George Floyd murder / Derek Chauvin guilty of murder

[ChicagoBlue]

Fair enough, just need an amendment to your Constitution that formally recognised non-compliance as a death penalty offence and then your arguments would be correct.

SWP’s back, I took you as less simplistic than that. It’s not the repeated non-compliance, which did serve to greatly escalate matters and led to guns being drawn in the first place, but the reaching into his car (with the officers blind to what he was doing) even as they tried to stop him from doing it, that got him shot.

No amendment is needed.

 

[ChicagoBlue]

While I see your point, I wonder if there's any history of black people being shot, tasered, beaten, abused or otherwise harmed by white police in America whether they were "complying" or not.

Just a guess but maybe that enters the consciousness of those in such circumstances somehow.

If it did, surely they would be MORE compliant, no? Haven’t we now moved to Axion Body Cams and everyone having Hi-Def cameras in their pocket.

And, does every disturbance now carry the weight of every other disturbance that has ever occurred, or can we say that this black persons was shot by this white officer because of his own actions...not pre-Civil War slavery or the 150 years of racism since then?

 

[SWP's back]

SWP’s back, I took you as less simplistic than that. It’s not the repeated non-compliance, which did serve to greatly escalate matters and led to guns being drawn in the first place, but the reaching into his car (with the officers blind to what he was doing) even as they tried to stop him from doing it, that got him shot.

No amendment is needed.

We’ll see soon enough if the AG deems it a “good shoot” and whether the cop was justified in law.

 

[FogBlueInSanFran]

If it did, surely they would be MORE compliant, no? Haven’t we now moved to Axion Body Cams and everyone having Hi-Def cameras in their pocket.

And, does every disturbance now carry the weight of every other disturbance that has ever occurred, or can we say that this black persons was shot by this white officer because of his own actions...not pre-Civil War slavery or the 150 years of racism since then?

I'm just asking you to put yourself in the shoes of a black person in question. If it wouldn't bother you in the least that you felt you had to adhere to a more rigid set of compliance protocols if stopped while innocent -- not that you did or didn't, but that you FELT you did -- just because of your skin color, then fine, but it would bother me a lot. It would certainly make me more fearful. But I recognize I am responsible for my own actions.

Here's an interesting story along similar lines (no guns/violence thankfully) from the town I live in from just yesterday -- I actually know the shop owner, the police officer involved and the realtor quoted (it's a small town), all of whom are good people. I don't think it's behind a pay wall. I'd be curious as to your thoughts.

Tiburon police face-off with Black merchant fuels outrage, probe

The mayor has apologized to clothing store owner Yema Khalif for a confrontation that was captured in a recording, and the police chief has ordered an independent investigation.

www.marinij.com

 

[ChicagoBlue]

We’ll see soon enough if the AG deems it a “good shoot” and whether the cop was justified in law.

Of course we will. But, never forget, the AG is a political position.

Wake me up after the court case.

As they say, I’d rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

 

[SWP's back]

Of course we will. But, never forget, the AG is a political position.

Wake me up after the court case.

As they say, I’d rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

Now imagine if you were black and how true that would be.

 

[ChicagoBlue]

I'm just asking you to put yourself in the shoes of a black person in question. If it wouldn't bother you in the least that you felt you had to adhere to a more rigid set of compliance protocols if stopped while innocent -- not that you did or didn't, but that you FELT you did -- just because of your skin color, then fine, but it would bother me a lot. It would certainly make me more fearful. But I recognize I am responsible for my own actions.

Here's an interesting story along similar lines (no guns/violence thankfully) from the town I live in from just yesterday -- I actually know the shop owner, the police officer involved and the realtor quoted (it's a small town), all of whom are good people. I don't think it's behind a pay wall. I'd be curious as to your thoughts.

Tiburon police face-off with Black merchant fuels outrage, probe

The mayor has apologized to clothing store owner Yema Khalif for a confrontation that was captured in a recording, and the police chief has ordered an independent investigation.

www.marinij.com

My thoughts are that I try hard not to make my opinions based on immediate media reports, with added outrage from people who were not involved for good effect.

The report states it is the only black owned business in town, so Tiburon appears not be the most racially mixed community in America.

From what I can see, two officers saw what they believed to be suspicious activity in a local business long after normal business hours. The police circled, stopped when they came back and made non-confrontational inquiries. No guns were drawn.

