It’s Quiet 20 - What is the Wirtz that could happen?

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Bluewonder said:
It's a bit disappointing (but not remotely surprising) that we're 13 days into the transfer window, with a tough away fixture tomorrow, and are yet to sign anyone, or even be substantially linked to a midfielder.
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WOW, not for the want of trying is it, and it looks like in another 2 weeks we will have a very different looking squad, which for January would be incredible.
 
Keeper! said:
WOW, not for the want of trying is it, and it looks like in another 2 weeks we will have a very different looking squad, which for January would be incredible.
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I didn't expect a flurry of players Jan 1st but you would have thought that these deals had been worked on for months in advance. We are nearly half way through the window with games coming thick and fast. As long as they get in that's the main thing, but it doesn't mean that things could have moved quicker.
 
thegoatsthegoat said:
No, but that kind of attitude lost us a Palmer too who is at a higher level than Marmoush. Not saying Mcatee is the answer, nor if he is the level of Marmoush and that is down to us not seeing enough currently.
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I can see where you are coming from . But remember Palmer has the run of the place at Chelsea . Can shoot as many times as he likes , doesn't have to press , doesn't have to track back . His number while impressive are to be expected. Felix would have similar numbers if he started instead of Palmer.
 
thegoatsthegoat said:
I am fully aware of that, but clearly we didn't see what we had on our hands at the time and was eager to let him go and happy with the likes of Doku coming in. The point is that youngsters don't really get the chance with us, somebody from oversees who we pay a fee for then get more of a chance (Doku Palmer comparison) I am happy for Mcatee to be loaned, he won't get the minutes here that's for sure and thats because we don't give the youngsters a consistent chance. Foden was a blue and stuck it out, Lewis can't believe his luck and isn't the required standard, yet gets minutes for some unknown reason. 2 out of countless academy players since Peps arrival isn't exactly glowing is it.

From what I have seen so far Mcatee isn't quite the level we need. That might be because he isn't getting a chance to play at that level properly. I thought the same with Palmer
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Honestly, I agree.

At the time we let Palmer go (and I didn't even rate him as much as others here like twosips did, I was wrong) and before we got Doku in (who I did not know enough about), I repeatedly said I'd rather see the club properly trust Palmer to be a Mahrez replacement, than sign any player to fill a space. But properly commit to going the season with him.

It is hard to say though what came first, as he had been making noises about wanting to leave all summer, and maybe that pushed the club to sign Doku, rather than the other way round. And Palmer also came to prominence in a different position, in a team built around him. Good for him.

Not every player will be a mistake like that. If McAtee doesn't push to leave, the club won't force him. If he sticks around this season, next summer there will be a lot more change when he can meaningfully decide what his chances are.
 
Kippax Kidd said:
I can see where you are coming from . But remember Palmer has the run of the place at Chelsea . Can shoot as many times as he likes , doesn't have to press , doesn't have to track back . His number while impressive are to be expected. Felix would have similar numbers if he started instead of Palmer.
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I agree and understand why he has done so well there and very likely that wouldn't have been repeated here. The point is we had a hell of a player on our hands, if we knew it or not and we chose buying players and allowing them to have a run of games over his development. It opened my eyes to us potentially needing to give some of these lads a run rather than 10 mins here or there. His numbers aren't expected at Chelsea, they are crazy numbers and he has done very well.
 
Coatigan said:
Honestly, I agree.

At the time we let Palmer go (and I didn't even rate him as much as others here like twosips did, I was wrong) and before we got Doku in (who I did not know enough about), I repeatedly said I'd rather see the club properly trust Palmer to be a Mahrez replacement, than sign any player to fill a space. But properly commit to going the season with him.

It is hard to say though what came first, as he had been making noises about wanting to leave all summer, and maybe that pushed the club to sign Doku, rather than the other way round. And Palmer also came to prominence in a different position, in a team built around him. Good for him.

Not every player will be a mistake like that. If McAtee doesn't push to leave, the club won't force him. If he sticks around this season, next summer there will be a lot more change when he can meaningfully decide what his chances are.
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The problem is, if he sticks around for a few years as Palmer did, and only gets very limited chances, starts in cup teams with many changes to the team then we won't quite know his full potential for me. I'm not saying it will be a Palmer situation again but it could be and all because we keep playing and trusting players we buy rather than give our own a chance. It is just something I hope City are more aware of now and it is why I hope they let him go somewhere decent on loan to then get a chance with us.
 
