It's Quiet - a new dawn

[Proy]

I think its clear that Foden has impressed him, I think he'll stay, not sure about Diaz, maybe Gironna until January is a good option where he can get good game time.

Zinchenko looks phyisically ready too, he looked very good this afternoon.

I think I trust Pep's judgement over posters on here, he's a reputation from using youth, and he see's them every day, when we only get brief glimpses of them, his reputation has been earned well beyond a few bluemoon posters.

I don't disagree.

It's been a bit of a debate on here over the majority of pre-season. Lead by @Neville Kneville and others, you have to admire the level of belief in their opinion.

From my point of view, I'm a bit closer to the club in how I think things should be done. I want to see the youth given an opportunity. It's a stick we have been beaten with for a long time. It's easy to go and spend the money.

But I understand the current situation. I don't think the club are yet ready to start introducing it. It's tough at the top. Often overused terminology but it's how it is in the modern game.

I think we need another 2-3 years getting to CL finals/semi's etc. Winning domestic trophies. At that point I think we will know we have the infrastructure to support the younger players.

This summer was all about rebuilding an aged squad and so I didn't expect to see any youth this season.

My concern is the longer term. Pep doesn't like the set up the kids have over here and has gone on record saying so. I'm not sure where that leaves us, because the level the youth play at in this country doesn't look like changing any time soon. I get the feeling Pep may change his approach suited to the PL

 

[SilverFox2]

I don't disagree.

It's been a bit of a debate on here over the majority of pre-season. Lead by @Neville Kneville and others, you have to admire the level of belief in their opinion.

From my point of view, I'm a bit closer to the club in how I think things should be done. I want to see the youth given an opportunity. It's a stick we have been beaten with for a long time. It's easy to go and spend the money.

But I understand the current situation. I don't think the club are yet ready to start introducing it. It's tough at the top. Often overused terminology but it's how it is in the modern game.

I think we need another 2-3 years getting to CL finals/semi's etc. Winning domestic trophies. At that point I think we will know we have the infrastructure to support the younger players.

This summer was all about rebuilding an aged squad and so I didn't expect to see any youth this season.

My concern is the longer term. Pep doesn't like the set up the kids have over here and has gone on record saying so. I'm not sure where that leaves us, because the level the youth play at in this country doesn't look like changing any time soon. I get the feeling Pep may change his approach suited to the PL

If Pep does not like our setup for kids it does not look good for the future under his tenure..
He is unlikely to use graduates until this changes otherwise he endorses the thing he criticises.

 

[sir baconface]

Because it's the same old story every season. It's always 'too important'.

A new manager in his first season can't use any kids. A manager in his second season is consolidating, a manager in his 3rd season wants to win stuff to try & keep his job... blah blah.

I can accept it to some extent in a manager's first season. But only to some extent.

After that, it's just utter crap. And has no basis in fact, or history.

Most of the best teams have won stuff & also brought through young players, including Pep's Barca team & also Utd. Two of the most successful teams of the modern era. This is a fact.

There is no 'risk' involved apart from giving up one or two positions on the subs bench sometimes.

It's too fucking easy not to do it, & use this crap as an excuse, is the problem.

That's another ridiculous cliché used every year.

Hardly any kids in the world anywhere are 'good enough' they become 'good enough' by being given time on the pitch to learn how to be 'good enough'.

If that ridiculous cliché applied no kids would ever play, anywhere.

You can see in games like today how the kids are learning what they can & can't do at senior level & how they must change to adapt. What they need is time on the pitch to refine it. They have no way of learning it without playing.

You don't get that on the training pitch & it's all necessary in order to be 'good enough' or otherwise they rot away playing shit level football & lose their desire & edge, like most of our academy kids have done so far.

I wish this cowardly attitude amongst some fans would stop. We never used to be like this.

There are loads of teams who use kids in their squads.

City & Chelsea have just set a terrible precident by harvesting some of the best kids in the world & not using any of them.

