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Re: English Talent
Nick powell, possibly sturridge
Nick powell, possibly sturridge
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English (Home Grown) Talent
- Thread starter bluemoondays
- Start date
lost_n_spaced
Well-Known Member
Re: English Talent
OK, just to put this to bed : There is only one decent English player under the age of 21, and that is Oxlade-Chamberlain.
A damning indictment of the English game, yes, but nevertheless the truth.
Walcott is absolutely shaft (sorry, Theo fans). A fantastic sprinter, yes, but a very, very average footballer. Same for Redmond and Zaha.
I've coached kids where i live (in Germany) and their technical level is infinitely better than i saw when I was growing up in Manchester (and, I suspect, now). In the UK we pick athletes and try to convert them into footballers, or pick footballers according to their physical size.
I mean, if we can have a midfield with Henderson, Milner, Parker & Walcott in (as would seem a realistic possibility for the opening game v. France) something HAS to be going wrong. Crikey, there were even calls to bring back a player who retired from football totally at the end of the season before last.
The UK game is in serious trouble, which is why we are trying to found our academy on players brought in from all over the place, why we seem to release most British under-18's, and why our most promising ones are Rekik, Suarez, Razak, Ibrahim & Rusnak (OK, you could put Henshall & Bunn there as well, but they'll both, IMO, have Championship careers).
The only world-class youth that we've brought through in the past 20 years is from the place I grew up, and unfortunately he was injury prone and had a bit of a fondness for the beer. He could have been a great (and I mean world-wide, not just a City great).
OK, just to put this to bed : There is only one decent English player under the age of 21, and that is Oxlade-Chamberlain.
A damning indictment of the English game, yes, but nevertheless the truth.
Walcott is absolutely shaft (sorry, Theo fans). A fantastic sprinter, yes, but a very, very average footballer. Same for Redmond and Zaha.
I've coached kids where i live (in Germany) and their technical level is infinitely better than i saw when I was growing up in Manchester (and, I suspect, now). In the UK we pick athletes and try to convert them into footballers, or pick footballers according to their physical size.
I mean, if we can have a midfield with Henderson, Milner, Parker & Walcott in (as would seem a realistic possibility for the opening game v. France) something HAS to be going wrong. Crikey, there were even calls to bring back a player who retired from football totally at the end of the season before last.
The UK game is in serious trouble, which is why we are trying to found our academy on players brought in from all over the place, why we seem to release most British under-18's, and why our most promising ones are Rekik, Suarez, Razak, Ibrahim & Rusnak (OK, you could put Henshall & Bunn there as well, but they'll both, IMO, have Championship careers).
The only world-class youth that we've brought through in the past 20 years is from the place I grew up, and unfortunately he was injury prone and had a bit of a fondness for the beer. He could have been a great (and I mean world-wide, not just a City great).
Re: English Talent
A bit unfair, I would say there are plenty of "decent" English players under-21, the problem is too many of them don't fulfill their potential. Wilshere is a fantastic player and still only 20, hopefully this long injury won't hurt his career too much. And if you look in academies there is loads of talent, it just seems like 90% of them don't reach the level they seem capable of.
In that list of our most promising players you leave out Hiwula who scored around 30 goals last season and was one of the standout players of our youth system. And he's English too, let's just hope he develops into a good player at senior level. Ashley Smith-Brown in the 16s is supposed to be a gem too.
A bit unfair, I would say there are plenty of "decent" English players under-21, the problem is too many of them don't fulfill their potential. Wilshere is a fantastic player and still only 20, hopefully this long injury won't hurt his career too much. And if you look in academies there is loads of talent, it just seems like 90% of them don't reach the level they seem capable of.
In that list of our most promising players you leave out Hiwula who scored around 30 goals last season and was one of the standout players of our youth system. And he's English too, let's just hope he develops into a good player at senior level. Ashley Smith-Brown in the 16s is supposed to be a gem too.
lost_n_spaced
Well-Known Member
Re: English Talent
I was going to include Hiwala, but - a bit like Meppin-Walters in extremely one dimensional - Hiwala is a bit Miller / Heskey-esque (again, i stress that this is solely my opinion).
