Grenfell Tower block disaster

Gabriel said:
As opposed to the balanced ones? ;-)

Not sure how thousands of people can be rehoused as a matter of urgency. I agree it's a pressing problem, but with a shortage of housing stock already, it's going to be nigh on impossible. How do you even go about prioritising which people need moved first?

However, as you point out, were something else to happen, be that deliberate or accidental, then the Government would be in an even worse position.
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Start with the elderly, or with children, on the top floors of the tallest buildings and work down? It obviously can't be done overnight and will be controversial but it seems to be too big a risk to wait until the cladding can be replaced.
 
cibaman said:
Start with the elderly, or with children, on the top floors of the tallest buildings and work down? It obviously can't be done overnight and will be controversial but it seems to be too big a risk to wait until the cladding can be replaced.
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Possible, I suppose, but given the speed at which they are already removing cladding from buildings, for example in Camden, I imagine that is the route that will be taken.

Wonder who will pick up the tab for that?
 
BlueAnorak said:
So many risk assessments delivered by different bodies. My friend tells me construction delivery is generally HSE. Construction materials, building reg compliance and fire safety regs is generally council.
I delivered a software project for site safety inspections using mobile phones to take pics a couple of years ago. The legal requirement list was massive.
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If legal requirement as massive as you say surely there should be no problem finding out which ones have been broken especially as so many lives have been lost in this one incident.
Surely even the Government must realise that a ´lessons have been learnt´statement is insufficient in this case because the legal process assessed this before it happened and put them as requirements not guidelines.
 
SilverFox2 said:
If legal requirement as massive as you say surely there should be no problem finding out which ones have been broken especially as so many lives have been lost in this one incident.
Surely even the Government must realise that a ´lessons have been learnt´statement is insufficient in this case because the legal process assessed this before it happened and put them as requirements not guidelines.
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You'd like to think so wouldn't you.
The risk management process in business is all about box ticking though and quite often the regulations are vague and are subject to interpretation. The codes for cladding made from composite materials being especially obtuse: To say in code 0 that they mustn't add to the rate at which fire spreads through a building is just legalese bollox that the British Standards Institute tries to codify.
Cladding is put in a nowhere land between combustible and fire retardant, but what does that mean for testing cladding?
 
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This is gonna be a massive investigation into all types of building across the country, probably most building which have had a refurbishment to make them visually pleasing on the eye on the outside in the last 10 years are at risk, schools, hotels, flats, hospitals, commercial building, maybe even football grounds, cost cutting on a huge scale this country is fcked.
 
BlueAnorak said:
You'd like to think so wouldn't you.
The risk management process in business is all about box ticking though and quite often the regulations are vague and are subject to interpretation. The codes for cladding made from composite materials being especially obtuse: To say in code 0 that they mustn't add to the rate at which fire spreads through a building is just legalese bollox that the British Standards Institute tries to codify.
Cladding is put in a nowhere land between combustible and fire retardant, but what does that mean for testing cladding?
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Thanks BA, if legislation is unclear how come HSE can enforce prosecutions yet councils cannot even interpret legislation efficiently.
The same councils have absolutely no problem in enforcing speed fines etc..
However, if more than one council is using this obviously unfit for purpose cladding surely they should all suffer consequences.

Another thought occurs, surely the FB will have been exposed to fires involving non FR insulation before and surely their investigations will have allocated blame for any injuries and possibly deaths associated with it (eg toxic fumes and fire resistance).
Perhaps their findings have not been acted upon by the councils despite both FB and refurb being under their control-
 
mancityvstoke said:
Hotpoint Fridge Freezer to blame for starting fire.
Wonder where these are made?
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Mostly in Italy now. Hotpoint abandoned the UK years ago.
The power surges that were happening in the building probably blew the compressor. You can't expect white goods to survive unscathed
 
The Grenfell Tower blaze started in a Hotpoint fridge freezer and the building's insulation and cladding have failed safety tests, according to investigators.

The insulation was also found to be more flammable than the cladding tiles, police revealed.

They also said the Hotpoint FF175BP model had not been subject to any product recall and further tests were being carried out on the fridge.

The Government has ordered an immediate examination by experts of the model involved and Hotpoint said it is working with the authorities in order to assist in the investigation.

he inferno at the 24-storey building in Kensington left 79 dead or missing presumed dead.

Nine victims had so far been formally identified.

Metropolitan Police Detective Superintendent Fiona McCormack said the force will consider manslaughter charges as part of the investigation into the disaster.

Documents and materials had been seized from a "number of organisations", she added.

She said: "We are looking at every criminal offence from manslaughter onwards, we are looking at every health and safety and fire safety offence and we are reviewing every company at the moment involved in the building and refurbishment of Grenfell Tower."

http://news.sky.com/story/grenfell-tower-blaze-started-in-fridge-freezer-10924716
 
The department for business and energy is urging owners of Hotpoint fridge-freezers of models FF175BP (white) or FF175BG (grey) should call Whirlpool Corporation’s freephone hotline on 0800 316 3826 or visit its website to register for any updates.
 
So according to the publicly released information it was the insulation material behind the titles that really set the fire rampaging around the building though the tiles didn't help.
 
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The survivors are being moved around between hotels and are complaining about it,as rough as it is london hotels are packed with bookings the end of june and empty rooms are few and far between,logistically it's a nightmare but they should try and be aware as they want to stay local which is a challenge for the powers that be,no word as to when they will be going to the new places the government have brought up for them
 
My Mrs works for an energy company and she is working on this for meter purposes. Amazingly some of these flats still had gas rather than electric and national grid were there within minutes to turn the gas off. If they hadn't off been my Mrs reckons the loss of life would off been much much worse than it is
 
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