Maybe i was wrong about Elano

[Anonymous]

.

Moomba does have a tendency of contradicting himself from time to time but to call it dishonesty well I call it a memory fade combined with a quick need to attempt to correct someone and sometimes you end up correcting yourself.

We all contradict ourselves sometimes - even Billy who I seem to recall posting early on in the season that Hughes needed to finish top 4 this season or he would be gone in the summer :)

Indeed we do...which is why I posted...

Ahh well. The point is, most people on here are disingenuous, or dishonest at some point. You shouldn't be so offended if people accuse you of it...people in glass houses and all that.

And actually, I think I said he needed to finish in the top 6...happy to stand corrected though...;- )

 

[BobKowalski]

More leaks designed to turn the supporters against particular players.

This is fact is it? And you can prove it how?

Because they keep doing it and it works. People in high profile positions will often use the media to push an agenda or get their points out in the public domain. Politicians do it, celebs, sportsmen, football clubs - you name it and they'll leak it!

 

[moomba]

Like i said, i'll look for some earlier articles. So contain your glee for a bit longer.

 

[BobKowalski]

And actually, I think I said he needed to finish in the top 6...happy to stand corrected though...;- )

Nah I'll concede top 6. I remember it was top something but cannot say with certainty whether it was 4 or 6

 

[Anonymous]

This is fact is it? And you can prove it how?

Because they keep doing it and it works. People in high profile positions will often use the media to push an agenda or get their points out in the public domain. Politicians do it, celebs, sportsmen, football clubs - you name it and they'll leak it!

If you "leak" a fact it's not such a bad thing in my opinion...

And Bob, an honest and serious question...

If a current player in our squad, one who was in theory being heralded as our player of the season, said words to the effect of "Sven was a good manager and we all liked him, but Hughes is definitely the man to take us forward." Not in a press statement, but privately - would you reconsider your views on Hughes, bearing in mind that said player got to play under both managers, and saw first hand their training methods, tactical nous etc...

 

[Anonymous]

I'm worried at those who are lapping up all these leaked stories that make Hughes look good.

If you are happy that we are replacing Elano with Scott Parker then we will never get anywhere. You don't win trophies with 11 players who will run through brick walls for you, you need quality like Elano but you also know how to handle players like Elano. Ferguson does it with Ronaldo who's worse, Chelsea do it with Drogba.

 

[mancity1]

I'm worried at those who are lapping up all these leaked stories that make Hughes look good.

If you are happy that we are replacing Elano with Scott Parker then we will never get anywhere. You don't win trophies with 11 players who will run through brick walls for you, you need quality like Elano but you also know how to handle players like Elano. Ferguson does it with Ronaldo who's worse, Chelsea do it with Drogba.

Who honestly believes its making Hughes look good , if anything it will make the decision to sack him even easier , especially if we lose on Saturday.

 

[Anonymous]

I'm worried at those who are lapping up all these leaked stories that make Hughes look good.

If you are happy that we are replacing Elano with Scott Parker then we will never get anywhere. You don't win trophies with 11 players who will run through brick walls for you, you need quality like Elano but you also know how to handle players like Elano. Ferguson does it with Ronaldo who's worse, Chelsea do it with Drogba.

Who honestly believes its making Hughes look good , if anything it will make the decision to sack him even easier , especially if we lose on Saturday.

Hey MC1...read my question for BobKowalski a few posts up...what are your thoughts on it?

 

[jay_mcfc]

More leaks designed to turn the supporters against particular players.

If he thinks the club is better off without certain people Hughes should sell them and move on, there is absolutely nothing to be gained by the character assasination that Hughes seems to indulge in. Disgraceful leadership.

And does anyone think that Elano, Jo and TBH are so influential in the dressing room if they can affect the result against West Brom, a game none of them played in.

I don't even need to read the rest of the thread, after a few posts moomba has it absolutely bang on. It's becoming farcical now.

 

[Anonymous]

I'm worried at those who are lapping up all these leaked stories that make Hughes look good.

If you are happy that we are replacing Elano with Scott Parker then we will never get anywhere. You don't win trophies with 11 players who will run through brick walls for you, you need quality like Elano but you also know how to handle players like Elano. Ferguson does it with Ronaldo who's worse, Chelsea do it with Drogba.

Who honestly believes its making Hughes look good , if anything it will make the decision to sack him even easier , especially if we lose on Saturday.

It's making Hughes look good by saying it's not his managerial skills that has got us in this mess at the moment it is a few bad apples causing trouble for him.

 

[Anonymous]

More leaks designed to turn the supporters against particular players.

If he thinks the club is better off without certain people Hughes should sell them and move on, there is absolutely nothing to be gained by the character assasination that Hughes seems to indulge in. Disgraceful leadership.

And does anyone think that Elano, Jo and TBH are so influential in the dressing room if they can affect the result against West Brom, a game none of them played in.

