Etihad Campus, Stadium and Collar Site Development Thread

[HelloCity]

A upsetting as this may be to people, there is no chance of any development to the North Stand any time soon. That ship sailed a long time ago.

We have had the best two seasons we will ever have, and still struggle to fill the stadium for a large majority of games. The idea above that we could sell another 7500 season tickets is in a redeveloped North Stand is simply fantasy, and more empty seats is just not worth the £50-£100m investment.

As some posters have written earlier on this thread, until we get to a stage that every seat is filled for the majority of games including all corporate offerings, then major investment cannot be justified.

There was real momentum at one stage to keep it snowballing, and I'm sure if that had been maintained then work would have already started on the new stand. But that stalled and now we are in the position that nobody could justify creating more seats - especially when the stand will be completed post Pep when who knows what position we will be in.

You’re full of shit.

Every weekend game sells out barring exceptional circumstances.

 

[Stretford Born Blue]

In 2001/2, I attended the inaugural supporters club meeting at Northenden. Dennis Tueart and another club representative attended.
A big topic of discussion centered around the move into Etihad Stadium (as is) at the beginning of the 2003/4 season, and the proposed capacity.
The upshot was, the club were going to build it to accommodate approximately 50000( ultimately 48000), as at that time, our current fan base would fill it, which they did.
Surprisingly, Dennis Tueart stated that around 35% of our then fan base, was in the South East, taken from ticket sales and season ticket holder sales.
Now, it's safe to assume that 17 years later, and ten years or so of on and off the field success, our fan base has grown quite substantially, and it's evident with the fan demographic.
If the ground capacity is expanded, they will come, but for those games where ticket sales are slow, ticket pricing will need to be right, along with the way the club puts them up for sale, as blocking whole tiers out to fill lower tiers stops people buying their preferred seat.

 

[Man_City_Loyal]

In 2001/2, I attended the inaugural supporters club meeting at Northenden. Dennis Tueart and another club representative attended.
A big topic of discussion centered around the move into Etihad Stadium (as is) at the beginning of the 2003/4 season, and the proposed capacity.
The upshot was, the club were going to build it to accommodate approximately 50000( ultimately 48000), as at that time, our current fan base would fill it, which they did.
Surprisingly, Dennis Tueart stated that around 35% of our then fan base, was in the South East, taken from ticket sales and season ticket holder sales.
Now, it's safe to assume that 17 years later, and ten years or so of on and off the field success, our fan base has grown quite substantially, and it's evident with the fan demographic.
If the ground capacity is expanded, they will come, but for those games where ticket sales are slow, ticket pricing will need to be right, along with the way the club puts them up for sale, as blocking whole tiers out to fill lower tiers stops people buying their preferred seat.

no club should be increasing their grounds in this day and age.

everywhere has empty seats, will get worst the dearer tickets get

 

[richards30]

A upsetting as this may be to people, there is no chance of any development to the North Stand any time soon. That ship sailed a long time ago.

We have had the best two seasons we will ever have, and still struggle to fill the stadium for a large majority of games. The idea above that we could sell another 7500 season tickets is in a redeveloped North Stand is simply fantasy, and more empty seats is just not worth the £50-£100m investment.

As some posters have written earlier on this thread, until we get to a stage that every seat is filled for the majority of games including all corporate offerings, then major investment cannot be justified.

There was real momentum at one stage to keep it snowballing, and I'm sure if that had been maintained then work would have already started on the new stand. But that stalled and now we are in the position that nobody could justify creating more seats - especially when the stand will be completed post Pep when who knows what position we will be in.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

You are assuming there that City will speculate to accumulate but perhaps those days of front-end investment are over? Look at the transfers: Sanchez, Maguire etc. All aspects of City's business suggest that the early days of front-ended investment are over.

However, the ground is full. We are not as popular as Man utd and Liverpool, but we are certainly a lot more popular than we were. I think we'd fill an expanded stand and that it would make financial sense to to it. There is a limited window though because everything is linked to the pitch. So far everything has gone right for us. What if we were to struggle for a season or two? It would then suddenly be off the agenda.

