Do you support the RMT?

[inbetween]

Nope I won’t complain. It’s a waste of time. The usual excuses are Covid and cut backs so I have heard them all before.
If we had a bottomless pit in Society bring all the changes on
However, we definitely probably disagree with what the problems are and how to cure them, but two thing I am sure is, it’s not all about money, or down to a particular political party

The critical error you are making is you are comparing business experience with that of running critical infrastructure but these two things are completely incompatible.

With respect I don't know which industry you are/were in but I'd bet that if your company went bust then it wouldn't matter. This however is public transport, it can't go bust and it cannot just be left to rot or somehow reduce because the impact is catastrophic. Trains are not limited to train drivers, you have maintenance people and people doing work on the lines for example that literally could save your life. Surely if you needed surgery you'd want the best paid and most experienced surgeon as opposed to the new lad on minimum wage?

I've seen this in the airlines where companies have been pressuring crews for years. Pilots are on very good money because the competition for pilots is fierce but they do like to chip away at their working conditions. In one very large airline they famously have fuel saving leaderboards where pilots are punished for taking too much fuel on a flight.... Remember that we're talking about aircraft, aircraft require fuel and they definitely always crash without it.

Critical infrastructure and especially safety critical infrastructure should not be treated this way and it definitely should not be subjected to business cost-cutting without good reason. When you get on a plane or train you expect the best trained and most highly paid people to take you there safely. They deserve every penny they need because we want the best people and they need to live their lives without stress so that they can do their jobs properly.

 

[halfmist]

claptrap, it just needs to right people in the right room if China and Russia don't want to be involved then fine, No outside trade for them. they'll soon come around that actually a small percentage of tax on everyone is fine. Like I said if you think it's impossible then it's impossible for you in reality it is possible

As someone who has spent the majority of his professional career in taxation including overseas double taxation agreements and how difficult they have been to get on a country by country basis believe me it is not claptrap.
I could recommend a couple of books which back up my case but they would be a bit more technical than just putting the right people, whoever they may be , in the right room.

 

[meltonblue]

The government put in constraints because they’re acting on behalf of the tax payer who will have to fund any settlement
If they just cave in to everyone’s demands to court popularity you may as well say form an orderly queue.

We’re a long way past thinking anything our current government does is actually acting on behalf of the tax payer surely, aside from very specific sections.

 

[urban genie]

So in your opinion, there will not be staff shortages in essential services and tough luck on the guy who will be put out of businesses due to the strike action or are they just the price that has to be paid.

Where have I voiced that opinion, don't twist my comments on the standards of journalism to suit your arguement.

I never said people wouldn't be affected, but I also never took a couple of 1 minute long commentaries as the overriding opinion of the genearal public and make statements that there is not support for this from joe public, mainly as I don't know how much of the populace support this and neither do you.

Vox pops are the worst kind of news journalism and not one I would use to base an arguement for my stance.

 

[Blue Maverick]

I love how they come out with moral narrative, every strike affects people in some moral way, fire service have had it loads, but no one takes striking lightly, firstly they lose money at these hard times secondly letting people down is another factor. The government are a set of twats, get that magic money tree out again Sunak otherwise there could well be a winter of discontent. I know the MPs have an independent pay review body I wonder how much increase they will get because they’ve been getting way above what other public sector workers have over recent years.
Double figure pay rises will be asked for and the private sector will be up in arms, greedy public sector, go get another job if you don’t like it narrative, I wonder how they would feel if many nurses took them up on that and went private or moved abroad and the waiting lists increase etc, but I suppose a good hand clap with pay their electricity bill!
The government could slash taxes on petrol etc to help out or from all that extra income increase wages across the board, the RMT is not the train drivers as they government are trying to push it’s the other low paid workers that are asking for a decent wage, by all accounts ministers are preventing the negotiations are they afraid should a decent agreement be made it will have a snowball effect within other industrie?