He scored a lot of goals mainly down to the fact that - physically - he is far more developed than most of the opposition. This won't be the case when he moves up and he will probably go on to be another of these Marvin Emnes / Kenwye Jones type target men.
The last thing is that - fortunately for us - 'decent' no longer cuts it. The reason i stressed MJ as being the only good young player brought through in the last 20 years is because i think that he would probably get into our midfield now (and lets face it, its a bloody world-class midfield).
I was going to include Hiwala, but - a bit like Meppin-Walters in extremely one dimensional - Hiwala is a bit Miller / Heskey-esque (again, i stress that this is solely my opinion).
He scored a lot of goals mainly down to the fact that - physically - he is far more developed than most of the opposition. This won't be the case when he moves up and he will probably go on to be another of these Marvin Emnes / Kenwye Jones type target men.
The last thing is that - fortunately for us - 'decent' no longer cuts it. The reason i stressed MJ as being the only good young player brought through in the last 20 years is because i think that he would probably get into our midfield now (and lets face it, its a bloody world-class midfield).
JimmyFrizz
Active Member
- Joined
- 20 Nov 2010
- Messages
- 33
Re: English Talent
I always rate Victor Moses, whenever I watch him play. Still a bit raw, but worth a place in our squad imo.
I always rate Victor Moses, whenever I watch him play. Still a bit raw, but worth a place in our squad imo.
Re: English Talent
Sorry Marvin Emnes a target man?
lost_n_spaced said:I was going to include Hiwala, but - a bit like Meppin-Walters in extremely one dimensional - Hiwala is a bit Miller / Heskey-esque (again, i stress that this is solely my opinion).
He scored a lot of goals mainly down to the fact that - physically - he is far more developed than most of the opposition. This won't be the case when he moves up and he will probably go on to be another of these Marvin Emnes / Kenwye Jones type target men.
The last thing is that - fortunately for us - 'decent' no longer cuts it. The reason i stressed MJ as being the only good young player brought through in the last 20 years is because i think that he would probably get into our midfield now (and lets face it, its a bloody world-class midfield).
Sorry Marvin Emnes a target man?
Roll On City
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- 17 Mar 2012
- Messages
- 883
Re: English Talent
If Walcott plays under Mancini for a year or two, I can guarantee he will become a much better player, he's not hack it under Wenger, look at Clichy 7 years under Wenger, meh gooners fans we're happy to see his back, one of the most improved player just a season under Mancini, how much Clichy's value now?lost_n_spaced said:OK, just to put this to bed : There is only one decent English player under the age of 21, and that is Oxlade-Chamberlain.
A damning indictment of the English game, yes, but nevertheless the truth.
Walcott is absolutely shaft (sorry, Theo fans). A fantastic sprinter, yes, but a very, very average footballer. Same for Redmond and Zaha.
I've coached kids where i live (in Germany) and their technical level is infinitely better than i saw when I was growing up in Manchester (and, I suspect, now). In the UK we pick athletes and try to convert them into footballers, or pick footballers according to their physical size.
I mean, if we can have a midfield with Henderson, Milner, Parker & Walcott in (as would seem a realistic possibility for the opening game v. France) something HAS to be going wrong. Crikey, there were even calls to bring back a player who retired from football totally at the end of the season before last.
The UK game is in serious trouble, which is why we are trying to found our academy on players brought in from all over the place, why we seem to release most British under-18's, and why our most promising ones are Rekik, Suarez, Razak, Ibrahim & Rusnak (OK, you could put Henshall & Bunn there as well, but they'll both, IMO, have Championship careers).
The only world-class youth that we've brought through in the past 20 years is from the place I grew up, and unfortunately he was injury prone and had a bit of a fondness for the beer. He could have been a great (and I mean world-wide, not just a City great).
lost_n_spaced
Well-Known Member
Re: English Talent
Kind of my point. He's neither use nor ornament.
Edwaardz said:lost_n_spaced said:I was going to include Hiwala, but - a bit like Meppin-Walters in extremely one dimensional - Hiwala is a bit Miller / Heskey-esque (again, i stress that this is solely my opinion).
