Explosion at MEN Arena/Victoria Station

[Machiavelli]

Show me one?

I'm just getting ready to leave work after a 20+ hour shift. I'm sure someone will.

 

[Tugay One Cup]

I haven't seen one post suggesting this

I'm not in the mood for conflict or games of oneupmanship so I won't link anything but if you look hard enough you will find them.

As the dust settles, the regular needless shit slinging has picked up again. Labelling people as xenophobic, racist, liberal lefties etc is not doing anyone any favours in a time when galvanisation is desperately needed. As hard as it might be to admit for some, none of us have the answers right now and, as you say, discussion is needed, not finger pointing and agenda pushing.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

What people are suggesting is that we intern or remove those with form not the Muslims who are innocent people going about their daily lives.

But we don't have internment and the last time we tried it we just politicised a whole new group of people. The one thing I would do is anyone returning from abroad, that we believe or suspect has been to a trouble hotspot, should be detained & extensively questioned & debriefed as we did with German POW's after the war as part of the de-Nazification programme. They were graded A, B or C on the basis of how intractable their views were.

The other major issue seems to be radicalisation in prison as those inside tend to be less intelligent and more prone to commit criminal acts, making them perfect targets for radicals. I'm sure there's a lot of focus on that but maybe we need to be more pro-active in identifying the recruiters and isolating them from other prisoners.

 

[vonkeynotvenky]

But we don't have internment and the last time we tried it we just politicised a whole new group of people. The one thing I would do is anyone returning from abroad, that we believe or suspect has been to a trouble hotspot, should be detained & extensively questioned & debriefed as we did with German POW's after the war as part of the de-Nazification programme. They were graded A, B or C on the basis of how intractable their views were.

The other major issue seems to be radicalisation in prison as those inside tend to be less intelligent and more prone to commit criminal acts, making them perfect targets for radicals. I'm sure there's a lot of focus on that but maybe we need to be more pro-active in identifying the recruiters and isolating them from other prisoners.

Nothing to disagree with there mate some sensible proposals and at least it's the beginning of dialogue that might make a difference.

 

[bobmcfc]

So proud of how Manchester has come together.

 

[abu13]

The guy who held hostage and killed people at the Lindt Cafe in Sydney a couple of years back had an extensive criminal record for some serious shit (rape, armed robbery, attempted murder, hate speech etc if i remember correctly). He should have been locked up, not on bail. How much evidence should be needed for someone to be a direct threat?

In this day and age, anyone supporting isis should be locked up and have the key thrown away. Who gives a fuck if it offends the PC brigade.

I'm with you on that, all I was saying is that although someone may be known to the authorities it does not flag up that they are a direct risk at that time, the example you give is a great example of where an individual should never have been allowed back onto the streets,

 

[Ban-jani]

Mate - we're all fucking angry but some are using that anger to suggest we become as bad as the people who want to hurt us. I'm angry but I don't intend to allow that anger to cloud my judgement or make me rush to unsuitable conclusions. The simple fact is that there is no such thing as a "Muslim" (or a Jew or a Christian) who is part of a homogeneous group that all thinks and acts the same. There is Sunni and Shia, among other groupings. Among Sunni's, there are numerous sects, including Wahhabism or Salafist. And even a majority of those are violent extremists.

So saying we should deport all Muslims or ban Islam is idiotic. And as a democratic state with an independent judiciary and bound by various laws and conventions, we have to ensure we act lawfully in everything we do.

Excellent post, Colin.

 

[blueinsa]

Mate - we're all fucking angry but some are using that anger to suggest we become as bad as the people who want to hurt us. I'm angry but I don't intend to allow that anger to cloud my judgement or make me rush to unsuitable conclusions. The simple fact is that there is no such thing as a "Muslim" (or a Jew or a Christian) who is part of a homogeneous group that all thinks and acts the same. There is Sunni and Shia, among other groupings. Among Sunni's, there are numerous sects, including Wahhabism or Salafist. And even a majority of those are violent extremists.

So saying we should deport all Muslims or ban Islam is idiotic. And as a democratic state with an independent judiciary and bound by various laws and conventions, we have to ensure we act lawfully in everything we do.

Superb post mate.

 

[Cheadle_hulmeBlue]

The Manchester Bee - I dont think there is a better symbol right now, to sum up how mancunians/locals have responded to this awful event. togetherness and solidarity.

 

[Damocles]

They got another one arrested.

Few incidents in Wigan today - nursery got blocked off. Man got wrestled to the ground in the town centre by Police. They seem to have got whoever they were after and raided his house.