 

[urban genie]

I love how they come out with moral narrative, every strike affects people in some moral way, fire service have had it loads, but no one takes striking lightly, firstly they lose money at these hard times secondly letting people down is another factor. The government are a set of twats, get that magic money tree out again Sunak otherwise there could well be a winter of discontent. I know the MPs have an independent pay review body I wonder how much increase they will get because they’ve been getting way above what other public sector workers have over recent years.
Double figure pay rises will be asked for and the private sector will be up in arms, greedy public sector, go get another job if you don’t like it narrative, I wonder how they would feel if many nurses took them up on that and went private or moved abroad and the waiting lists increase etc, but I suppose a good hand clap with pay their electricity bill!
The government could slash taxes on petrol etc to help out or from all that extra income increase wages across the board, the RMT is not the train drivers as they government are trying to push it’s the other low paid workers that are asking for a decent wage, by all accounts ministers are preventing the negotiations are they afraid should a decent agreement be made it will have a snowball effect within other industrie?

Accordingto the ONS average total pay growth for the private sector was 8.2% in the private sector while for the public sector it was 1.6%

For the last 5 years I have had a 0.5%-1% increase, which after a lot of "negotiating" has for 3 years come not as a rise per hour bit a one off payment for the year, this normally has worked out about £20 extra a month, in escence less than a12p an hr rise .

I am also like most public sector workers on a pay band and at the top of it, so there is no next level pay I can move up to or increments or bonuses.

The myth peddled by many in power that everyone is having a good life working for the public serves brings shame on governments past and present.

 

[west didsblue]

The government put in constraints because they’re acting on behalf of the tax payer who will have to fund any settlement
If they just cave in to everyone’s demands to court popularity you may as well say form an orderly queue.

RMT workers are not public sector workers paid for by the taxpayer. The TOCs are private companies that get government payments for running services. During the pandemic they operated under Emergency Measures Agreements which effectively made TOC employees public sector workers. That arrangement ended in October 2021 and TOC employees are now fully back in the private sector (apart from a couple of franchises that are still in the public sector). Unlike other private companies the government are restricting how the TOCs operate which is why there is no prospect of an agreement.

 

[dave_blue12]

Whilst I have sympathy with the aims of the strikers, what’s different about this strike is that the government clearly want it to happen. What’s important to them is the creation of division because having one half of the population in conflict with the other half is how they see their best chance of retaining power by trying to be seen as on the side of the rail using public. Why else would the government constrain the operating companies negotiating position. The government obviously don’t give a fuck about the economic impact on the country as has been demonstrated over the last few years where they have overseen whole sectors struggling with the effects of Brexit on top of the pandemic and war in Ukraine. It’s the first time in my lifetime that we have a government that exists not for the advancement and wellbeing of the country but solely for keeping themselves in power at the expense of everything else.

You are absolutely correct. The Government are delighted with this strike and will have put the rail companies under pressure not to negotiate.

Divide and rule is the Tory motto. Oh and tell as many lies as possible.

 

[Vic]

Where have I voiced that opinion, don't twist my comments on the standards of journalism to suit your arguement.

I never said people wouldn't be affected, but I also never took a couple of 1 minute long commentaries as the overriding opinion of the genearal public and make statements that there is not support for this from joe public, mainly as I don't know how much of the populace support this and neither do you.

Vox pops are the worst kind of news journalism and not one I would use to base an arguement for my stance.

Maybe Joe Public doesn't grasp what the agenda is.

"Secret plan to close all railway ticket offices as strikes grip Britain... " (Sunday Times yesterday)

Most people rolling up at stations to buy a ticket would prefer to buy from the ticket office than use the machines, which can offer so many alternatives that it takes an age to get what you want.

 

[blueinsa]

In normal times I’d be against strike action but sadly these are not normal times and I can only foresee things getting even worse.

A message has to be sent to government that the public and workers are not going to stay silent whilst we get fucked over at the expense of what I see as corporate greed enabled by a morally corrupt government.

Right now I’m in favour of strikes and civil protest/action to ensure the millions of ordinary hard working citizens get a fair deal.