Liverpool Thread - 2023/24

[Coatigan]

There's absolutely nothing dishonest about posting a thread from the time the song first got national attention to point out that the overwhelming response on bluemoon at the time - before City fans started singing it - was that it was a scummy song to sing.

The problem here is that you want to believe in a myth that the song was completely fine and respectable and then Liverpool and their fans gaslit the world into thinking it was about Hillsborough. Unfortunately for you, that's a complete lie, and you can see from the over 100 comments in that thread that people think it's scumbag behaviour.

This is a completely genuine response now, sarcasm and snide bickers aside.

It is not dishonest to point out hypocrisy, granted.

Claiming 'everyone' was saying it on that thread though, is. It is just the other extreme of my own biased take.

I maybe pushed it to an extreme, but my point does stand. There are clearly people arguing it even back then. And then a few saying nothing at all, which you take as it being about Hillsborough and I take as not. Somebody saying they are both as bad as each other and quick to cry tragedy, is not claiming the song is about Hillsborough, for example.

Even so, it was reactions to an article that first came out, you of all people should know stances change with subsequent articles, as you have done many times here.

As to what my own problem or take is, I have said multiple times, I don't think the song should be sung.

Not because I think it is about Hillsborough. I don't. I 100% believe that it was about Luis Suarez, and everything there, the timing, the sequence of events totally checks out. And it has since only come back because of Liverpool's moans about Uefa, rhe FA, spending, other clubs business, other songs, trying to sneak into Paris without tickets and blaming authorities for their reaction, and other examples that it now seem to trigger it amongst many clubs. I fully acknowledge the FA and BBC have accepted the claim it is a 'tragedy chant', Liverpool have indeed made that stick. And for that it shouldn't be sung. And partly because I'm not keen on borrowing Utd's songs. Doesn't mean I have to agree with their take.

Edit. I see you have done your usual fundamental edit again. Not going to go back, as I responded to the post at the time. I'm just surprised you didn't edit your use of 'everyone' out as well.

 

[horlock_was_super]

So let's just imagine that the so-called tragedy chanting stops - jolly nice chaps those scouse scallywags.
Next time they commit (yet another) dubious act are we all supposed to just stand by and watch and say nothing. It's what they do - they are just having fun after all.
We know what they've done time and time and time again and no doubt will continue to do so. They're being given an easy ride due to the institutional cover ups that took place. Nothing more.
It's just......
Read the full report on the Aberfan disaster - the contempt with which those people were treated after watching their whole community and a generation effectively wiped out in a single morning. Dignified.
Read the accounts of countless young people abused by the state in establishment run care homes. Traumatised for ever.
Look into how the army personnel were treated after the Bikini Atoll tests. Contaminated by lord alone knows.
Consider the way in which the Windrush generation have and are still being treated by the British government. Denied their very existence!
I could go on - the list is never ending. It's what the establishment does from the year dot.
Hillsborough was an accident waiting to happen unfortunately, but it is no more of an abhorrence than any other tragedy that has happened at football matches - as true football supporters and decent human beings we all stand behind them - just like we do with the Burnden Park, Ibrox, Bradford and (let's mention the elephant in the room) Heysel tragedies - they were all just ordinary people doing what they enjoyed and lost their lives tragically. We have seen down the years stadium tragedies in far flung places we shrug and move on and it's never mentioned again. I am not saying that is what we should do with Hillsborough, but we shouldn't allow it to overshadow every other awful happening.

Everton fans don't behave like this - they don't mock Hillsborough. Yet Steaue Bucharest banners - fine.
Harold Shipman songs (yes I know Everton fans have too) fair game.
Stabbing gestures towards Leeds fans - high jinks.

I lived through the 80's it was carnage in the North and they were no worse off than anybody else when it came to mass unemployment so the whole Royal family/Thatcher shite is just that - shite!

Perhaps it's a Mancunian trait our take on things are usually - it's awful, take a moment and then move on and never forget.

Rant over.

 

[mancboy]

As i have previously said whether it is about hillsborough or not is largely irrelevant, yes its a sad event but we cannot and should not stop doing things or chanting things because liverpool or anyone else doesnt like it, its a slippery slope where we let other clubs dictate what we can and cannot sing or what we should and shouldnt do based on what they feel about it.