Whilst I love what our management team has given us over the years, they do overthink some things, sometimes.

In McAtee I, genuinely, see the replacement for what we lost in Alvarez's contribution. He's here, already!

I don't understand how the super bang average Lewis can be given time to play, week in-week out (down to the injuries in midfield and below par right back positions, I know).

De Bruyne is going to need the rest, soon. Foden cannot fill that spot nor Grealsh.

For McAtee to fly, he needs the confidence and belief he can.

It's a free hit in a poor season, so let him fly.
 
thegoatsthegoat said:
The problem is, if he sticks around for a few years as Palmer did, and only gets very limited chances, starts in cup teams with many changes to the team then we won't quite know his full potential for me. I'm not saying it will be a Palmer situation again but it could be and all because we keep playing and trusting players we buy rather than give our own a chance. It is just something I hope City are more aware of now and it is why I hope they let him go somewhere decent on loan to then get a chance with us.
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Age old problem, unfortunately.

Can't think of any players that have truly made it with us after being on loan. A couple have made it through the ranks by staying. Most have gone elsewhere and been good enough for wherever they went, but without being good enough to be here, while making us money in the process. One or two have made it elsewhere, probably as many as have made it here. Which to me suggests there isn't a clear cut formula and those that make it probably would have made it regardless of where they were.
 
Bigga said:
Whilst I love what our management team has given us over the years, they do overthink some things, sometimes.

In McAtee I, genuinely, see the replacement for what we lost in Alvarez's contribution. He's here, already!

I don't understand how the super bang average Lewis can be given time to play, week in-week out (down to the injuries in midfield and below par right back positions, I know).

De Bruyne is going to need the rest, soon. Foden cannot fill that spot nor Grealsh.

For McAtee to fly, he needs the confidence and belief he can.

It's a free hit in a poor season, so let him fly.
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I don't see McAtee as being able to offer anywhere near Alvarez' contribution.

But I agree with the rest and the free hit etc.
 
Coatigan said:
I don't see McAtee as being able to offer anywhere near Alvarez' contribution.

But I agree with the rest and the free hit etc.
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Alvarez started 31 premier league games for us last season and played 5 more as a sub. Scored 11 goals and had 9 assists.

I’d argue McAtee has the capability to come close to those stats if starting the same amount of games.
 
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City64! said:
You’ve only got to look at the way United

Alvarez started 31 premier league games for us last season and played 5 more as a sub. Scored 11 goals and had 9 assists.

I’d argue McAtee has the capability to come close to those stats if starting the same amount of games.
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You could argue it, but it’s baseless. It’s a hope.

He averaged a goal every 10 games for Sheff Utd in the PL.

Alvarez had proven he could score regularly in the Argentine league and the Copa Libetadores.
 
City64! said:
You’ve only got to look at the way United

Alvarez started 31 premier league games for us last season and played 5 more as a sub. Scored 11 goals and had 9 assists.

I’d argue McAtee has the capability to come close to those stats if starting the same amount of games.
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Let's agree to disagree! McAtee and Alverez in the same breath is embarrassing, if he was half as good as Alverez, he would have been playing this season.
 
Kippax Kidd said:
Yes we have. And they've been sold again for a profit without playing a game . This is the whole point of the academy . It's a football factory . Not a fairytale .
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I think you're confusing "selling academy lads" - a fine process that I have no problem with - with the bizarre buyback clauses that we have triggered exactly once with angelino and have missed out on by NOT triggering and missing out on profit in the cases of Pedro Porro, Lavia, Rogers, Tosin and soon to be Delap when he moves to a bigger team. These clauses serve no purpose - we are not bringing these players back on the buyback clauses, and they very quickly expire as the players move to another club without us reaping the rewards.
 
Coatigan said:
I don't see McAtee as being able to offer anywhere near Alvarez' contribution.

But I agree with the rest and the free hit etc.
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Well, we don't see it because he's not had the chance to show that.

Ironically, it's a similar pathway that happened to Alvarez, who was blocked from getting games in the beginning, too, and we all know what happened there.

It's mind blowing history could repeat itself.
 
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