James Trafford

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urban genie said:
We have been linked with keepers from. the portuguese and french premier leagues, I would say the championship is as competative as both overall, you see many players from portugal and other leagues move to the championship before making it in the prem or the top 3 european. leagues wolves 2017 contingent for example
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Not at all. Those keepers are used to playing in Europe usually the champions league and are usually established internationals(in the case of costa), playing at the top of those leagues under intense pressure and scrutiny(for likes of Porto) is far more difficult than knocking about in front of 20,000 fans at turf moor in the championship. Mentally alone its a completely different ball game. Those keepers generally havent flopped in the past and regardless of his age Traffords first season in the prem was a flop. Big money, lots of mistakes and ultimately relegation. Not necessarily his fault but he has played a part.

Im not saying Trafford is or isnt the answer, I dont know but regardless its a huge risk. Someone mentioned this is our new transfer strategy and that does seem to be the case but it also means we are gambling on whether we will compete or not which considering where we were two years ago is a massive change in mentality for everyone at the club inc us fans.
 
Dubciteh said:
Not at all. Those keepers are used to playing in Europe usually the champions league and are usually established internationals(in the case of costa), playing at the top of those leagues under intense pressure and scrutiny(for likes of Porto) is far more difficult than knocking about in front of 20,000 fans at turf moor in the championship. Mentally alone its a completely different ball game. Those keepers generally havent flopped in the past and regardless of his age Traffords first season in the prem was a flop. Big money, lots of mistakes and ultimately relegation. Not necessarily his fault but he has played a part.

Im not saying Trafford is or isnt the answer, I dont know but regardless its a huge risk. Someone mentioned this is our new transfer strategy and that does seem to be the case but it also means we are gambling on whether we will compete or not which considering where we were two years ago is a massive change in mentality for everyone at the club inc us fans.
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I don't think that 'mentality' applies to the Marmoush, Cherki, Reijnders, and Ait-Nouri transfers. Experience of playing under pressure is only 1 attribute of many required.
 
Dubciteh said:
Those keepers generally havent flopped in the past and regardless of his age
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how on earth can you disregard his age? Name me an 18 year old first choice keeper in the premier league. Bear in mind he played for a terrible Burnley side that didn’t defend as well.

Most, if not all keepers weren’t playing every week in the top leagues as teenagers.
 
Marvin. said:
I don't think that 'mentality' applies to the Marmoush, Cherki, Reijnders, and Ait-Nouri transfers. Experience of playing under pressure is only 1 attribute of many required.
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All them have played and succeeded at a far higher level than Trafford. Its not even close, i actually cant really see your point here? You cant compare playing for Ac Milan in Serie A, in europe and the dutch national team in international tournaments with an uncapped international who has one season as a flop in the premier league and one other season in the championship? I really dont understand your point.
 
Earlyriser said:
Re the age issue. Haaland was 21 when he signed for City. I would suggest that the pressure on a centre-forward is almost as great as that on a goalie
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Your point on age is right, however the two players are not comparable in terms of where they are at in their careers.

Before Haaland joined City, he was one of the most highly rated strikers in Europe, already having a phenomenal goal scoring record in both top flight football and the Champions League. All transfers carry risk, but signing Haaland was probably as low risk as it gets.

Trafford has had one season in top flight football, in which he looked like a fish out of water and was replaced by Muric, who is awful. But he's clearly kicked on and developed from there, getting good reviews in the Championship and for England at U21 level. But he has nowhere near the top flight experience and pedigree in his back pocket that Haaland did when he signed.

Trafford feels like a project investment and I'd not be surprised to see Ortega start the season as number 1, whilst Trafford finds his feet and gets eased into the squad, perhaps being number 1 by the season's end.
 
bluemc said:
Your point on age is right, however the two players are not comparable in terms of where they are at in their careers.

Before Haaland joined City, he was one of the most highly rated strikers in Europe, already having a phenomenal goal scoring record in both top flight football and the Champions League. All transfers carry risk, but signing Haaland was probably as low risk as it gets.

Trafford has had one season in top flight football, in which he looked like a fish out of water and was replaced by Muric, who is awful. But he's clearly kicked on and developed from there, getting good reviews in the Championship and for England at U21 level. But he has nowhere near the top flight experience and pedigree in his back pocket that Haaland did when he signed.

Trafford feels like a project investment and I'd not be surprised to see Ortega start the season as number 1, whilst Trafford finds his feet and gets eased into the squad, perhaps being number 1 by the season's end.
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I would rather have James mcatee start the season in net than Ortega, Ortega is shite
 
Mayor West said:
Can you imagine if this guys name was Juan El Traffido and was the next big Spanish wonder keeper, how different the replies would be!
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Depends, does Juan El Traffido also have no full international caps, with the majority of his 1st team career having been played at a village team in lower league football? Doesn't sound like the credentials of "the next big Spanish wonder keeper" to me.
 
Gaz76 said:
I would rather have James mcatee start the season in net than Ortega, Ortega is shite
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Ortega isn't good enough to be a long term number 1 at the level we need, but he's not shite.

But he's tried, trusted and familiar as far as Pep goes. Taking away the sentimentality of him being home grown and a City fan, I just don't see City/Pep signing a lad who has had one good season in the Championship and throwing him straight in as first choice keeper for a team who has aspirations of winning the Premier League title.
 
bluemc said:
Depends, does Juan El Traffido also have no full international caps, with the majority of his 1st team career having been played at a village team in lower league football? Doesn't sound like the credentials of "the next big Spanish wonder keeper" to me.
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Depends how you judge young players. Adam Wharton for example in the championship - it was pretty clear he was going to be a top player.

Or do we only ever sign ready made players?

We’ve signed plenty of unproven youngsters recently and saw potential - Khusanov or Reis for example
 
Dubciteh said:
All them have played and succeeded at a far higher level than Trafford. It’s not even close, i actually cant really see your point here? You cant compare playing for Ac Milan in Serie A, in europe and the dutch national team in international tournaments with an uncapped international who has one season as a flop in the premier league and one other season in the championship? I really dont understand your point.
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Presume you said the same about Doku, savinho, Reis, Khusanov who all were unproven and didn’t play at the highest level
 
Cheadle_hulmeBlue said:
Depends how you judge young players. Adam Wharton for example in the championship - it was pretty clear he was going to be a top player.

Or do we only ever sign ready made players?

We’ve signed plenty of unproven youngsters recently and saw potential - Khusanov or Reis for example
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Oh absolutely - but then neither Khusanov or Reis were trusted to be a major part of the first team straight away, either. They couldn't even get a proper look in during a pre season tournament in America.

So if they're the benchmark who you are comparing to, why would anyone expect Trafford to come in with his potential and be made 1st choice keeper straight away?
 
Cheadle_hulmeBlue said:
Presume you said the same about Doku, savinho, Reis, Khusanov who all were unproven and didn’t play at the highest level
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The same Doku and Savinho who plenty on here would happily see sold tomorrow, and Reis/Khusanov who are getting splinters in their arses?

The expectation at City is such that it is very difficult to make the step from not playing at the "top level" to going straight into the 1st team and fitting in.

If Trafford is seen as "potential" then he's likely to be handled in the same way as the four players you mentioned, none of whom are guaranteed 1st team starters.
 
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