Glad it's not just me! So glad to read a sensible post. The Brendan Dassey evidence is critical, and despite the uproar about an 'appropriate adult' (an Avery!) not being present, he was indeed clear and detailed. Taking away his recorded interviews, just look at him giving evidence in the court room at his trial and listen to the shite he says. He 'could have got it from a book' he said. Well could have and did do are two distinct things, and he does not read many books Im sure. It was a feeble defence. Listen to the phone calls to/from his mum after he was charged. She was certain Avery had done it, immediately. They were all different when a special camera crew with an agenda are in their house years after the fact. What the programme makers did was focus on people and personalities and characters, and perceived grudges and wrongdoing. It is absolutely not a fair balanced documentary, as some posters have mentioned, there is other evidence not mentioned at all in that series. Guilty as fuck wrong uns, the pair of them. But that isnt as exciting and scandalous as a skewed seriesI just can't see how anyone can see Avery as being innocent. Remember, the whole series is a piece of propaganda set up by the Avery's, so it's incredibly biased in nature.
They've basically argued that he was framed but can only speculate to how he was framed. The blood sample they found to be 'tampered' wasn't tampered with in the first place, never mind planted by an officer. They had Steven's DNA in the car, it wasn't planted so how else did it get there? They had Teresa's DNA on the bullet they found in the garage. They found her bones in the burn pit outside the house which also had her personal items and strands of her jeans that she was wearing that day. They found the key with his DNA on it next to his bed that was concealed in a bedside table. The RAV4 on his property. The bullet with Teresa's DNA on it came from the gun that was above his bed - if anyone had taken it surely he'd have noticed?
The big thing is the Brendan Dassey testimoney. He told them that Steven answered the door and was sweaty, they found his sweat on the hood hatch of the RAV4. Brendan told the police that after he'd shot her, they'd driven her to a local pond to dump the body, but it had dried up and that's when they got back to the Avery property and burned her. He'd told the police that he'd used handcuffs to tie her to the bed whilst they raped her, they found he had bought a pair of handcuffs of the internet a few weeks before. Dassey told them they shot her 3 times in the head, the bullet holes in her cranium were on the left side (Where dassey told the investigators they had shot her). He was incredibly thorough in the information he gave to the police. Just try and read his full interview and re-think whether or not he was coaxed into it.
On top of all of this it's come out that Steven sexually abused Brendan and one of his cousins. He had a history of sexual harassment offenses, including masturbating infront of his cousin. He had a history of domestic violence towards women (letters he wrote to his wife and allegedly battering his girlfriend). They had proof that he was calling Teresa of a witheld number the day of the murder and that he'd been infatuated with her (Previously he'd answered the door to her wearing just a towel, which lead her to ask her employers to never send her there again). His former inmates confessed that he had described a sex dungeon he wanted to build when he got out and that he'd told them he knew how to 'get rid of a body'. He'd tortured a cat by dousing it in petrol and throwing it into a fire. He'd committed burglaries, pointed a gun at his cousin after running her off the road.
He literally is a wrong'un. There is no reasonable doubt in my mind that he committed the crime. To accuse a police officer of risking his entire life to frame him is ludicrous and there isn't an ounce of factual evidence to prove it could have been anyone other than Steven Avery and Dassey. They had the motive (lust), the murder weapon and the DNA evidence. What more can a prosecution provide than that to prove he's guilty? If the defense were so sure he was framed they should have pursued it further - there was no more evidence because it didn't happen.
I just can't see how anyone can see Avery as being innocent. Remember, the whole series is a piece of propaganda set up by the Avery's, so it's incredibly biased in nature.
They've basically argued that he was framed but can only speculate to how he was framed. The blood sample they found to be 'tampered' wasn't tampered with in the first place, never mind planted by an officer. They had Steven's DNA in the car, it wasn't planted so how else did it get there? They had Teresa's DNA on the bullet they found in the garage. They found her bones in the burn pit outside the house which also had her personal items and strands of her jeans that she was wearing that day. They found the key with his DNA on it next to his bed that was concealed in a bedside table. The RAV4 on his property. The bullet with Teresa's DNA on it came from the gun that was above his bed - if anyone had taken it surely he'd have noticed?