As well as this, every extra seat we sell counts as revenue while investment on infrastructure is exempt from FFP rules. It makes sense long-term even if we only get ten 60,000 plus gates a season. The Real Madrid match sold out in three days (even at high prices). The only concern I would have is that I think the football bubble may be about to burst. It can't last for ever and the TV deal has peaked. But that's an issue for all clubs.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

I am too old and live too far away to be a seasoncard holder but am a supporters club member. Probably half the games I go to are with tickets bought from seasoncard holders including on this forum. There is no other option. In part it is one of capacity but also about the administration of the sale of tickets. There are many who are unaware or do not want to use unofficial sources because they tend to be limited and last minute. These fans are off City's radar and distorts the data on supporters.

It does "make planning for an expanded ground more difficult" but business is not an exact science and times you have to follow your instincts and take a punt if you are to grow.

Good post spiny. If it wasn’t for the impact of Blues in the existing North Stand I’d be all for expanding the North Stand now.

I sort out tickets for my brother and his mate for all home games. They are committed Blues but they wouldn’t know what their Supporters Numbers were (or if they have them). IMHO, City need to find better ways to engage with the wider fanbase.

 

[Newman Noggs]

As well as this, every extra seat we sell counts as revenue while investment on infrastructure is exempt from FFP rules. It makes sense long-term even if we only get ten 60,000 plus gates a season. The Real Madrid match sold out in three days (even at high prices). The only concern I would have is that I think the football bubble may be about to burst. It can't last for ever and the TV deal has peaked. But that's an issue for all clubs.

I'd add that the financial chicanery that is taking place through FFP is throwing a light on the corruption and protectionism that has previously been hidden. That isn't doing the product any good either.

 

[gkmcfc]

A upsetting as this may be to people, there is no chance of any development to the North Stand any time soon. That ship sailed a long time ago.

We have had the best two seasons we will ever have, and still struggle to fill the stadium for a large majority of games. The idea above that we could sell another 7500 season tickets is in a redeveloped North Stand is simply fantasy, and more empty seats is just not worth the £50-£100m investment.

As some posters have written earlier on this thread, until we get to a stage that every seat is filled for the majority of games including all corporate offerings, then major investment cannot be justified.

There was real momentum at one stage to keep it snowballing, and I'm sure if that had been maintained then work would have already started on the new stand. But that stalled and now we are in the position that nobody could justify creating more seats - especially when the stand will be completed post Pep when who knows what position we will be in.

Check most league matches. Rarely can you get groups of seats together. I have several SC holders around me in the family stand who miss loads of games. They simply choose not to go and don’t even use the ticket exchange. You’ll rarely see games “sell out” because of the ticket exchange. Then there’s City distributing tickets to sponsors and partners. This isn’t managed particularly well.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

I'd add that the financial chicanery that is taking place through FFP is throwing a light on the corruption and protectionism that has previously been hidden. That isn't doing the product any good either.

Agreed. Corruption is a major issue for football in general. It is everywhere in the game at all levels. Players agents getting bungs, bribes for officials, cover-ups of sex abuse in youth football have all come to the fore. When you throw in drugs cheating and VAR it casts a long shadow. Sports like Athletics and Cycling have been destroyed by scandal.
The situation is not helped by the death of proper journalism which has been undermined by an increasingly toxic social media environment.

 

[Bobo Fett]

On a slightly different but related note..... I can't remember when City fans last did the Poznan. Did something happen with that?

 

[Silvercloud]

I've used the ticket exchange twice this season, sold both times. On each occasion, the person who has bought it hasn't sat in my seat (in 109). Whether they've got mates close by & have sat with them or just haven't turned up I don't know. If they haven't turned up there's no way the club can remedy it.

 

[JOGAMIGMOG]

In light of today's Uefa sanctions, the club should now just say fuck it, let's build the biggest and best stadium in England or indeed the world and turn City into an absolute monster club. Let the fans in for fuck all if we have to. Every single player in the world will want to play for us, Uefa will be duty bound to choose our stadium for finals and we will piss all over everyone and rule the world. Mwahhahaha.

