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General Wrestling Thread
- Thread starter Damocles
- Start date
BimboBob
Well-Known Member
pudge said:You have to be a talented dancer to do ballet thoughDamocles said:It's not really breaking it down, it's just describing literally what it is.
Many people watched it as kids so don't understand what the point of it was as it went over their heads at that age.
Think of it like ballet. Ballet is a storytelling medium if you watch and understand it. To people who don't watch or understand it it is just dancing. Same thing.
Fishing again?
So, to take hit after hit, sometimes falling from height, to jump, spin, throw a punch, land on your back constantly, use a mic to entertain 10,000 plus people 5 nights a week, to carry a persona and to act out a script that has been hand written for you doesn't take talent?
I got in a ring once and had a go at landing on my back. It fucking hurt. As did falling into a rope. Christ knows how they do it night after night especially now they are clean as 20 minutes fucking around nearly killed me.
They are highly trained athletes, a lot come from the college wrestling scene and move into the pros to earn money, and as such earn my respect. You can see why they retire early and are generally knackered for the rest of their lives.
Drew Carey doesn't strike me as a highly trained athlete tbfBimboBob said:pudge said:You have to be a talented dancer to do ballet thoughDamocles said:It's not really breaking it down, it's just describing literally what it is.
Many people watched it as kids so don't understand what the point of it was as it went over their heads at that age.
Think of it like ballet. Ballet is a storytelling medium if you watch and understand it. To people who don't watch or understand it it is just dancing. Same thing.
Fishing again?
So, to take hit after hit, sometimes falling from height, to jump, spin, throw a punch, land on your back constantly, use a mic to entertain 10,000 plus people 5 nights a week, to carry a persona and to act out a script that has been hand written for you doesn't take talent?
I got in a ring once and had a go at landing on my back. It fucking hurt. As did falling into a rope. Christ knows how they do it night after night especially now they are clean as 20 minutes fucking around nearly killed me.
They are highly trained athletes, a lot come from the college wrestling scene and move into the pros to earn money, and as such earn my respect. You can see why they retire early and are generally knackered for the rest of their lives.
Neither does Donald Trump, Mr. T is perhaps arguable.
To be serious, I would say that there are fewer wrestlers than there should be in the WWE today that actual tell a good story in the ring. Both persona and ability wise, which is a talent with regards to the story telling aspect of it.
And with the exception of my perhaps slight exaggeration as to the abilities of the great Christian, I can't help but think given the taste in wrestling from others and what some believe constitutes entertainment in this thread; that I'm the one being "fished"
pinkwheeltrim
Well-Known Member
Now this is my kind of promo!
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RleenBy7A4[/youtube]
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RleenBy7A4[/youtube]
pudge said:Drew Carey doesn't strike me as a highly trained athlete tbfBimboBob said:pudge said:You have to be a talented dancer to do ballet though
Fishing again?
So, to take hit after hit, sometimes falling from height, to jump, spin, throw a punch, land on your back constantly, use a mic to entertain 10,000 plus people 5 nights a week, to carry a persona and to act out a script that has been hand written for you doesn't take talent?
I got in a ring once and had a go at landing on my back. It fucking hurt. As did falling into a rope. Christ knows how they do it night after night especially now they are clean as 20 minutes fucking around nearly killed me.
They are highly trained athletes, a lot come from the college wrestling scene and move into the pros to earn money, and as such earn my respect. You can see why they retire early and are generally knackered for the rest of their lives.
Neither does Donald Trump, Mr. T is perhaps arguable.
To be serious, I would say that there are fewer wrestlers than there should be in the WWE today that actual tell a good story in the ring. Both persona and ability wise, which is a talent with regards to the story telling aspect of it.
And with the exception of my perhaps slight exaggeration as to the abilities of the great Christian, I can't help but think given the taste in wrestling from others and what some believe constitutes entertainment in this thread; that I'm the one being "fished"
Is Drew Carey a wrestler? Or is he somebody who was once involved in wrestling?
Your last paragraph can be summed up as "I don't like it therefore it is objectively crap" which means you should probably have a look at what objectively means. Some people like things you don't, this doesn't mean you are correct. I cannot believe I am having to tell somebody this.
There are plenty of story tellers in wrestling still. You can argue that sometimes they don't get the stage to do it but they are still there. Perhaps the lack of narrative reinforcement from the commentating booth has tricked you into thinking that it isn't there any more?
JoeMercer'sWay
Well-Known Member
Damocles said:pudge said:Drew Carey doesn't strike me as a highly trained athlete tbfBimboBob said:Fishing again?
So, to take hit after hit, sometimes falling from height, to jump, spin, throw a punch, land on your back constantly, use a mic to entertain 10,000 plus people 5 nights a week, to carry a persona and to act out a script that has been hand written for you doesn't take talent?
I got in a ring once and had a go at landing on my back. It fucking hurt. As did falling into a rope. Christ knows how they do it night after night especially now they are clean as 20 minutes fucking around nearly killed me.
They are highly trained athletes, a lot come from the college wrestling scene and move into the pros to earn money, and as such earn my respect. You can see why they retire early and are generally knackered for the rest of their lives.
Neither does Donald Trump, Mr. T is perhaps arguable.
To be serious, I would say that there are fewer wrestlers than there should be in the WWE today that actual tell a good story in the ring. Both persona and ability wise, which is a talent with regards to the story telling aspect of it.
And with the exception of my perhaps slight exaggeration as to the abilities of the great Christian, I can't help but think given the taste in wrestling from others and what some believe constitutes entertainment in this thread; that I'm the one being "fished"
Is Drew Carey a wrestler? Or is he somebody who was once involved in wrestling?