When questioned, the business owners were irate. The officers said they were just doing their job. BFD.

What I see is a non-event, learning took place, but hyper-sensitives in Marin County have pulled their hair triggers.

I see the words “implied bias” used. Tiburon is almost snow white, as is most ofMarin County, and to see black people walking around in a store in the middle of the night may well be an “implied bias,” but more as a result of the racial make-up of the community than any racist tendencies of the officers.

MARIN COUNTY

The racial makeup of Marin County was 201,963 (80.0%) White, 6,987 (2.8%) African American, 1,523 (0.6%) Native American, 13,761 (5.5%) Asian, 509 (0.2%) Pacific Islander, 16,973 (6.7%) from other races, and 10,693 (4.2%) from two or more races. Hispanic or Latino of any race were 39,069 persons (15.5%).

But, if you think that is fairly racially homogenous, take a look at the town of Tiburon itself...

TIBURON, MARIN COUNTY

The racial makeup of Tiburon was 7,899 (88.1%) White, 83 (0.9%) African American, 16 (0.2%) Native American, 505 (5.6%) Asian, 8 (0.1%) Pacific Islander, 80 (0.9%) from other races, and 371 (4.1%) from two or more races. Hispanic or Latino of any race were 410 persons (4.6%).

SOCIO-ECONOMIC STATUS OF MARIN COUNTY

TRAC reveals that in 2015, the average adjusted gross income (AGI) of Marin County was close to $159,000 -- the highest among California counties and fifth-highest in the nation.

TIBURON CRIME STATISTICS

With a crime rate for both violent and property crime combined of 10 per 1,000 residents, the crime rate in Tiburon is one of the lower rates in America among communities of all sizes (lower than 61% of America's communities). One's chance of becoming a victim of crime in Tiburonis one in 100.

Tiburon, CA Crime

Best Places to Live | Compare cost of living, crime, cities, schools and more.

www.bestplaces.net

Tiburon...not exactly the South Side of Chicago!

 

[ChicagoBlue]

Now imagine if you were black and how true that would be.

If I were black and even the slightest bit self aware, then maybe I wouldn’t fight with the police and would comply?

One thing I KNOW FOR CERTAIN I wouldn’t do, black, white or fluorescent green, is fight with the police, ignore repeated warnings while having guns pointed at me, and then be stupid enough to partially open my drivers side door and reach inside FOR ANYTHING!

I’m white as it gets, but whenever I have been pulled over, I do my utmost to be seen to be putting the POLICE OFFICER in the least possible jeopardy.

Interior light on at night, window down, hands either out of the window or on the steering wheel. My kids are both white, too, and that’s exactly what they have been taught!

When asked for any documents, I tell them where they are and what I’m about to do.

These are all simple things that I can do to lower the stress levels of all concerned and to show the officer I pose ZERO THREAT TO HIS/HER LIFE.

Now, tell me again about Mr Blake...

 

[Kinkladze 1]

A black man repeatedly shot in the back by police in Wisconsin has been left paralysed from the waist down, his father has said,His son now has "eight holes" in his body and is paralysed from the waist down, he said, though doctors do not know if the paralysis will be permanent.

Jacob Blake: Black man paralysed from waist down after being repeatedly shot in back by police, father says

"What justified all those shots? What justified doing that in front of my grandsons?," the 29-year-old's parent asks.

news.sky.com

I thought he would be paralysed,hewould have had been exceptional lucky not to have been given where he was shot and how many

Maybe he wishes now that he had followed his clear and simple instructions to stand still and not resist.... hindsight eh.....

 

[FogBlueInSanFran]

When questioned, the business owners were irate. The officers said they were just doing their job. BFD.

What I see is a non-event, learning took place, but hyper-sensitives in Marin County have pulled their hair triggers.

I see the words “implied bias” used. Tiburon is almost snow white, as is most of Marin County, and to see black people walking around in a store in the middle of the night may well be an “implied bias,” but more as a result of the racial make-up of the community than any racist tendencies of the officers.

All that you say about Marin and especially Tiburon is true. However, the business owners clearly don't see this as a "non-event", which I think is a bad read, and I'm asking you to put yourself in their shoes. The mayor didn't think so either.

I'm actually shocked Mike didn't know the store was owned by Mr. Khalif -- it's that small a town, and Main Street is that small a retail district.