Keir Starmer

[threespires]

While I wholeheartedly agree that Johnson is indeed a whopper and a ****, I've refrained from liking this post because I don't believe anyone should ever feel ashamed for voting for someone who then goes on to prove to be a total let down. I remember @Rascal saying something similar a while back about voting for Blair in 2001, and then wishing he hadn't because we invaded Iraq a couple of years later. I said the same to Russ - he had no way of knowing what was going to happen further down the line when he cast his vote for Blair so there's absolutely no point in beating one self up about it.

Politics will always be like this. At some point in our lives, many of us will have the experience of voting for something or someone then wish we hadn't. For the record, I voted for Brexit (wish I hadn't) but I didn't vote for Johnson because there were clear red lines in the run up to the election. The main one being when he unlawfully prorogued parliament. That set huge alarm bells ringing, although I wasn't too enamoured with him before that and was unlikely to vote for him anyway. Unfortunately, none of the other candidates did it for me either. Like you, I've also got red lines about Corbyn, and the Lib Dems (my go to option in 2015 and 2017 because the 2 main parties were pissing me off) were off the table as Swinson's threat to simply cancel Brexit without even putting it to a second referendum (something I was open to as I'd long since lost faith in Brexit) just didn't sit right with me. I still turned up at the polling station though and scrawled "NONE" across my ballot paper in big fuck off letters!

I agree it serves no purpose to be piling into people who were in effect lied too and I think people who show themselves capable of changing their minds are to be applauded at a time when there's many forces encouraging people to double down on views rather than be open.

The interesting thing about Johnson it that there was lots of evidence in the public domain that clearly pointed to the fact that he was utterly untrustworthy and unfit for office but he/they managed to obscure this in a sea of bullshit and deflection that in past eras he would probably not have been able to. It's off topic of this thread but we are well and truly living in the age of disinformation and division as a business model and unless we can find a way out of it we are in deep shit.

 

[bobmcfc]

I think the X factor has fucked up how this country sees voting.

You don’t vote for the best person, you vote for the most entertaining.

Therefore both chart music and politics are full of the wrong sort of people.

That's exactly how I think it is. I don't pretend to have a great knowledge of politics but I said ages ago that too many people now support a political party like it's their football team. Arguing with the other side for the sake of tribalism and it's shocking. See many of the worst of them with flags in their Twitter handles and it actually feels like they are paid to jump on any Tory/Boris negativity brought up.
I'm sure Starmer isn't perfect and there will 100% be things I won't agree with but my whole 41 years on this planet, despite all their chances and years in power I can honestly say the Conservatives have never done anything I can point to that has been beneficial for working class families like mine. I've never seen any kind of levelling or lifting. Feels like they rob from the poor to make up all their giving to the rich.

 

[BrianW]

I'll freely admit, I don't like Keir Starmer.
However, compared to Boris Johnson he is St.Francis of Assisi. And our realistic choice of PM is between these men. I would vote for Alex Ferguson or Jurgen Klopp if it meant getting rid of Johnson.

 

[west didsblue]

I'll freely admit, I don't like Keir Starmer.
However, compared to Boris Johnson he is St.Francis of Assisi. And our realistic choice of PM is between these men. I would vote for Alex Ferguson or Jurgen Klopp if it meant getting rid of Johnson.

Out of interest why don't you like him?

 

[BrianW]

Out of interest why don't you like him?

I find him dull, uninspiring and devoid of any obvious policy initiatives. Frankly, I have no idea what he stands for, except being 'Not Tory'. On a more positive note, he does exude an air of vague competence and relative honesty, which puts him above Johnson.

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

I find him dull, uninspiring and devoid of any obvious policy initiatives. Frankly, I have no idea what he stands for, except being 'Not Tory'. On a more positive note, he does exude an air of vague competence and relative honesty, which puts him above Johnson.

When it comes to politics, dull is exactly what I want, mate.

Interesting you say about policy initiatives and how Labour seem devoid of them yet Starmer, and his front bench, have been pushing lots of policies that don’t really get the news that they deserve. His lastest was to pull money from massive profits the energy company’s were making to offset higher bills for the working family. That’s a huge policy but those who could make a big deal for it in the media don’t want to see it as their owners are very much in the ’Keep our people rich, keep your people poor’.

We are nearing a period where we are going to see the worst conditions this country has seen since the 70s and before that, the WWII. At least after WWII people pulled together, these days, with all the divisiveness, people will pull further apart.

 

[Two Gun Bob]

When it comes to politics, dull is exactly what I want, mate.

Interesting you say about policy initiatives and how Labour seem devoid of them yet Starmer, and his front bench, have been pushing lots of policies that don’t really get the news that they deserve. His lastest was to pull money from massive profits the energy company’s were making to offset higher bills for the working family. That’s a huge policy but those who could make a big deal for it in the media don’t want to see it as their owners are very much in the ’Keep our people rich, keep your people poor’.