I don't even need to read the rest of the thread, after a few posts moomba has it absolutely bang on. It's becoming farcical now.

Course not Jay...why bother reading opinions which aren't exactly in line with yours...that would be boring wouldn't it...

And I address the same question to you which I have done to Bob and MC1...if you can bring yourself to read something I posted...it's on just a few posts up...

 

[mancity1]

Who honestly believes its making Hughes look good , if anything it will make the decision to sack him even easier , especially if we lose on Saturday.

It's making Hughes look good by saying it's not his managerial skills that has got us in this mess at the moment it is a few bad apples causing trouble for him.

Look good ???? , its like a golfer blaming his clubs for why he kerps missing the cut.

These are not excuses IP , its speak from a man who knows he is under the gun to get points on the board , rather than making him look good it says to all and sundry he cannot handle tension and conflict at best or at worst has no idea how to work with players to get the best out of them so has to buy new ones in the hope things will get better with them either way its poor form.

 

[jay_mcfc]

LOL...this thread's pretty funny, I have to say...

So, Elano's a gonner. Is a "shit house" which I think is an apt description with delusions of grandeur. Probably close to the root of most of the problems in the dressing room...a few of us have been saying for a while he's vastly overrated and this will be proven when nobody other than a midtable Italian or Spanish team will want him...

...i'm still waiting for the massive offers from Liverpool or Inter for our diminutive playmaker...;- )

As for the press being briefed...City are hardly the first club to brief the press against their own players. And all those who have taken such umbrage against it should really just get over it and move on. There's no point in giving yourselves heart problems prematurely because you're so irate that MH dared to out the lazy fuckers in our dressing room.

I'm actually glad he did it...players will now think twice before fucking with him...

Ooh, one more thing...I think went through this in another thread...why should Hughes be respected? Because he's the fucking boss. He earned the right to manage those players by being appointed manager of City...and funnily enough, our consistently best performers this season, the ones we've been raving about, seem to have no problem with his management style...it's fringe players who don't like him...

Looked through the thread, just for you Billy, and this is the best you can do? Yet more vaseline dropping on Hughes arsehole. Funny how Elano wasn't a bad influence last year isn't it? He's probably close to the root of our dressing room problems you say? That's a bold statement, I'll make a bold statement too....Mark Hughes is probably just as close. The way English football fans cream themselves over a hard working manager with regimented training techniques is fucking embarrassing. Let's play 4-4-2, direct football and make sure the full backs don't cross the half way line too.

What makes me laugh though Billy, is you telling me to go read other people's opinions in this thread. Why the fuck should I? It's the same old drivel post after post after post, I've read it all a million times. In the last few weeks I've not even said Elano is in the wrong/right because as the rumours have progressed it's pretty clear there are problems. My point in this thread is exactly the same as moomba's, the club is leaving their players out to dry, all the leaks and snippets of information has meant the majority of fans have started turning on 2 or 3 players and that is disgusting. Sell them yes but keep it in house instead of dealing with things in the public.

 

[bizzbo]

elano a: has documented form for this kind of thing

and

b: anyone who has seen him lose the plot when he gets kicked on the pitch, must recognise that this is someone who reacts very badly when he doesnt like what is happening. sven realised that he has to be protected from his self-destructive tendancies. he has phony pride coming out of his ears, thinks he's really someone special, but really he has never even tried to overcome any of the hurdles that have been placed in front of him. that seems to make him somewhat unstable, because he'll do anything to keep that oh-so-brittle pride from being damaged.

I wonder if robinho doesnt feel somewhat that his so-called 'best-friend' might be trying to exploit his esteemed (and well-earnt) position in the eyes of the fans and management.

 

[jay_mcfc]

elano a: has documented form for this kind of thing

and

b: anyone who has seen him lose the plot when he gets kicked on the pitch, must recognise that this is someone who reacts very badly when he doesnt like what is happening. sven realised that he has to be protected from his self-destructive tendancies. he has phony pride coming out of his ears, thinks he's really someone special, but really he has never even tried to overcome any of the hurdles that have been placed in front of him. that seems to make him somewhat unstable, because he'll do anything to keep that oh-so-brittle pride from being damaged.

I wonder if robinho doesnt feel somewhat that his so-called 'best-friend' might be trying to exploit his esteemed (and well-earnt) position in the eyes of the fans and management.

Fucking hell are you Elano's brother? You know him very well!

 

[Anonymous]

Looked through the thread, just for you Billy, and this is the best you can do? Yet more vaseline dropping on Hughes arsehole. Funny how Elano wasn't a bad influence last year isn't it? He's probably close to the root of our dressing room problems you say? That's a bold statement, I'll make a bold statement too....Mark Hughes is probably just as close. The way English football fans cream themselves over a hard working manager with regimented training techniques is fucking embarrassing. Let's play 4-4-2, direct football and make sure the full backs don't cross the half way line too.

