Grenfell Tower block disaster

Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese said:
Quite. I think the building regs/ initial construction would have made 'stay put' a sound policy as you'd have babies, elderly, disabled etc spread right through a building like grenfell. It seems like the cladding caused the fire to spread in a way it otherwise wouldn't which makes stay put (in hindsight) a flawed decision.
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I don't think many will STAY PUT ever again.
 
Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese said:
Quite. I think the building regs/ initial construction would have made 'stay put' a sound policy as you'd have babies, elderly, disabled etc spread right through a building like grenfell. It seems like the cladding caused the fire to spread in a way it otherwise wouldn't which makes stay put (in hindsight) a flawed decision.
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Fires have spread previously and lessons weren't learnt though. They already knew there was a big problem.
 
blueinsa said:
Tiegate is todays new faux outrage straw to cling to i see.
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There's a general election looming and the card carrying faithful from all sides will use expletives to get their points across, it's as if fighting an election by screaming "He's a CU**" is going to guarantee success at the ballot box instead of discussing, convincing, reminding another voter to vote the 'right' way.
Even when the Tories win, and they will most likely win it'll go back to ones a posh twat and the other one is a terrorist, it's the circle of life in the cess pit that is British politics.
 
Each self contained flat should give an hour of fire cover, concrete is mostly impenetrable in that time, if you had a run policy, it would be chaos the stairways used by firefighters to get to the job would be rammed with people, you have the old and disabled who couldn’t get out. The idea is that a fire in a flat would pretty much be contained to that flat if the doors are closed or at least that floor if not. Unfortunately Grenfell became a fire in a building to a building on fire. The failings I suggest would be the officers in charge for whatever reasons (I have my own thoughts on that) not reading the situation in hand, plus the miscommunication in control to residents. The relatives are actually blaming the firefighters in the building for losing loved ones on the stairs etc, all I will say is that that firefighter is probably going through hell with that, anyone who has ever been in a real fire will know it ain’t like the films, they did their best but sometimes you can’t save everyone.
 
mexico1970 said:
There's a general election looming and the card carrying faithful from all sides will use expletives to get their points across, it's as if fighting an election by screaming "He's a CU**" is going to guarantee success at the ballot box instead of discussing, convincing, reminding another voter to vote the 'right' way.
Even when the Tories win, and they will most likely win it'll go back to ones a posh twat and the other one is a terrorist, it's the circle of life in the cess pit that is British politics.
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Thanks for an uplifting insight into the Grenfell Tower tragedy.
 
sir baconface said:
Thanks for an uplifting insight into the Grenfell Tower tragedy.
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This post was in response to a post about a tie, and this has become political it's very very political. In fact politics and party rosettes have stopped the truth from emerging because the water has been dirtied by point scoring.
 
This was a terrible tragedy and like some other high profile disasters will righty be called a game changer.

It was an ugly and dated 60's block of flats that had become too unsightly with its ageing dour brown brick cladding.

We have spent literally billions of pounds worth of long term investment modernising the external appearance of these so called unsightly "concrete and brick monstrosities " all across the country cladding them in a new age modern combustible second skin when there really was no real construction need other than improving aesthetics to a prominent building on the London skyline.

It was one of those " State of the Art " fuck ups in high rise construction methods I'm afraid with horrendous consequences.

We will learn from this and the blame should be shared across the board with no one exempt.
 
toffee balls said:
This was a terrible tragedy and like some other high profile disasters will righty be called a game changer.

It was an ugly and dated 60's block of flats that had become too unsightly with its ageing dour brown brick cladding.

We have spent literally billions of pounds worth of long term investment modernising the external appearance of these so called unsightly "concrete and brick monstrosities " all across the country cladding them in a new age modern combustible second skin when there really was no real construction need other than improving aesthetics to a prominent building on the London skyline.

It was one of those " State of the Art " fuck ups in high rise construction methods I'm afraid with horrendous consequences.

We will learn from this and the blame should be shared across the board with no one exempt.
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They’ve also used it in the construction of new builds as well, that’s why there are loads of residents been build £30000 plus for remedial works
 
Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese said:
Not going to pretend I've read the report. But I'd imagine the stay put advice and general fire brigade procedures would have worked fine if someone else hadn't turned the tower into a massive candle by cladding it in what was essentially a huge external wick/chimney.
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I haven’t either and I’m no expert on this kind of thing but I tend to agree. Why the fuck are those responsible for the cladding not taking the lion’s share of the rap for this?

I remember on the morning of the fire I was on holiday in Norfolk. Whatever we think of Piers Morgan - and he is a bellend at times - he had someone from the cladding company on the phone, and was giving the bloke a proper going over.
 
Blue Maverick said:
They’ve also used it in the construction of new builds as well, that’s why there are loads of residents been build £30000 plus for remedial works
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Alucobond et al have been used safely in new builds for many years as the outside layer of a predesigned composite external wall.
The original envelope stood the test of time for what, 50 years. It just doesn’t feel right or good practice to overclad high level brick or concrete buildings with aluminium.
They could render them if colour is the issue. It will all come out I’m sure .
 
What a remarkable man Eddie Daffarn is. If anyone missed it, he was speaking to John Snow at the end of tonight's Channel 4 News.
 
What a remarkable man Eddie Daffarn is. If anyone missed it, he was speaking to John Snow at the end of tonight's Channel 4 News.
 
toffee balls said:
This was a terrible tragedy and like some other high profile disasters will righty be called a game changer.

It was an ugly and dated 60's block of flats that had become too unsightly with its ageing dour brown brick cladding.

We have spent literally billions of pounds worth of long term investment modernising the external appearance of these so called unsightly "concrete and brick monstrosities " all across the country cladding them in a new age modern combustible second skin when there really was no real construction need other than improving aesthetics to a prominent building on the London skyline.

It was one of those " State of the Art " fuck ups in high rise construction methods I'm afraid with horrendous consequences.

We will learn from this and the blame should be shared across the board with no one exempt.
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This shit is plastered all over buildings over here as well (including the one I'm writing from now).

The tower opposite me which caught fire a few years ago (Sulafa Tower, you'll find plenty about that on Google) has finally had all its remaining cladding stripped off in the last couple of weeks as they're not legally allowed to replace damaged tiles with the same combustible shite.

What I will say, though, is that while this shit has no right being on the outside of any habitable building, it's clearly not the only thing that went wrong at Grenfell.

There's been several major fires in the block where I live (Sulafa, Princess, Torch x 2), and these towers are many many times bigger than Grenfell, but there's been very little internal damage to any of the buildings and no injuries, let alone deaths.

Many failings over many years combined to make Grenfell a deathtrap. The cladding was the most obvious, but on its own wouldn't have wrought the devastation it did had the rest of the building functioned how it was meant to.

No excuse though. That evil shit needs condemning to construction history.
 
 
 
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