 dummies. Every game we will play against highly paid professionals who are up for it and have been analysing our strengths and weaknesses. With fans behind them thinking that their team can and should win, just like us.

Occasionally we will lose these games. Mostly we don't, and haven't during Pellers' time here - whilst playing v.good football. What more do people want?

Add to that the fact that no manager of any pedigree would take over mid season when rumours are flying that Pep will be here in the summer. He's going nowhere til May at the earliest.

So - moan on here if you want, but get behind the team and manager during the games!

 

[Keepingthefaithsince1976]

I want him to go.

I think he is the wrong man to be in charge of this club & we are much better than we appear to be. Last seaon marginal & benefit of the doubt due to ffp, but this season with new signings & a whole bunch of talented kids, we are immense imo & the boss has not managed us properly.

I've supported him for 2 seasons, now I've had enough. He's not as good as the club.

He is now officially, without a shadow of doubt, unequivocally the most successful City manager ever. We never made the champs league last sixteen and he qualified 3 times running...Once as group winners....and YOU still want him out. You have serious problems pal...but your probably a red so why should we care.

 

[Pablo ZZZ Peroni]

I disagree with this, of course its a reason. I don't think there is anything wrong with that strategy, if everyone is implementing as they should. However the real issue is we that don't implement it consistently, and there's a very good reason for that this season imho, and its the lack of stability in the back 4, and whoever is playing in front of them. The only run we've had where it was consistent was the first 5 games, and we won them all without conceding a goal, so it does definitely work.

We've lost 4 league games, 2 of them we should have won West Ham H, and Spurs A ( we didn't because we didn't take the chances provided), 2 of them we were well beaten Liverpool H, and Stoke A. We've also lost 2 CL games, one of which we blew by not taking our chances early on, the second by conceding a sloppy goal, and being unable to recover from it.

I don't know the stats, but one of our biggest issues is not taking our chances consistently, we've had games like Newcastle and even Monchengladbach, where we can destroy a team in minutes with clinical finishing, then others like Spurs and West Ham, where we have been well on top and missed a bag full. I'd wager we've had more shots on target than anyone else, and yet taken a smaller proportion of the ones created.

Both issues highlighted are down to individuals for me, the lack of consistency in defence to operate the high line effectively (mainly down to constant changing of players, this time enforced), and the missed (often easy) chances.

The manager has certainly made mistakes, don't think there is any doubt about that, but its not solely on his plate like some would suggest.

You are on the right lines as regards the stats and we are simply not converting the chances to the same extent as we were in 2013/2014 and, to a lesser extent, 2014/2015. Ironically, bearing in mind the extreme criticism, the underlying defensive stats have improved and are actually quite superb! Ignoring what we see with our own eyes and looking at it through stats the problems are to do with scoring and not conceding.

CHANCES CREATED PER GAME

2013/14 - 17.7
2014/15 - 17.6
2015/2016 - 17.3

ATTEMPTS ON TARGET PER GAME

2013/2014 - 6.3
2014/2015 - 6.0
2015/2016 - 6.6

GOALS SCORED PER GAME

2013/2014 - 2.68
2014/2015 - 2.18
2015/2016 - 2.00

For all of the above, our numbers are either the highest or second highest. Overall, there is not too much difference between the seasons in terms of attempts/attempts on target but the drop off from 2.68 goals per game to 2.00 per game now is large. Another 10 or 12 goals spread over the last 15 league games would have made a huge difference.

Defensively, we continue to concede on average 1 goal per game. Absolutely nothing wrong with that if you are scoring at the other end. The stat that amuses me most is the number of attempts we concede per game. Currently we are restricting our opponents to on average 8.3 attempts per game. It is lower than United and actually the 3rd lowest in Europe behind Bayern and Dortmund. Just goes to show there is method behind the perceived defensive madness of Pelle and really he is a defensive mastermind :)

 

[Phil1]

He is now officially, without a shadow of doubt, unequivocally the most successful City manager ever. We never made the champs league last sixteen and he qualified 3 times running...Once as group winners....and YOU still want him out. You have serious problems pal...but your probably a red so why should we care.

Oh do fuck off. I'd put more stock in Neville Neville being a blue than you.

 

[Neville Kneville]

He is now officially, without a shadow of doubt, unequivocally the most successful City manager ever. We never made the champs league last sixteen and he qualified 3 times running...Once as group winners....and YOU still want him out. You have serious problems pal...but your probably a red so why should we care.