We are nearing a period where we are going to see the worst conditions this country has seen since the 70s and before that, the WWII. At least after WWII people pulled together, these days, with all the divisiveness, people will pull further apart.

I see him as a politician trying to break the mold by distancing himself from those rabid left wing obsenities, therefore more power to his Dull Elbow. Yours sincerly .. Currently Dissillusioned.

Cometh the hour cometh the man and I actually think he has a sniff and aura of moral decency that would for once make me get off my blue backside and mark an X in that alternate box.

I'm sick to my stomach of the deceipt that currently infests and pervades every sinew of my being from a corrupt governance that cares little for it's electorate .. so maybe it is time for change .. we shall see.

 

[Rascal]

I see him as a man trying to break the mold by distancing himself from those rabid left wing obsenities,

Why is it that distancing yourself from the "rabid left" is admirable for Starmer, but nobody ever asks Johnson to distance himself from the "rabid right"

We live in a country where it is now acceptable to be a Libertarian fuckwit, but not acceptable to be a Socialist.

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

I see him as a man trying to break the mold by distancing himself from those rabid left wing obsenities, therefore more power to his Dull Elbow. Yours sincerly .. Currently Dissillusioned.

Cometh the hour cometh the man and I actually think he has a sniff and aura of moral decency that would for once make me get off my blue backside and mark an X in that alternate box.

I'm sick to my stomach of the deceipt that currently infests and pervades every sinew of my being from a corrupt governance that cares little for it's electorate .. so maybe it is time for change .. we shall see.

Strong views, good to see people being engaged.

 

[mat]

Must he getting boring for Starmer in PMQs now.

Asks a question about fraud which Johnson agrees. Then follows up with all the fraud being allowed by him and Sunak.

 

[Two Gun Bob]

Why is it that distancing yourself from the "rabid left" is admirable for Starmer, but nobody ever asks Johnson to distance himself from the "rabid right"

We live in a country where it is now acceptable to be a Libertarian fuckwit, but not acceptable to be a Socialist.

Not admirable but more essential if you ever want to see a socialist government in power. To your good self it may well be a dumbed down version of your politics but it's a step in the right direction if Labour are to set foot in Nos 10 again.

I remember vaguely a post saying you no longer recognised the party that all your life you affiliated with and to say you were disppointed would be an understatement. Was the electorate having an off day Rascal when they went to the poll in 2019 or were they sending out a clear message to corbynism, rascisim, wokyism and all the excitable factions that infest Labour at every level.

The worst drubbing in my grandchildrens lifetime, the worst drubbing in my lifetime and even the worst drubbing in my mothers life time and once again the far lefts appeal to the nation fell on deaf ears. You will never be able to make some understand or accept something if they are too stubborn or unwilling to learn or notice. You can present facts and try to reason all you want, but.. if their mind is made up. Reminds me of the idiom "There's non so blind as those that will not see"

Has there ever been a better oppertunity to take back the labour heartlands than the here and now with such a deceitful pitiful band of miscreants in the oppositions bench. Labour is starting to edge it in the polls but should actually be landsliding in this current climate. I dont know what the answer is for Labour, maybe they should listen to Mr Blair who last year issued a few soundbites to chew over to repair the credibility factor by pushing far left margins to the sideline.

As a non political animal and merely gestating from the sidelines I see Mr Starmer as a pleasant affable human who is trying to distance himself and his party from the miscreants that led them to that worst defeat in living memory .. so more power to his elbow.

I have voted Conservative all my life except once which was for Labour. Everyone is baying for Boris's blood but it's not just Boris who attended the parties and they should all hang their heads in eternal shame. To see our Queen (old bag) attending the funeral of her late husband and sat on her own mourning his passing really brought home to me the selfish actions of our govenment. Echoed of course right across the country as people died estranged from their families for the good of the nation as together we fought the covidial menace.

As @The Future's Blue! mentioned we are nearing a period where we are going to see the worst conditions this country has seen since the 70s facing rampant inflation and all our goverment has to offer our needy is a force fed paltry £200 loan and this in the face of the obcene profit margins that Shell and BP have just published. I like Conservatism really I do but It would not take much of a tipping point to see me cast my vote differently and I guess that may apply to many out there Right Now in disillutioned land.

Im afraid I will not be able to engage with you at any real level of political jive as my brain was only formatted at GCSE level but do wish you well comrade on your journey to the promised land and social injustice wherever that may lie.

 

[Don Karleone]

Nobody cared when Corbyn was getting death threats and assaulted. Funny that.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Not admirable but more essential if you ever want to see a socialist government in power again. To your good self it may well be a dumbed down version of your politics but it's a step in the right direction if ever you wish to see Nos 10 again.

