General Election June 8th

[SWP's back]

No we should have given people their money back and let the shareholders loose their investments.

And people that banked with them would have lost their savings...

The shareholders did lose their investments by the way. They got pennies on the pound.

 

[jonmcity]

I picked him to illustrate my point. He has about 20 homes. (I've met him, incidentally).

Do you honestly think he'd hand over hundreds of millions if we changed the law? He wouldn't, he'd find another loophole.

Incidentally Osborne was changing the laws on non-dom tax to try to fix this. But May sacked him.

How about tax the dividends at point of payment, i.e. before paid to the individuals or investment companies.

 

[Ricster]

A lot of casual racism in this thread over ms Abbott. Get well soon your country needs you.

Haven't agreed with much you have said on this thread, but boy that is very funny haha.

Aside, that could make another difference.

 

[mcfc1632]

I am sorry but that is simply NOT true.

I am a Tory and I care about all of those things. Every Tory I know cares. The government cares.

They also realise that you cannot spend more money on everything when you don't have enough money.

Think on that, please. Making cuts is never popular, but is sometimes necessary. Do reflect on this. It is sometimes necessary.

If a Labour government does not understand this, what will happen to the economy when more cuts ARE needed and they cannot or will not make them?

The answer is, the same thing that happened last time. Lots and lots of tax rises and a deficit spiralling out of control. That is what Labour left behind last time. And Brown was far more responsible than Corbyn or McDonnell, I assure you!

It's taken 6 years to try out the wheels back on, and run the country responsibly. And it's been a hard road for all. I get that. But these painful cuts have been a direct consequence of how the economy was left when the Tories took over. Labour spent money we did not have and could not afford and we've been paying for it ever since.

I am sure all newly elected governments would wish to undertake popular policies and give extra funding and resources to all. I am sure as individuals they would like to receive the accolades that come with doing popular things - Blair loved the kudos he could receive from Brown's giveaways - irrespective of the long-term damage that was being inflicted on the UK.

The problem that the Conservatives have faced in recent decades is that they have always had to follow a Labour government that has wilfully fucked the economy – so they have had to commence the treatment/medicine that will get the UK patient back on the mend again – starting by having to arrest the terminal malaise that Labour’s policies have caused the nation. It has always been necessary to start the recovery with some emergency treatment.

People are talking about cuts in policing and security – of course a big focus at this time – and also about the need for more funding in the NHS – again, who would not want that.

But the cuts have not just been in those 2 areas – they have been across the board. The question is why - and the answer (again) is Labour's economic largesse.

Of course you do find that some of a left-wing persuasion can be so obsessive and to my mind very blinkered, that they can only (look to) blame the people administering the emergency treatment and recovery care – the ‘economic clinicians’. They normally, IMO, cannot bring themselves to consider the causes of the illness and allocate any of the blame to the Labour economic strategy – despite the simple fact (again IMO) that it has repeatedly been due to the need to perform ‘emergency surgery’ to arrest the economic disease that Labour has allowed to flourish.

Conveniently forgotten is the ‘self-harm’ that Labour repeatedly and wilfully inflicts on the UK and seeks to blame the doctors. For me, only people of the more extreme / ‘purist’ left-winger views would want to see their cult come to the fore – irrespective of the damage to the nation.

If a UK citizen, following years of - let's say alcohol or drug abuse - had to undergo serious surgery, followed by a long-term period of rehabilitation (austerity) - that person would have no problem blaming themselves for the cause and recognising how much is owed to the surgeon and after-care - the bias and blinkeredness of people precludes such objective consideration in politics.

People quickly forget the real causes of the austerity and the cult members become mobilised again.The risk is that they ‘spread the word' in a seductive manner that others ‘get on-board’ – especially the younger generation. It should be no surprise that the older generation sways to voting Conservative and the younger one is very much behind Labour – one of these generations has genuine experience of the ‘Labour way’ – one does not. I always voted Labour until my 30s – I found that it is what you do when you are brought up not to think for yourself. Having now acquired the ability to rationalise and assess, I vote based on the genuine deliverability of what is promised and I am able to see through the puff and vapour that is the undeliverable Labour promises.

That means that as a Leave voter I must vote Conservative – no way will we actually leave the EU if Labour get in – that will be clear to anyone that has the ability to assess things objectively.

And just as a UK citizen, I must vote Conservative this time because I have no desire to see another ‘rinse and repeat’ cycle of economic vandalism. In 5 years of a Labour government – especially if there was a working majority – the damage to controls over the unions also does not bear thinking about. I also well-remember the days of gratuitous strikes and secondary picketing.

 

[shemnel]

The problem that the Conservatives have faced in recent decades is that they have always had to follow a Labour government that has wilfully fucked the economy – so they have had to commence the treatment/medicine that will get the UK patient back on the mend again – starting by having to arrest the terminal malaise that Labour’s policies have caused the nation. It has always been necessary to start the recovery with some emergency treatment.

this Labour largesse thing that people talk about, did you know that since WW2 it is the Conservative party that has borrowed more per year of government than Labour? just a point. im not voting for either, both a load of idiots.

 

[MillionMilesAway]

Yes, you could be right, but considering that May is supposed to have blown it, if it turns out
like this, it shows just how ineffectual Labour are. But we'll know manana and whichever side wins can start the
gloat-fest that we all so relish ;)

It really doesn't.
It just reflects that the country has had a right wing government for nearly 40 years, with the government's main aim being to get re-elected in four years rather than do something good for the entire country; it's worked.