So because I think we can do better than Pellegrini, I have serious problems & am probably a Utd supporter.

This from the bloke who thinks losing to Liverpool is no different to losing to anyone else ?

That was you wasn't it ?

 

[Neville Kneville]

So I think the quadruple comment may have been aimed at me. I do not think that we will win the quadruple, but I find it amazing that you seem completely closed to the idea of Pellers staying, regardless of what he may achieve this year. I guess to each their own, but I would embrace that type of success with both arms and leg

If I thought Pellegrini was the only manager who could bring success to City, I would want him to stay. I don't.

I think others could, & will, do better. In every aspect of the club, not just the first team. I have great memories of his first season, where he had the team playing some of the best football we have ever seen, but I also remember how he continually had the back 4 making the same mistakes for weeks on end, & how he played Negredo in a meaningless game, getting him injured, & then playing him whilst carrying an injury, & how we slipped down the league & almost lost it & Negredo was never the same player for us again, after looking like the best striker in the league prior to that day. I also remember a fantastic display from Rony Lopes, who proved he could perform v Premier League opposition but has barely played for City since & is now gone.

Both those things are classic Pellegrini imo & he will continue like that forever, good & bad.

So it's thanks for some great memories, & goodbye, from me.

 

[cibaman]

Although I get the reasoning, I personally struggle that anyone could have their role in question when they have either completed all of the targets given to them, or likewise haven't had the opportunity to fail at at least one of them yet.

It seems some have bought fully into the European idea of the head coach and the three year cycle that Soriano spoke about. That isn't necessarily the best model either though. If the rest of the structure is in place and is independent of the manager (which was always the issue of replacing a Ferguson type manager - their control over the whole club), then conversely I don't see the harm in keeping a head coach if they are fulfilling their targets. There are benefits to it too - continued stability of playing style, development of players in the same ethos, reduced pressure of seeing it as such a short cycle that results are paramount so youth aren't blooded as much as they could be (which is what Pellegrini has been guilty of).

I just find it too early to judge either way what the right thing to do at the end of the season is, particularly if Guardiola has a u turn and stays at Bayern. I'd rather either wait until the end of the season and assess the situation, or at least wait until one of the targets is no longer achievable.

I just feel if we are not careful, we are going to end up in a situation where the targets set for a head coach are going to be so high, they all seem like a disappointment, and so the underlying feeling will be to make a change, increasing the pressure and reducing their chances. Take Guardiola now or Ancelotti at Real. Guardiola will be judged on whether he wins the CL at Bayern, anything else and he's a failure in some peoples eyes and he knows that. I can guarantee the season after he goes, they won't win it either though unless with a bit of luck - it is a cup competition after all and why I struggle with it being used as a sole target. Likewise, I don't believe giving Benitez the Madrid role is likely to see any more benefit than if they had allowed Ancelotti another season to continue to progress the areas he felt needed work.

I just don't think there is a right or wrong answer to this apart from get behind Prllegrini whilst we are still challenging in every single competition we entered this season. Once they are unrealistic then absolutely. The club may well have already got a deal with Guardiola. As fans, then rather than think about that already and how much better it might be, let's support the current manager so he doesn't play out the rest of the season knowing he's unwanted or a dead man walking, as that just helps it come true.

I think the owners are keen to ensure a managed transition from Pellegrini to his successor. A summer handover rather than a mid season Hughes type sacking. Given Pellegrini's age and the stuff about 3 year cycles the owners are inevitably going to review his position towards the end of each season and will consider whether the time is right to replace him, whether he's taken the squad as far as he can, whether there's a suitable replacement available. It will be a decision based more on how they view the future under Pellegrini rather than how many trophies he has won, how many targets he has achieved.

 

[Keepingthefaithsince1976]

Oh do fuck off. I'd put more stock in Neville Neville being a blue than you.

Don't let the facts get in the way of your story.

 

[Keepingthefaithsince1976]

So because I think we can do better than Pellegrini, I have serious problems & am probably a Utd supporter.

This from the bloke who thinks losing to Liverpool is no different to losing to anyone else ?

That was you wasn't it ?

Ah was that you who thought some losses are different? 3 points or did the rules change?

 

[mancityvstoke]

Funny how people who wanted rid of Mancini for Pellegrini now want rid of Pellegrini.

It's a funny old game..............