I remember vaguely a post saying you no longer recognised the party that all your life you affiliated with and to say you were disppointed would be an understatement. Was the electorate having an off day Rascal when they went to the poll in 2019 or were they sending out a clear message to corbynism, rascisim, wokyism and all the excitable factions that infest Labour at every level.

The worst drubbing in my grandchildrens lifetime, the worst drubbing in my lifetime and even the worst drubbing in my mothers life time and still the far lefts appeal to our nation falls upon deaf ears. You will never be able to make some understand or accept something if they are too stubborn or unwilling to learn or notice. You can present facts and try to reason all you want, but.. if their mind is made up. Reminds me of the idiom "There's non so blind as those that will not see"

Has there ever been a better oppertunity to take back the labour heartlands than the here and now with such a deceitful pitiful band of miscreants in the oppositions bench. Labour is starting to edge it in the polls but should actually be landsliding in this current climate. I dont know what the answer is for Labour? maybe they should listen to Mr Blair who last year issued out a few soundbites for you to chew on to repair that credibility factor by pushing its far left margins to the sideline.

As a non political animal and merely gestating from the sidelines I see Mr Starmer as a pleasant affable human being who is trying to distance himself and his party from the miscreants that led them to their worst defeat in living memory .. so more power to his elbow.

I have voted Conservative all my life except once which was for Labour. Everyone is baying for Boris's blood but it's not just Boris who attended the parties and they should all hang their heads in eternal shame. To see our Queen (old bag) attending the funeral of her late husband and sat on her own mourning his passing really brought home to me the selfish actions of our govenment. Echoed of course right across the country as people died estranged from their families for the good of the nation as together we fought that covidial menace.

As @The Future's Blue! mentioned we are nearing a period where we are going to see the worst conditions this country has seen since the 70s facing rampant inflation and all my goverment has to offer our needy is a force fed paltry £200 loan repayable over 5 years and this in the face of the obcene profit margins that Shell and BP have just published. I like Conservatism really I do but It would not take much of a tipping point to see me cast my vote differently and I guess that may apply to many out there Right Now in disillutioned land.

Im afraid I will not be able to engage with you at any real level of political jive as my brain was only formatted at GCSE level but do wish you well comrade on your journey to the promised land and social injustice wherever that may lie.

To answer your question, a better opportunity to get into number 10 for labour existed at the previous ge and Corbyn was only prevented from doing so by a the quirks of our electoral system.

 

[Postman Pep]

Nobody cared when Corbyn was getting death threats and assaulted. Funny that.

The collective pearl clutching of the Westminster bubble because a few unhinged idiots shouted some nasty things at Keith has been a sight to behold. Bleating on about gutter politics and the dangers of unfounded smears without a hint of irony. Pot and kettle.

 

[west didsblue]

Nobody cared when Corbyn was getting death threats and assaulted. Funny that.

Someone threw an egg at him and got locked up. This was Brexit related.
Someone else spat at him and got a community order. It was accepted that this was not politically motivated.
Can't find any stories about a mob descending on him and abusing him using insults that the Prime Minister had used a few days earlier.

 

[Postman Pep]

In other news



Despite their perilous finances Labour seem to be saying shut the door on the way out



One theory doing the rounds is that the gap will be plugged by the Tony Blair foundation. A corporate funded Labour party what a time to be alive!

 

[mat]

Nobody cared when Corbyn was getting death threats and assaulted. Funny that.

Indeed.

I recall a blairite loving comedian making jokes about it.

 

[joe123]

In other news



Despite their perilous finances Labour seem to be saying shut the door on the way out



One theory doing the rounds is that the gap will be plugged by the Tony Blair foundation. A corporate funded Labour party what a time to be alive!

Obviously the unions are entitled to channel their funds and support wherever they see fit. However, I'd argue it's an incredibly short-sighted view to think that by hindering Starmer they are acting in their members interests as all they're doing is facilitating more Tory rule.

 

[Mr Kobayashi]

Someone threw an egg at him and got locked up. This was Brexit related.
Someone else spat at him and got a community order. It was accepted that this was not politically motivated.
Can't find any stories about a mob descending on him and abusing him using insults that the Prime Minister had used a few days earlier.

What about the people that spent everyday outside his house, or following him down Westminster at night until he got in his son's car?

 

[Postman Pep]

Obviously the unions are entitled to channel their funds and support wherever they see fit. However, I'd argue it's an incredibly short-sighted view to think that by hindering Starmer they are acting in their members interests as all they're doing is facilitating more Tory rule.

I'll turn your argument on it's head and ask isn't this 'destroy the village to save it' approach of the new management incredibly shortsighted and if this strategy fails all they are doing is facilitating more Tory rule?