 

[Marvin]

In light of today's Uefa sanctions, the club should now just say fuck it, let's build the biggest and best stadium in England or indeed the world and turn City into an absolute monster club. Let the fans in for fuck all if we have to. Every single player in the world will want to play for us, Uefa will be duty bound to choose our stadium for finals and we will piss all over everyone and rule the world. Mwahhahaha.

You read my mind. That is exactly what I thought too.

This is one way City can fight back. Invest in the infrastructure of the club.

I think it is quite likely that City will accelerate plans for the North Stand. It is exactly what I would do if I was running Manchester City. Fight with whatever resources you can and this is one area that we can do what we want. But it means Sheikh Mansour has to take an active role in the club and he has been selling off equity in recent years.

 

[Mike N]

Time to announce the next phase.

 

[Franny's toilet roll]

Put on hold forever

 

[Prophet of Doom]

You’re full of shit.

Every weekend game sells out barring exceptional circumstances.

Why do you think they are allowing the planning to lapse ?? You keep on with the fantasy of one giant stand full of blues that stopped going 20 years ago !!!

You are right in thinking most weekend games are sold out. However, they are seldom full except for the big games. The data on season card attendance on the huge number of cards ( especially cheap children tickets ) that are only used for big weekend games is worrying.

When you factor in that we have had 7 cup games this season, and not one ( including a derby semi final ) has sold out. We all have our reasons to hate Champions League games but the attendances this season have been very poor.

Cup games this season will account for more than a third of the home games this season - so until these start selling out the investment in the North Stand stand does not make economic sense.

And whilst being full for cup games is one factor, the other is that it can only work if corporate seats are factored in ( be it in a new North Stand or in existing seats where supporters are dis-placed ). There is no appetite for more corporate seats at the moment so that has also put the brakes on.

I'm sorry if this upsets the dreamers, and I have enjoyed this thread but surely people can see why its not happening. 54,000 is the right capacity for us at the moment.

After yesterdays UEFA announcement, its probably just as well the brakes were out on the project.

 

[HelloCity]

Why do you think they are allowing the planning to lapse ?? You keep on with the fantasy of one giant stand full of blues that stopped going 20 years ago !!!

You are right in thinking most weekend games are sold out. However, they are seldom full except for the big games. The data on season card attendance on the huge number of cards ( especially cheap children tickets ) that are only used for big weekend games is worrying.

When you factor in that we have had 7 cup games this season, and not one ( including a derby semi final ) has sold out. We all have our reasons to hate Champions League games but the attendances this season have been very poor.

Cup games this season will account for more than a third of the home games this season - so until these start selling out the investment in the North Stand stand does not make economic sense.

And whilst being full for cup games is one factor, the other is that it can only work if corporate seats are factored in ( be it in a new North Stand or in existing seats where supporters are dis-placed ). There is no appetite for more corporate seats at the moment so that has also put the brakes on.

I'm sorry if this upsets the dreamers, and I have enjoyed this thread but surely people can see why its not happening. 54,000 is the right capacity for us at the moment.

After yesterdays UEFA announcement, its probably just as well the brakes were out on the project.

We got crowds of over 50 thousand for two of our group games against much smaller sides. I’m not sure if that counts as very poor.

 

[WARBABY]

I think yesterday was the news the club were waiting for on a decision about the extension, can't see it happening for a while yet.

 

[Prophet of Doom]

We got crowds of over 50 thousand for two of our group games against much smaller sides. I’m not sure if that counts as very poor.

Depends which way you look at it. I personally think 3 x attendances around the 50k mark for this seasons Champs League Group games is fantastic.

The Club see it differently, asking why heavily discounted tickets didn't sell out. They wonder why so many seasoncard holders choose not to attend Champions League games.

Until these games start selling out at non-discounted prices ( and there is an evidenced demand for for further seats and corporate facilities at all games ) there will be no appetite to green light the North Stand project.

The sad thing about it all is that there was real momentum at one stage - completion of South Stand - Pep's arrival etc. But the momentum has stalled.

Property focus for the foreseeable will be on the proposed Arena.

 

[hihosilva]

Looks like a Bam construction have won the rights to build a 20,000 seater arena next to the stadium.