Your last paragraph can be summed up as "I don't like it therefore it is objectively crap" which means you should probably have a look at what objectively means. Some people like things you don't, this doesn't mean you are correct. I cannot believe I am having to tell somebody this.
There are plenty of story tellers in wrestling still. You can argue that sometimes they don't get the stage to do it but they are still there. Perhaps the lack of narrative reinforcement from the commentating booth has tricked you into thinking that it isn't there any more?
I'm unsure how I feel about Mania 30 storywise, I think it's been a real mixed bag. They've pulled it off well with Bryan and done pretty well with Wyatt, but I still feel they could have done a bit more there, and I feel really underwhelmed by Taker/Lesnar, but then I'm one of those who finds the streak a little dull because I don't like not being able to believe in someone breaking it, thus there's no meaning to the match for me. Also think they could have done a lot more with Rhodes/Goldust and Cesaro/Swagger, and still feel they should have kept the MITB at Mania. Just feel the general build hasn't made me feel it's Wrestlemania this weekend, it's been a little restrained, or reserved, apart from the Bryan stuff, and I was hoping with it being 30 years of Mania that they would have actively involved guys like Austin, Hart, Foley and HBK actively in the build-up, even in non-wrestling roles, just to bring that flavour to it.
On a creative point, I'd love if one of the matches paid tribute to the great stars of WM by borrowing lots of different wrestlers finishing moves and trading them off against each other, sort of like Eugene but actually cool with them paying tribute to the stars of the last 30 years.
Exactly, you're saying that ballet is a form of story telling; the "same thing" as WWE.Damocles said:pudge said:Drew Carey doesn't strike me as a highly trained athlete tbfBimboBob said:Fishing again?
So, to take hit after hit, sometimes falling from height, to jump, spin, throw a punch, land on your back constantly, use a mic to entertain 10,000 plus people 5 nights a week, to carry a persona and to act out a script that has been hand written for you doesn't take talent?
I got in a ring once and had a go at landing on my back. It fucking hurt. As did falling into a rope. Christ knows how they do it night after night especially now they are clean as 20 minutes fucking around nearly killed me.
They are highly trained athletes, a lot come from the college wrestling scene and move into the pros to earn money, and as such earn my respect. You can see why they retire early and are generally knackered for the rest of their lives.
Neither does Donald Trump, Mr. T is perhaps arguable.
To be serious, I would say that there are fewer wrestlers than there should be in the WWE today that actual tell a good story in the ring. Both persona and ability wise, which is a talent with regards to the story telling aspect of it.
And with the exception of my perhaps slight exaggeration as to the abilities of the great Christian, I can't help but think given the taste in wrestling from others and what some believe constitutes entertainment in this thread; that I'm the one being "fished"
Is Drew Carey a wrestler? Or is he somebody who was once involved in wrestling?
Your last paragraph can be summed up as "I don't like it therefore it is objectively crap" which means you should probably have a look at what objectively means. Some people like things you don't, this doesn't mean you are correct. I cannot believe I am having to tell somebody this.
There are plenty of story tellers in wrestling still. You can argue that sometimes they don't get the stage to do it but they are still there. Perhaps the lack of narrative reinforcement from the commentating booth has tricked you into thinking that it isn't there any more?
However, you don't get a production of Swan Lake hiring Simon Cowell to dance do you?
Those tiresome gimmicks; of rolling special guests and celebrity matches, downplay and devalue the aspect of story telling and the talent it requires to pull off convincingly and drags wrestlers in all sorts of tangents; so no sustainable style is attainable.
And I didn't say "What I like is what's right and everyone's wrong"
It's my opinion that what passes for good story telling and entertainment nowadays is hideously sub par. Not just in contrast to the acclaimed high points of the past but in general.
The incompetence of Cole and the unfortunate showing of age from Jerry Lawler don't make up for the lack of legitimate and prolonged feuds. It's hard to keep up with who the Wyatt's are after, it's poor form to have 2 belts in the US and IC going unchallenged for months on end and then a string of random "contenders" competing for them and subsequently given an application form to be a full time jobber.
The story telling in the ring that seems to garner all the attention is "I'm going to let you hit me with everything you've got, no sell it, and then hit a few of the same moves and win because I'm a scrappy fucker"
Arguably the best at selling the heel with his in ring performance is Orton, I don't rate him that highly but as has been seen, if you put him in the ring with someone like Cesaro who's technical ability is outstanding then the match itself is of a higher quality and the "brute/thug/scrappy" aspect of Orton is enhanced and performed better.
Not even taking into consideration the fact that wrestlers like Big Show should at this point be putting other wrestlers over instead of dragging them down by having them try and lose convincingly to a sauntering, overweight giant. What story does Big Show and his matches portray? "Here's a big, lazy bastard that's too big to conquer"?
You portray some knowledgeable insight into wrestling but, and again this is my opinion, you seem too eager to accept a substandard job in all aspects as to justify the fandom. I could even say that your style of posting is of the same kind you feel mine is, however I realize it's about opinions not condescension; "I cannot believe I am having to tell somebody this."
You didn't have to tell anyone anything, as again it's my opinion and I respect others. Once again, does't mean I agree with it but it doesn't mean it's wrong.
WM30 is a poorly and somewhat rushed together affair, yet it will be heralded as a great success with matches for the ages. When in reality, the story telling is poor and shoved together like 2 jigsaw pieces that just don't fit. However, it will pander; so regardless of quality it will gain the approval some are eager to give already.