He scored a lot of goals mainly down to the fact that - physically - he is far more developed than most of the opposition. This won't be the case when he moves up and he will probably go on to be another of these Marvin Emnes / Kenwye Jones type target men.
The last thing is that - fortunately for us - 'decent' no longer cuts it. The reason i stressed MJ as being the only good young player brought through in the last 20 years is because i think that he would probably get into our midfield now (and lets face it, its a bloody world-class midfield).
Sorry Marvin Emnes a target man?
Kind of my point. He's neither use nor ornament.
lost_n_spaced
Well-Known Member
Re: English Talent
I told two close friends who are Arsenal fans - at the beginning of the season - that clichy would have an amazing year (due to the face that Wenger is completely unable to coach defenders).
The same cannot be said for attackers, and if he cannot be effective at Arsenal (who completely disregard the defensive aspect of the game) then i can't see where he will play well. His hero, Henry, adapted well from a winger to a striker because he had the natural ability. Walcott just has pace. No finishing, no ability to cross or pick the right pass, just pace.
I also lost a great deal of respect for Walcott during their 8-2 drubbing at the Swamp last year when he was mercilessly having a go at his own full-back (a young lad, making one of his first appearances, who had only come on due to injury to Sagna).
Not a lad I'd ever have in my team (plus, are we really going to bear with him for two years before deciding whether he can come good or not ? We may as well persist with AJ who is infinitely more skilled, can finish and cross, but who needs to stop over egging the pudding and be a bit more disciplined. He's far closer to the finished article than Walcott).
Roll On City said:If Walcott plays under Mancini for a year or two, I can guarantee he will become a much better player, he's not hack it under Wenger, look at Clichy 7 years under Wenger, meh gooners fans we're happy to see his back, one of the most improved player just a season under Mancini, how much Clichy's value now?lost_n_spaced said:OK, just to put this to bed : There is only one decent English player under the age of 21, and that is Oxlade-Chamberlain.
A damning indictment of the English game, yes, but nevertheless the truth.
Walcott is absolutely shaft (sorry, Theo fans). A fantastic sprinter, yes, but a very, very average footballer. Same for Redmond and Zaha.
I've coached kids where i live (in Germany) and their technical level is infinitely better than i saw when I was growing up in Manchester (and, I suspect, now). In the UK we pick athletes and try to convert them into footballers, or pick footballers according to their physical size.
I mean, if we can have a midfield with Henderson, Milner, Parker & Walcott in (as would seem a realistic possibility for the opening game v. France) something HAS to be going wrong. Crikey, there were even calls to bring back a player who retired from football totally at the end of the season before last.
The UK game is in serious trouble, which is why we are trying to found our academy on players brought in from all over the place, why we seem to release most British under-18's, and why our most promising ones are Rekik, Suarez, Razak, Ibrahim & Rusnak (OK, you could put Henshall & Bunn there as well, but they'll both, IMO, have Championship careers).
The only world-class youth that we've brought through in the past 20 years is from the place I grew up, and unfortunately he was injury prone and had a bit of a fondness for the beer. He could have been a great (and I mean world-wide, not just a City great).
I told two close friends who are Arsenal fans - at the beginning of the season - that clichy would have an amazing year (due to the face that Wenger is completely unable to coach defenders).
The same cannot be said for attackers, and if he cannot be effective at Arsenal (who completely disregard the defensive aspect of the game) then i can't see where he will play well. His hero, Henry, adapted well from a winger to a striker because he had the natural ability. Walcott just has pace. No finishing, no ability to cross or pick the right pass, just pace.
I also lost a great deal of respect for Walcott during their 8-2 drubbing at the Swamp last year when he was mercilessly having a go at his own full-back (a young lad, making one of his first appearances, who had only come on due to injury to Sagna).
Not a lad I'd ever have in my team (plus, are we really going to bear with him for two years before deciding whether he can come good or not ? We may as well persist with AJ who is infinitely more skilled, can finish and cross, but who needs to stop over egging the pudding and be a bit more disciplined. He's far closer to the finished article than Walcott).