The big thing is the Brendan Dassey testimoney. He told them that Steven answered the door and was sweaty, they found his sweat on the hood hatch of the RAV4. Brendan told the police that after he'd shot her, they'd driven her to a local pond to dump the body, but it had dried up and that's when they got back to the Avery property and burned her. He'd told the police that he'd used handcuffs to tie her to the bed whilst they raped her, they found he had bought a pair of handcuffs of the internet a few weeks before. Dassey told them they shot her 3 times in the head, the bullet holes in her cranium were on the left side (Where dassey told the investigators they had shot her). He was incredibly thorough in the information he gave to the police. Just try and read his full interview and re-think whether or not he was coaxed into it.
On top of all of this it's come out that Steven sexually abused Brendan and one of his cousins. He had a history of sexual harassment offenses, including masturbating infront of his cousin. He had a history of domestic violence towards women (letters he wrote to his wife and allegedly battering his girlfriend). They had proof that he was calling Teresa of a witheld number the day of the murder and that he'd been infatuated with her (Previously he'd answered the door to her wearing just a towel, which lead her to ask her employers to never send her there again). His former inmates confessed that he had described a sex dungeon he wanted to build when he got out and that he'd told them he knew how to 'get rid of a body'. He'd tortured a cat by dousing it in petrol and throwing it into a fire. He'd committed burglaries, pointed a gun at his cousin after running her off the road.
He literally is a wrong'un. There is no reasonable doubt in my mind that he committed the crime. To accuse a police officer of risking his entire life to frame him is ludicrous and there isn't an ounce of factual evidence to prove it could have been anyone other than Steven Avery and Dassey. They had the motive (lust), the murder weapon and the DNA evidence. What more can a prosecution provide than that to prove he's guilty? If the defense were so sure he was framed they should have pursued it further - there was no more evidence because it didn't happen.
I just can't see how anyone can see Avery as being innocent. Remember, the whole series is a piece of propaganda set up by the Avery's, so it's incredibly biased in nature.
They've basically argued that he was framed but can only speculate to how he was framed. The blood sample they found to be 'tampered' wasn't tampered with in the first place, never mind planted by an officer. They had Steven's DNA in the car, it wasn't planted so how else did it get there? They had Teresa's DNA on the bullet they found in the garage. They found her bones in the burn pit outside the house which also had her personal items and strands of her jeans that she was wearing that day. They found the key with his DNA on it next to his bed that was concealed in a bedside table. The RAV4 on his property. The bullet with Teresa's DNA on it came from the gun that was above his bed - if anyone had taken it surely he'd have noticed?
The big thing is the Brendan Dassey testimoney. He told them that Steven answered the door and was sweaty, they found his sweat on the hood hatch of the RAV4. Brendan told the police that after he'd shot her, they'd driven her to a local pond to dump the body, but it had dried up and that's when they got back to the Avery property and burned her. He'd told the police that he'd used handcuffs to tie her to the bed whilst they raped her, they found he had bought a pair of handcuffs of the internet a few weeks before. Dassey told them they shot her 3 times in the head, the bullet holes in her cranium were on the left side (Where dassey told the investigators they had shot her). He was incredibly thorough in the information he gave to the police. Just try and read his full interview and re-think whether or not he was coaxed into it.
On top of all of this it's come out that Steven sexually abused Brendan and one of his cousins. He had a history of sexual harassment offenses, including masturbating infront of his cousin. He had a history of domestic violence towards women (letters he wrote to his wife and allegedly battering his girlfriend). They had proof that he was calling Teresa of a witheld number the day of the murder and that he'd been infatuated with her (Previously he'd answered the door to her wearing just a towel, which lead her to ask her employers to never send her there again). His former inmates confessed that he had described a sex dungeon he wanted to build when he got out and that he'd told them he knew how to 'get rid of a body'. He'd tortured a cat by dousing it in petrol and throwing it into a fire. He'd committed burglaries, pointed a gun at his cousin after running her off the road.