Jay, what's your point mate? Elano's on his way out, and Hughes is still manager...

The rant about the hard working manager with regimented training techniques. Well, I would hope all managers are hard working and have regimented training techniques. They are professionals paid to do a job. I would hate to think they turn up each day and just decide how to train off the cuff.

Not entirely sure what you're ranting about there...but oh well...I'm sure you and Moomba get it.

What makes me laugh though Billy, is you telling me to go read other people's opinions in this thread. Why the fuck should I? It's the same old drivel post after post after post, I've read it all a million times. In the last few weeks I've not even said Elano is in the wrong/right because as the rumours have progressed it's pretty clear there are problems. My point in this thread is exactly the same as moomba's, the club is leaving their players out to dry, all the leaks and snippets of information has meant the majority of fans have started turning on 2 or 3 players and that is disgusting. Sell them yes but keep it in house instead of dealing with things in the public.

I've highlighted the passage above so everyone passing through this thread can have a good giggle. Why don't you ask Ric if you and Moomba can have your own forum where you can stand face to face and circle jerk over pictures of Elano and Sven...whilst throwing darts at pictures of Hughes in a United shirt...

You really are a silly boy sometimes...;- )

BTW, you didn't answer the question I asked of Bob, you, and MC1...would be fascinated with what your thoughts are...

 

[mancity1]

Who honestly believes its making Hughes look good , if anything it will make the decision to sack him even easier , especially if we lose on Saturday.

Hey MC1...read my question for BobKowalski a few posts up...what are your thoughts on it?

I'm ambivalant towards it BS.

A manager will usually have the support of some players and not others for a variety of reasons , some strong in both categories, others to a lesser degree.

Some players don't care who is in charge as long as they get what they want from the club.

Look at the lifespan of the vast majority of managers at clubs in the premiership , at least 7 will go on average each season , currently we have 5 who have served more than 3 seasons.

A good manager will get the best out of the squad , and help create an winning environment and culture where players know that if they play to their best they will win the vast majority of games and enjoy winning for winning sake and the joy it gives to supporters and what it does for their self esteem and confidence.

A question for you BS , how do you thing MH is doing on that score to date?

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

So was Sven a bad manager? Or was it that the players he had to work with weren't really good enough?

Sven did well getting his side to a 9th placed finish.

A very disingenuous, politicians reply and you don't seek to debate the very detailed points I made. We were top 4 at Xmas weren't we? Getting us to 9th from there wasn't what I'd call "doing well". Let me give you some more figures about the first half of last season.

Our success was based on our home record, 10 games, 9 wins and a draw against Blackburn in the last game of that half season. Away it wasn't so good with 1 win (at West Ham in the first game), 4 draws and 4 defeats. That 7 points whereas Hughes has got 6 away from home in the same period. So not much difference there.

Of the home games, substituting the newly promoted clubs for the relegated ones, we've only played 3 of the sides we played in Sven's run. We beat Derby/Stoke, We beat Brum/Hull and we lost to the rags when we beat them last season. We were a bit lucky to get those three points last season as they were the better team but that's how it goes sometimes. The other equivalent seven games have yet to be played. So why don't we see what happens after those?

 

[Anonymous]

A question for you BS , how do you thing MH is doing on that score to date?

I think Hughes so far he has done poorly, with mitigating circumstances.

I can't judge him yet. It would be disingenuous and unfair. I'll wait until he's rid the dressing room of the players who don't want to be there, or know they're not going to be there and have stopped trying.

And like all managers who start at a new club, I'll give him AT LEAST a season to see if there are signs of progress.

It may well turn out to be that Hughes isn't the man for us. Right now we don't now.

I'm surprised that you are ambivalent to the opinion of a player who trained under both managers, was rated by both, and got plenty of game time under both. I would suggest his opinion carries far more weight than any of ours do...

 

[bizzbo]

elano a: has documented form for this kind of thing

and

b: anyone who has seen him lose the plot when he gets kicked on the pitch, must recognise that this is someone who reacts very badly when he doesnt like what is happening. sven realised that he has to be protected from his self-destructive tendancies. he has phony pride coming out of his ears, thinks he's really someone special, but really he has never even tried to overcome any of the hurdles that have been placed in front of him. that seems to make him somewhat unstable, because he'll do anything to keep that oh-so-brittle pride from being damaged.

I wonder if robinho doesnt feel somewhat that his so-called 'best-friend' might be trying to exploit his esteemed (and well-earnt) position in the eyes of the fans and management.

Fucking hell are you Elano's brother? You know him very well!

i call it like i see it. little things on the pitch, off the pitch, in interviews. everything fits one pattern, one internal logic. call it paranoia if u like, i call it people-watching.