Media Discussion - 2023/24

[BlueKolarovWorker]

Crace’s observation is more considered, nuanced, founded in truth and worthy of reasoned debate - although it fails to appreciate that City supporters in their mid twenties will have spanned the whole of those 15 years as the entirety of their active support of the club; so their football supporting personalities have been forged in wholly different circumstances from those that preceded them. The changing of personnel is something that is frequently overlooked when asserting that a club’s support has ‘changed’, as ours unquestionably has. That said, I think much of our older supporter ‘deserves’ this as much as any other supporters and his failure to distinguish in that way still suggests a somewhat simplistic approach to his argument.

Liew, on the other hand, made a bald assertion that our supporters possess a characteristic more extensively than any other, which is objectively wrong. Liverpool supporters are far better exemplars. He also did so without providing any supporting evidence or ancillary argument to back up his claim. So, it isn’t quite as clever as you suggest as he has expressly and definitively nailed his colours to a mast that is much easier to argue against than what Crace has said.

As both will doubtless appreciate, words are powerful weapons but they can also make you a hostage to fortune, especially in the age we live. Liew has always struck me as far smarter than the most of his Whatsapp cohort, but I wouldn’t say what he has written there in that paragraph is at all clever; and the fact he appears to have unilaterally cut off the oxygen of at least some of his self-publicity in the last 24 hours suggests that in some way he may recognise that. Seems too much of a coincidence to me.

Making such a definitive assertion, without anything to back it up is not clever. Making yourself a hostage to fortune is not clever. And inviting ridicule upon yourself for being a spineless **** isn’t clever either.

Clever people don’t always do clever things.

All good points mate.

There is definitely a difference in the mindset of younger fans, my own daughter and nephews being an example. They could be construed as arrogant, as they genuinely expect to win every game and why wouldn't they, as the basis for their thinking has been built consistently over the last 10-12 years!

The older fans still carry the scars of the 80's, 90's and early 2000s but even with us, these scars heal as time passes and our own expectation grows!

The younger fans of course are more likely to espouse their opinions on social media and therefore, maybe this view of our fan base grows! However, both of the "journalists" that you mention are bright enough to recognise this distinction between sections of our support but choose, to different degrees, to ignore it, in terms of cheap point scoring and this unfortunately has been the trend for a number of years.

Anyway, of more importance, glad you eventually called Liew a **** in your final paragraph. I thought you were going soft for a minute.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

Crace’s observation is more considered, nuanced, founded in truth and worthy of reasoned debate - although it fails to appreciate that City supporters in their mid twenties will have spanned the whole of those 15 years as the entirety of their active support of the club; so their football supporting personalities have been forged in wholly different circumstances from those that preceded them. The changing of personnel is something that is frequently overlooked when asserting that a club’s support has ‘changed’, as ours unquestionably has. That said, I think much of our older supporter ‘deserves’ this as much as any other supporters and his failure to distinguish in that way still suggests a somewhat simplistic approach to his argument.

Liew, on the other hand, made a bald assertion that our supporters possess a characteristic more extensively than any other, which is objectively wrong. Liverpool supporters are far better exemplars. He also did so without providing any supporting evidence or ancillary argument to back up his claim. So, it isn’t quite as clever as you suggest as he has expressly and definitively nailed his colours to a mast that is much easier to argue against than what Crace has said.

As both will doubtless appreciate, words are powerful weapons but they can also make you a hostage to fortune, especially in the age we live. Liew has always struck me as far smarter than the most of his Whatsapp cohort, but I wouldn’t say what he has written there in that paragraph is at all clever; and the fact he appears to have unilaterally cut off the oxygen of at least some of his self-publicity in the last 24 hours suggests that in some way he may recognise that. Seems too much of a coincidence to me.

Making such a definitive assertion, without anything to back it up is not clever. Making yourself a hostage to fortune is not clever. And inviting ridicule upon yourself for being a spineless **** isn’t clever either.

Clever people don’t always do clever things.

He makes his living sneering at people. If he was a proper journalist he would be taking risks, revealing stories from places like Ukraine and Gaza. He doesn’t even like football. Just another posh boy working his meal ticket in the London chattering class. There’s lots of them these days. Just pure poison.

 

[hammocity]

You’ve hit the nail on the head. Jamie Jackson of Red Issue is just one example, mention it on any of his Gruniad articles leads to an instant ban, a very uncomfortable truth for him.

The Jonathan Liew article yesterday was frankly embarrassing, not even fanzine standard.i can only assume these so called sports journalists have other income streams, maybe Deliveroo riders and the like, they‘ll be getting paid peanuts. The Gruniad are skint and is basically a few decent journalists like John Crace and Marina Hyde, the rest is just filler.

Marina Hyde wrote a shocking article about us a few years ago, won’t ever read her crap.

 

[BringBackSwales]

Just watching the recording on BT. The applause for Viv Busby was joined in by all the Blues - not a comment or a shot of this on BT. Had it been liverpool or rags they’d have been lauded for it

 

[hammocity]

Even your love Marina put the boot in the other month.

Not for the first time.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

He makes his living sneering at people. If he was a proper journalist he would be taking risks, revealing stories from places like Ukraine and Gaza. He doesn’t even like football. Just another posh boy working his meal ticket in the London chattering class. There’s lots of them these days. Just pure poison.

His estuary accent doesn’t sound that posh to me!

 

[dickie davies]

How the fuck she gets away with the absolute utter drivel she writes in The Times is beyond me. It really is fanzine level stuff.

Diversity

Ugly witches are a minority group

 

[Asa's left peg]

Marina Hyde wrote a shocking article about us a few years ago, won’t ever read her crap.

Yeah, I like her political stuff but a few of this type of journalist occasionally step out of their lane after discussing a subject with certain journalist and no independent research.

I really liked Katya Adler's political stuff, to the point I was considering leaving Mrs Pegg for her. Then she made a piece on us, which was city bingo (on BBC world news!). She had done no research herself. I thought there may be some inside knowledge of the UAE in it or some thing similar. The reveal was Simon Stone's mitts all over it and a interview. Disappointing and it makes me question their ability or principles to do their day job.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

His estuary accent doesn’t sound that posh to me!

He’s a fake like most of his media pals. The so-called Spurs fan who also supports Arsenal.

 

[Newman Noggs]

I'm always intrigued by journalistic claims about the nature of our, or any other, fan base. What are their research parameters, their methodology, their sample size, in fact, any empirical evidence at all that lends credibility to their assertions.

If a journalist wants to make claims like these, fine, but at least state that they are based solely on their opinion as supporters/propagandists of other clubs rather than presenting them as established facts.