He literally is a wrong'un. There is no reasonable doubt in my mind that he committed the crime. To accuse a police officer of risking his entire life to frame him is ludicrous and there isn't an ounce of factual evidence to prove it could have been anyone other than Steven Avery and Dassey. They had the motive (lust), the murder weapon and the DNA evidence. What more can a prosecution provide than that to prove he's guilty? If the defense were so sure he was framed they should have pursued it further - there was no more evidence because it didn't happen.
I just hope you're never in a jury if I'm on a charge.
1. The blood tube was found to have been tampered with and the tests done by the FBI looking for EDTA in the blood were unconventional and unverified and Averys people were not allowed to carry their own tests. The FBI tests only proved that EDTA was not found in the blood, not that it was not there.
2. As far as I recollect Stevens DNA was never found in the vehicle.
3. The DNA on the bullet was said to be Teresa's BUT there was no DNA available for Averys team to test as they failed to keep the sample, as they should have done.
4. The key was found by local police who should not have been there looking as it was thought they had an agenda. However it was found on the FIFTH search of a small bedroom, not. The first second third or fourth. Not only that it was found in plain view and unbidden.
5. The key had Averys DNA (was it placed there) but importantly it didn't have hers... on a car key that she uses.
6. The bloodbath that allegedly happened I. The bedroom, then in the garage is questionable beyond belief. There was not an iota of her DNA traced anywhere, on the walls (and it would have been on the walls if her throat was cut when she was alive as per the prosecution), carpets, bed, bed clothes, or in the garage where the job was completed, not a spec and I'm certain you'd agree that they were not the most hygienic and cleanest of people.
7. For what reason was here blood in the car? She was murdered and butchered in the house and garage and burned in the burn pit. if they did move her blood splattered mangled body would there only be a small smidgen of blood in the car? I wouldn't have thought so.
Digest this and I might read your second paragraph and respond abou Brendan Dassey.
All that said I fully appreciate this is very much one sided documentary but, for the evidence given in court I cannot see that there will be much more the prosecution could throw at this that hasn't already been said.
Glad it's not just me! So glad to read a sensible post. The Brendan Dassey evidence is critical, and despite the uproar about an 'appropriate adult' (an Avery!) not being present, he was indeed clear and detailed. Taking away his recorded interviews, just look at him giving evidence in the court room at his trial and listen to the shite he says. He 'could have got it from a book' he said. Well could have and did do are two distinct things, and he does not read many books Im sure. It was a feeble defence. Listen to the phone calls to/from his mum after he was charged. She was certain Avery had done it, immediately. They were all different when a special camera crew with an agenda are in their house years after the fact. What the programme makers did was focus on people and personalities and characters, and perceived grudges and wrongdoing. It is absolutely not a fair balanced documentary, as some posters have mentioned, there is other evidence not mentioned at all in that series. Guilty as fuck wrong uns, the pair of them. But that isnt as exciting and scandalous as a skewed series
I place emphasis on for this reason. People make an issue of what he said to the investigators, but as any barrister will tell you its what they say in court in front of a jury that matters. That is where people judge and decide. And his evidence there was nonsense and a sure indication of guilt. And in any case, I do not agree that anything he said was in any way coerced. It was not.I honestly don't know why you attach so much relevance to this. Dassey is of below average intelligence and has learning difficulties. He comes across as incredibly easy to manipulate. The way they coerced some of that confession out of him and without a lawyer present was a fucking disgrace. Thank fuck you weren't around to give an opinion when Stefan Kiszko was wrongly convicted of the murder of Lesley Molseed because he too had learning difficulties and he too had a confession coerced out of him.
I just hope you're never in a jury if I'm on a charge.
