Mancini

[blueparrot]

so nasri thinks wenger is his best coach and he doesn't agree that he only trains at 50%.Big deal.Paper sensationalize his words.Big deal.I bet mancini can't sleep at night (something some of you would like to believe)

Nasri probably thinks Wenger is a great coach because Wenger loves his type of player.But maybe that's why Arsenal keep producing teams with no backbone that don't win anything. Everyone has known for years what Arsenal need is a bit of steel in defence and midfield, so players may love him but great coach? not for me.

 

[Rolee]

Thanks for that. Also interesting to hear from someone who has seen the interview first hand.

I personally think the 'Mancini's English is poor' is a convenient excuse to hide behind and it deliberate intent on Mancini's part when he calls players out in public. But thats just my opinion

I have continually said that if a player needs to feel the love and warmth to get him through the season then Mancini and City ain't for them. Mancini isn't their Dad, or loveable uncle or mentor. He simply isn't interested. Mancini is confrontational and forces players to develop their own resources. Some thrive and improve as a consequence. Some don't. It is refreshing to hear Nasri talk about 'weak mentality' and it would be interesting to hear where he thinks he fits on this spectrum.

And no they don't have to be perfectly rounded players. But they must have the character to want to improve themselves and become more rounded in an environment that is unforgiving and largely unsympathetic.

When he spoke about a weak mentality, or fragile mentalement et psychologiquement, he was talking about himself and the group ( that generation as a whole ), and specifically about the rumoured problems he has with Benezema in the national team.

Mancini's style lends itself to a squad full of seasoned pro's. Not a young squad with players who need developing into top performers. It's far too myopic an approach to management, and is at odds with what the club are trying to develop vis a vis the accelerated promotion of talented youngsters into the first team.

I'm sorry Billy, that last paragraph doesn't ring true. Hart and Nastasic are examples of talented youngsters getting their chance to develop under Mancini.

 

[Anonymous]

I'm sorry Billy, that last paragraph doesn't ring true. Hart and Nastasic are examples of talented youngsters getting their chance to develop under Mancini.

Not all players are mentally developed and strong at an early age. Joe clearly was, Nastasic has had an amazing season but it's only his first season in the league and he has not had a dip in form yet. The point is, it's how you deal with players when things aren't going the way you expect which concerns me with Mancini. He has a one size fits all approach, and it is designed to work only with those who are hugely self motivated.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

Just to clarify a few things ... I watched the i/v on Bein Sport last night. He was relaxed and talked well. The comments about Mancini were not particularly malicious, although it obviously stung him that Mancini had said he doesn't put it in in training and in that sense he basically said Mancini wasn't being honest, but also that Mancini's poor English often led to him saying inappropriate things to the press about players.

He's not going to leave City this summer btw. That much was clear from the interview. His comments about Wenger are nothing new, as are his comments about the direction Arsenal were heading in.

I think the really interesting part about the interview hasn't made it over to the British papers, and that's when he talks about le generation 87. Very honest in admitting that as a group they are mentally quite weak. He also speaks about talent alone not being enough at the very highest level and how mental strength is as important as ability.

All very interesting to be honest. Very clear that Nasri's a player who needs coaching both on and off the field. I suppose that it's a choice City will have to make with regards to our playing staff and Mancini. If we are going to persist with him, then we are going to have to sign perfectly rounded players who need nothing from the manager other than instructions on where to play, how to play, and when to play.

Thanks for that. Also interesting to hear from someone who has seen the interview first hand.

I personally think the 'Mancini's English is poor' is a convenient excuse to hide behind and it deliberate intent on Mancini's part when he calls players out in public. But thats just my opinion

I have continually said that if a player needs to feel the love and warmth to get him through the season then Mancini and City ain't for them. Mancini isn't their Dad, or loveable uncle or mentor. He simply isn't interested. Mancini is confrontational and forces players to develop their own resources. Some thrive and improve as a consequence. Some don't. It is refreshing to hear Nasri talk about 'weak mentality' and it would be interesting to hear where he thinks he fits on this spectrum.