It's not typical in football.

Congratulations on three excellent posts.

Much as I despised the old cnut, my namesake showed it could be done. Regrettably, it's the clubs who are accused of financial doping, of whom we are one, who play it safe by resorting to the cheque book to paper over every crack. This uncritical "club knows best" mentality is bollocks and failing to nourish young, home-grown talent is bad for football.

 

[Marvin]

Foden and Diaz are pushing hard in pre-season. I am expecting both these players to play in our 1st team this season.

 

[AustinBlue]

Congratulations on three excellent posts.

Much as I despised the old cnut, my namesake showed it could be done. Regrettably, it's the clubs who are accused of financial doping, of whom we are one, who play it safe by resorting to the cheque book to paper over every crack. This uncritical "club knows best" mentality is bollocks and failing to nourish young, home-grown talent is bad for football.

Your example doesn't prove your point at all. "he" left as it became clear that it couldn't be done like that any more. He was so desperate to compete with City he wouldn't even give Pogba a chance, while trotting out a number of over the hill options game after game. Pogba was widely considered the best young talent in the game at the time he left, and walked right into the Juventus starting line up.

 

[ninjamonkey]

He should put two kids in the bench every week, if 3 up or more against the West Ham's and Bournemouth's of the league they should get game time, they should be starting cup games also.
I'd rather see the likes of Diaz, Foden and Roberts get minutes than Delph, Fernando or Bony.

And if we're not winning 3-0? we're not going to smash every midtable side every game.

Lets say we line up with the starting 11 today, we've got Foden and DIaz on the bench every game as you say, then we've got Bravo too as the keeper option. We've now got 4 more options and the likes of Mendy,Walker,Fernandinho,Gundogan,Bernardo,Sterling and others to fit in. Who misses out? For balance you'd probably have Fernandinho Walker Mendy and Sterling from that so then the likes of Bernardo and Gundogan don't even make the bench every week. Then what happens when we're not winning 3-0, it's 0-0 and we look completely flat, or we're losing 1-0 from a counter and are struggling to break them down, we rely on Diaz and Foden from the bench to be the sparks to create something?

Said this in the post match thread, If they are kept, which i believe they will be, they'll get cup games, potentially dead rubber champs league group games and maybe make the bench a handful of times when injuries/suspensions are taking their toll. They're great prospects but at the big boys table in a team fighting for titles you have to treat them like any other member of the 1st team squad and ask the question, are they a better option than anybody else available? in the scenario above, that'd be Gundogan and Bernardo, but it could easily be Silva,KDB or a few others, and as good as they've been and look, they're clearly not.

Pep has handled them brilliantly so far, lets just leave him to continue handling them however he see's fit. If they see game time, he clearly believes they're currently good enough or even better than our other options, in which case great, we've got a superb player for nothing who makes us better. But if we don't see them much if at all, it will be because Pep clearly feels we have better options at that time and they'll have to bide their time

 

[sir baconface]

But I'm not underwriting a billion pounds of expenditures and my reputation as the world's best manager.

Then your definition of best manager is a narrow one, whether we're talking football or business. Very few get the luxury of spending pretty well whatever they like, on talent exclusively developed elsewhere, in order to enhance a squad that's already cost a fortune.

 

[Proy]

Your example doesn't prove your point at all. "he" left as it became clear that it couldn't be done like that any more. He was so desperate to compete with City he wouldn't even give Pogba a chance, while trotting out a number of over the hill options game after game. Pogba was widely considered the best young talent in the game at the time he left, and walked right into the Juventus starting line up.

Taking away 92, what exactly have Utd done in respect of bringing through youth players?

 

[mccity]

Taking away 92, what exactly have Utd done in respect of bringing through youth players?

Cleverley. The legend.

 

[ChaoticBluemoon]

Not sure how to post a screenshot, however have a look at Bernados reply to Mbappe's tweet, anything?