Personally i dont think liverpool fans should ever be let in our stadium again solely down to the pint throwing incident, and thats if you ignore all the other incidents but that will never happen because its just my opinion that i have an intense dislike of scousers, the same ethos applies here.

 

[Scaring Europe to Death]

It’s Never Their Fault - Republik Of Mancunia: A Manchester United Blog

Four minutes in to Manchester United's 4-0 win over Wigan, the Stretford End starting singing the Luis Suarez "racist bastard" chant. The chant that followed was "always the victims, it's never their fault". This is a standard occurrence at Old Trafford and United's away games, dating back to...

therepublikofmancunia.com

I stumbled upon this article recently. Not necessarily agreeing or disagreeing, but it's worth a read, if only to learn about the Michael Shields Royal Pardon

 

[halfcenturyup]

There's absolutely nothing dishonest about posting a thread from the time the song first got national attention to point out that the overwhelming response on bluemoon at the time - before City fans started singing it - was that it was a scummy song to sing.

The problem here is that you want to believe in a myth that the song was completely fine and respectable and then Liverpool and their fans gaslit the world into thinking it was about Hillsborough. Unfortunately for you, that's a complete lie, and you can see from the over 100 comments in that thread that people think it's scumbag behaviour.





























































2 comments you said.

What happened between then, when everyone thought it was heinous and now when people want to rewrite history and claim it was never about Hillsborough and saying it does is part of a Liverpool media campaign? City and Liverpool became rivals for trophies, and City fans started singing it.

And I'm sure you'll get lots of likes and support, because there's loads of people on here who want to beleive the lie to justify their own singing of it. The truth is there in black and white though, when this song started, City fans knew it was about Hillsborough and they thought it was vile.

:( Kudos for the commitment. A couple of comments, though.

First, a lot of the replies criticised the timing rather than the connection, with a few noting it had been sung the previous season too. Only two inputs from United fans that I could see. One at the match, indirect, saying it was about Suarez/Evra, the other, not match going as far as I could tell, who thought it was offensive.

Second, the dynamic City/ United and City/ Liverpool has changed over the ten years. United fans could have sung God Save the Queen and we would have found reason to call them scum. The bastards. Now it's Liverpool who are the scum.

At the end of the day, only the people who chant Victims/ fault know why they sing it. Pretty clearly on here, I think, people who sing it aren't referencing Hillsborough. That's good enough for me.

Then again, you may remember I thought the rent boys chant was fine too ......

 

[Mad Eyed Screamer]

Just read on the BBC Luton Town bending over backwards to apologise.
Have Liverpool ever made a statement about their fans behaviour at City when the young girl was hit by the bottle?
I recall the half hearted comment after the bus was attacked

 

[mexico1970]

Just read on the BBC Luton Town bending over backwards to apologise.
Have Liverpool ever made a statement about their fans behaviour at City when the young girl was hit by the bottle?
I recall the half hearted comment after the bus was attacked

All other clubs will comply and feign fealty to the scouse grief merchants.

 

[Mad Eyed Screamer]

Tragedy chanting you say?
This from their leading supporters group.....

 

[mexico1970]

Tragedy chanting you say?
This from their leading supporters group.....

Cheeky chappies.

 

[hello]

:( Kudos for the commitment. A couple of comments, though.

First, a lot of the replies criticised the timing rather than the connection, with a few noting it had been sung the previous season too. Only two inputs from United fans that I could see. One at the match, indirect, saying it was about Suarez/Evra, the other, not match going as far as I could tell, who thought it was offensive.

Second, the dynamic City/ United and City/ Liverpool has changed over the ten years. United fans could have sung God Save the Queen and we would have found reason to call them scum. The bastards. Now it's Liverpool who are the scum.

At the end of the day, only the people who chant Victims/ fault know why they sing it. Pretty clearly on here, I think, people who sing it aren't referencing Hillsborough. That's good enough for me.

Then again, you may remember I thought the rent boys chant was fine too ......

You seem to be alluding that only one of the red shites can be scum at a time. My advice is to enlarge your capacity to consider multiple sides scum simultaneously with these 2 permanently occupying the top 2 spots.