And no they don't have to be perfectly rounded players. But they must have the character to want to improve themselves and become more rounded in an environment that is unforgiving and largely unsympathetic.

The problem with that is that in football, like all walks of life, everyone needs managing differently. If you decided that "We only play it the hard way" then you alienate half of your existing squad and half of your potential purchases. You hamstring yourself considerably.

City made a big play about only signing players with a certain mentality, about how they got these 50 page documents done and all that. But a document can only tell you so much. And the truth is that the tough love approach can only work with some of the people some of the time. Everyone, and I mean everyone, needs an arm around the shoulder sometimes. Some more than others, granted, but there has never been a brilliant manager who didn't know how to do this.

And that, along with his tactical limitations, is why Mancini has a limited shelf life. You can buy pros like Aguero and Dzeko who are seen as stable and professional, but they are still going to resent you for making you look silly in public. You can be as authoritatian as you want but you have no credit in the bank with these players as soon as results fall away.

 

[BobKowalski]

Thanks for that. Also interesting to hear from someone who has seen the interview first hand.

I personally think the 'Mancini's English is poor' is a convenient excuse to hide behind and it deliberate intent on Mancini's part when he calls players out in public. But thats just my opinion

I have continually said that if a player needs to feel the love and warmth to get him through the season then Mancini and City ain't for them. Mancini isn't their Dad, or loveable uncle or mentor. He simply isn't interested. Mancini is confrontational and forces players to develop their own resources. Some thrive and improve as a consequence. Some don't. It is refreshing to hear Nasri talk about 'weak mentality' and it would be interesting to hear where he thinks he fits on this spectrum.

And no they don't have to be perfectly rounded players. But they must have the character to want to improve themselves and become more rounded in an environment that is unforgiving and largely unsympathetic.

When he spoke about a weak mentality, or fragile mentalement et psychologiquement, he was talking about himself and the group ( that generation as a whole ), and specifically about the rumoured problems he has with Benezema in the national team.

Mancini's style lends itself to a squad full of seasoned pro's. Not a young squad with players who need developing into top performers. It's far too myopic an approach to management, and is at odds with what the club are trying to develop vis a vis the accelerated promotion of talented youngsters into the first team.

Ah interesting. Thanks.

I disagree that it is at odds. Character is present or can be better influenced at a younger age. Mancini's whole ethos is based on self reliance and developing this quality. Age is not a barrier. Hart has these qualities and was chosen over the more experienced pro. Nasty is chosen over Lescott. Rodwell is someone who is young and Mancini rates. 'Jack' has a 'good face', the pat on the cheek when subbed against Chelsea, the patience when dealing with his injuries. With Micah he took time with him early on and look at the improvement.

Mancini can 'nurture' but there has to be something there that he recognises and respects. If it ain't there no matter what age you are then he isn't interested and if he isn't interested then you might as well be dead.

 

[BobKowalski]

He has a one size fits all approach, and it is designed to work only with those who are hugely self motivated.

Hallelujah and the Saints be praised!

Ok next question.

And what pray is the problem with that?

Or - What is better? A squad full of talented, self motivated, self reliant players or a squad full of talented players who need their arses wiping every 5 minutes?

Now both are at opposite ends of the spectrum but if you were an owner with the cash which players would you invest in?

 

[Anonymous]

Ah interesting. Thanks.

I disagree that it is at odds. Character is present or can be better influenced at a younger age. Mancini's whole ethos is based on self reliance and developing this quality. Age is not a barrier. Hart has these qualities and was chosen over the more experienced pro. Nasty is chosen over Lescott. Rodwell is someone who is young and Mancini rates. 'Jack' has a 'good face', the pat on the cheek when subbed against Chelsea, the patience when dealing with his injuries. With Micah he took time with him early on and look at the improvement.

I don't disagree with that, but talent and character are separate qualities and just because you lack character at an early age, it doesn't mean your talent is in question. Actually Balo's a pretty good example of a player who had the talent but not the mentality. Ultimately even though their relationship was one of the reasons he came to City, in the end he never flourished here. I'm not sure how this is good for the club, even if it works for Mancini. It is an incredibly outdated method of management and one which will only develop those players who would develop regardless of who the manager is in my opinion.