1. The blood tube was found to have been tampered with and the tests done by the FBI looking for EDTA in the blood were unconventional and unverified and Averys people were not allowed to carry their own tests. The FBI tests only proved that EDTA was not found in the blood, not that it was not there.
2. As far as I recollect Stevens DNA was never found in the vehicle.
3. The DNA on the bullet was said to be Teresa's BUT there was no DNA available for Averys team to test as they failed to keep the sample, as they should have done.
4. The key was found by local police who should not have been there looking as it was thought they had an agenda. However it was found on the FIFTH search of a small bedroom, not. The first second third or fourth. Not only that it was found in plain view and unbidden.
5. The key had Averys DNA (was it placed there) but importantly it didn't have hers... on a car key that she uses.
6. The bloodbath that allegedly happened I. The bedroom, then in the garage is questionable beyond belief. There was not an iota of her DNA traced anywhere, on the walls (and it would have been on the walls if her throat was cut when she was alive as per the prosecution), carpets, bed, bed clothes, or in the garage where the job was completed, not a spec and I'm certain you'd agree that they were not the most hygienic and cleanest of people.
7. For what reason was here blood in the car? She was murdered and butchered in the house and garage and burned in the burn pit. if they did move her blood splattered mangled body would there only be a small smidgen of blood in the car? I wouldn't have thought so.
Digest this and I might read your second paragraph and respond abou Brendan Dassey.
All that said I fully appreciate this is very much one sided documentary but, for the evidence given in court I cannot see that there will be much more the prosecution could throw at this that hasn't already been said.
Furthermore, two national experts - including the chair of the committee that writes the industry standards on drawing blood samples - told OnMilwaukee that such blood vials are supposed to have holes pierced in their rubber stoppers. According to the experts, that’s how the blood gets into the vial.
Not only is it not uncommon, but it’s the way the vials - in this case, according to court records, a purple-stopped Vacutainer - are supposed to work.
I place emphasis on for this reason. People make an issue of what he said to the investigators, but as any barrister will tell you its what they say in court in front of a jury that matters. That is where people judge and decide. And his evidence there was nonsense and a sure indication of guilt. And in any case, I do not agree that anything he said was in any way coerced. It was not.
They only showed part of his interview on MaM. Read his full interview. He's incredibly descriptive, from this they know he is lying to them later on. He is also given the chance to have a lawyer present twice which he refuses twice.I honestly don't know why you attach so much relevance to this. Dassey is of below average intelligence and has learning difficulties. He comes across as incredibly easy to manipulate. The way they coerced some of that confession out of him and without a lawyer present was a fucking disgrace. Thank fuck you weren't around to give an opinion when Stefan Kiszko was wrongly convicted of the murder of Lesley Molseed because he too had learning difficulties and he too had a confession coerced out of him.
The phone conversations that were taped with his mum should be enough to realise he was easily led. He was taken advantage of by a corrupt police force desperate to put Avery away. They literally told him to say she was shot in the head after several attempts at coaxing it out of him.They only showed part of his interview on MaM. Read his full interview. He's incredibly descriptive, from this they know he is lying to them later on. He is also given the chance to have a lawyer present twice which he refuses twice.
Earlier in his interview he tells them about what Avery said to him, in detail. What Teresa was saying, whilst tied to the bed, in detail. They weren't even being to pushy with him. They seemed quite nice compared to most interrogators investigating a murder case.
I'm certain someone with an IQ as low as his couldn't have come up with this much false information, and the fact that it matches up to physical evidence they found speaks volumes.
They only showed part of his interview on MaM. Read his full interview. He's incredibly descriptive, from this they know he is lying to them later on. He is also given the chance to have a lawyer present twice which he refuses twice.
Earlier in his interview he tells them about what Avery said to him, in detail. What Teresa was saying, whilst tied to the bed, in detail. They weren't even being to pushy with him. They seemed quite nice compared to most interrogators investigating a murder case.
I'm certain someone with an IQ as low as his couldn't have come up with this much false information, and the fact that it matches up to physical evidence they found speaks volumes.