You'll be right about the gloatfest. Several posters are offensive and sneery, and will be well off the scale when the obvious outcome comes about.

 

[jonmcity]

I don't agree the conservative party are not bothered about the many, and want to ensure an hereditary elite. This is mainly maintained by private education, private health care and jobs for the boys. There is only so much cash to go around, and they want to ensure the few elite have most of it.

 

[Chippy_boy]

I don't agree the conservative party are not bothered about the many, and want to ensure an hereditary elite. This is mainly maintained by private education, private health care and jobs for the boys. There is only so much cash to go around, and they want to ensure the few elite have most of it.

I am not sure I agree with they above, but in any event, the reality is that most people are greedy. Irrespective of political allegiances.

It's apparently dreadful to be well off and to wish to do the best for yourself and your family. But if you are less well off, this is perfectly fine, admirable even.

Just look at the 10,000 who turned up in Gateshead. What are they campaigning for? More money for themselves. Directly in terms of pay and pay rises, and indirectly in terms of benefits - schools, policing, NHS etc - that they want other people to pay for.

I wonder how many of the 10,000 were very wealthy or even moderately wealthy and welcoming paying more tax out of principle? If it's more than 1% of the crowd, I'd be astonished. 99% are there to seek a better deal for themselves, and that is their prime motivation. Not some noble egalitarian principle.

 

[The perfect fumble]

I am sure all newly elected governments would wish to undertake popular policies and give extra funding and resources to all. I am sure as individuals they would like to receive the accolades that come with doing popular things - Blair loved the kudos he could receive from Brown's giveaways - irrespective of the long-term damage that was being inflicted on the UK.

The problem that the Conservatives have faced in recent decades is that they have always had to follow a Labour government that has wilfully fucked the economy – so they have had to commence the treatment/medicine that will get the UK patient back on the mend again – starting by having to arrest the terminal malaise that Labour’s policies have caused the nation. It has always been necessary to start the recovery with some emergency treatment.

People are talking about cuts in policing and security – of course a big focus at this time – and also about the need for more funding in the NHS – again, who would not want that.

But the cuts have not just been in those 2 areas – they have been across the board. The question is why - and the answer (again) is Labour's economic largesse.

Of course you do find that some of a left-wing persuasion can be so obsessive and to my mind very blinkered, that they can only (look to) blame the people administering the emergency treatment and recovery care – the ‘economic clinicians’. They normally, IMO, cannot bring themselves to consider the causes of the illness and allocate any of the blame to the Labour economic strategy – despite the simple fact (again IMO) that it has repeatedly been due to the need to perform ‘emergency surgery’ to arrest the economic disease that Labour has allowed to flourish.

Conveniently forgotten is the ‘self-harm’ that Labour repeatedly and wilfully inflicts on the UK and seeks to blame the doctors. For me, only people of a more extreme / ‘purist’ left-wingers would want to see their cult come to the fore – irrespective of the damage to the nation.

If a UK citizen, following years of - let's say alcohol or drug abuse - had to undergo serious surgery, followed a long-term period of rehabilitation (austerity) - that person would have no problem blaming themselves and recognising how much is owed to the surgeon and after-care - the bias and blinkeredness of people precludes such objective consideration in politics.

People quickly forget the real causes of the austerity and the cult members become mobilised again.The risk is that they ‘spread the word' in a seductive manner that others ‘get on-board’ – especially the younger generation. It should be no surprise that the older generation sways to voting Conservative and the younger one is very much behind Labour – one of these generations has genuine experience of the ‘Labour way’ – one does not. I always voted Labour until my 30s – I found that it is what you do when you are brought up not to think for yourself. Having now acquired the ability to rationalise and assess, I vote based on the genuine deliverability of what is promised and I am able to see through the puff and vapour that is the undeliverable Labour promises.

That means that as a Leave voter I must vote Conservative – no way will we actually leave the EU if Labour get in – that will be clear to anyone that has the ability to assess things objectively.

And just as a UK citizen, I must vote Conservative this time because I have no desire to see another ‘rinse and repeat’ cycle of economic vandalism. In 5 years of a Labour government – especially if there was a working majority – the damage to controls over the unions also does not bear thinking about. I also well-remember the days of gratuitous strikes and secondary picketing.

The Tories would love to give more money to any number of deserving causes, but the harsh economic realities prevent them from ever doing it, it's common sense, it doesn't grow on trees, as said (many times) there's no such thing as a money tree, we must cut our cloth, live within our means, tighten our belt, get value for money, more for less, we can't mortgage our future, think of our children, tax punishes the wealth creators and remember there's a distinction between the deserving and the undeserving poor, we can't keep throwing money at it, it's not a bottomless pit, where's the money going to come from? The poor just want free stuff, they should get off their backsides and get a job, it's the scourge of welfarism, socialist utopia, economically illiterate, we need a flexible labour market, free of red tape, a competitive economy, low tax, dynamic, people should take responsibility, there is no such thing as poverty, poor life choices are the roots of social inequality, we support hard working families but money doesn't solve everything.......on and on and on......forever.

 

[SWP's back]

Firstly the majority of people earning over £100K per year are not on PAYE, they are on self assesment therefore avoiding and evading tax is easier

Anything to back that up?

Every football received their wage and bonuses through PAYE for a start.