Mancini can 'nurture' but there has to be something there that he recognises and respects. If it ain't there no matter what age you are then he isn't interested and if he isn't interested then you might as well be dead.

I disagree. I don't think Mancini can nurture. What he can do is put you on the field. If you do what he asks of you, take the flack when you don't do it, and not get effected in any way then you're good to go. Otherwise, if you need a little more subtlety, or a little more education (either on the field of off it), then as you say, you're dead to him. He doesn't have time for you.<br /><br />-- Tue Apr 02, 2013 1:00 pm --<br /><br />

And what pray is the problem with that?

Or - What is better? A squad full of talented, self motivated, self reliant players or a squad full of talented players who need their arses wiping every 5 minutes?

Now both are at opposite ends of the spectrum but if you were an owner with the cash which players would you invest in?

You invest in the most talented players full stop. Ronaldo was mentally weak during his early career at the rags. They developed him into the player he has become by teaching him discipline on the field, not by beating him around the head in press conferences, but by nurturing him and shifting players like Keane and RVN out who were offended that he didn't have their character.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

He has a one size fits all approach, and it is designed to work only with those who are hugely self motivated.

Hallelujah and the Saints be praised!

Ok next question.

And what pray is the problem with that?

Or - What is better? A squad full of talented, self motivated, self reliant players or a squad full of talented players who need their arses wiping every 5 minutes?

Now both are at opposite ends of the spectrum but if you were an owner with the cash which players would you invest in?

Utopian nonsense. The kind of thing Garry Cook probably took to Abu Dhabi on a Powerpoint presentation in 2010.

Footballers are human beings. You can pay as much lip service as you want to "only signing players with the right mentality" but it doesn't work like that. For a start, if Mancini wants this kind of "tough mentality" player, then what's he doing piling the pressure on the board to sign Nasri? Mancini did this, and Nasri himself has admitted he isn't that kind of player. So there's a problem there straight away.

Gary Cook's "we only sign winners!" presentation sounds great on the whiteboard of the Abu Dhabi royal palace but falls flat when Mancini's spewing his negativity about Joe Hart or Jolean Lescott on some wet Wednesday when we've flopped in Europe.

 

[BobKowalski]

He has a one size fits all approach, and it is designed to work only with those who are hugely self motivated.

Hallelujah and the Saints be praised!

Ok next question.

And what pray is the problem with that?

Or - What is better? A squad full of talented, self motivated, self reliant players or a squad full of talented players who need their arses wiping every 5 minutes?

Now both are at opposite ends of the spectrum but if you were an owner with the cash which players would you invest in?

Utopian nonsense. The kind of thing Garry Cook probably took to Abu Dhabi on a Powerpoint presentation in 2010.

Footballers are human beings. You can pay as much lip service as you want to "only signing players with the right mentality" but it doesn't work like that. For a start, if Mancini wants this kind of "tough mentality" player, then what's he doing piling the pressure on the board to sign Nasri? Mancini did this, and Nasri himself has admitted he isn't that kind of player. So there's a problem there straight away.

Gary Cook's "we only sign winners!" presentation sounds great on the whiteboard of the Abu Dhabi royal palace but falls flat when Mancini's spewing his negativity about Joe Hart or Jolean Lescott on some wet Wednesday when we've flopped in Europe.

So I ask again. You are the owner you have the cash. Which set of players would you aim to sign for your club?

And yes you can call me Gary

 

[Danamy]

He has a one size fits all approach, and it is designed to work only with those who are hugely self motivated.

Hallelujah and the Saints be praised!

Ok next question.

And what pray is the problem with that?

Or - What is better? A squad full of talented, self motivated, self reliant players or a squad full of talented players who need their arses wiping every 5 minutes?

Now both are at opposite ends of the spectrum but if you were an owner with the cash which players would you invest in?

To be fair Bob, Mancini wanted and purchased Nasri, they make and produce dossiers on every player they purchase so they know how they play, what makes them tick etc.........."He's exactly what it said on the tin"