The level of depravity described and the effort to excuse it defies the senses…
They knew exactly how the Israel's would react under Netanyahu, and the idiots did just that.Penny for the thoughts of the cunts who organised and authorised 7th October. It can’t be discounted that this is precisely what they wanted. Long term, Israel has royally fucked it for themselves.
Your and my view of long term are very different to the two combatants. They're thinking of what the map looks like in 200 years or more.Penny for the thoughts of the cunts who organised and authorised 7th October. It can’t be discounted that this is precisely what they wanted. Long term, Israel has royally fucked it for themselves.
I’m struggling to disagree with any of that.Your and my view of long term are very different to the two combatants. They're thinking of what the map looks like in 200 years or more.
The Palestinian bit has been shrinking for years and they needed to do something to raise the stakes however awful. Israel has made a Palestinian state more rather than less likely.
I think we can agree that Biden nor Trump are suitable.I disagree with most of what you have written.
First, you should not base any analysis on what Trump says, especially not when he is trying to get reelected, by hook or by crook (with the intent of destroying what is left of American republic to ensure his own safety and power).
You should base analysis on what Trump has actually done, which is cozy up with and empower the far right in the US, Israel, and elsewhere. He is extremely unlikely to break from that behaviour given the far right are the only force propping him up at the moment (and will be the way in which he wields power if he regains the presidency). He has continually, especially privately, supported Netanyahu as a “strong man” leader, primarily as a means of playing Israel and Saudi (and a few other countries in the region) off each other. He has no love for either Jews or Muslims, and especially not Palestinians, which he has derided several times.
He also believes in ‘might is right’ action, largely because that is what keeps him relevant and protected, and cares not about the plight of any marginalised or oppressed population. In fact, he has shown over and over again that he despises marginalised people. Nor does he care about genocide or apartheid; he would carry it out himself in a heartbeat if there was something to be gained for him personally and no consequences imposed on him for doing so.
He cares only about “loyalty” and who gives him the most deference and access to wealth. Both things Netanyahu will shower him with in an attempt to cling on to power (if he makes it that far).
Trump is not going to end the war, at least not in any way that is not horrific for the Palestinians (and likely other parties. He is also not going to support a two-state solution (which will never happen under the current Israeli government).
Second, I am not sure where your belief that Biden has brought us to the brink of world war has come from. Putin (and in many ways Trump) has been working to do that for several decades. Biden has been in power for less than 4 years and inherited Trump’s appeasement of Putin’s violent, expansionist actions, constantly contravening international law. All Biden has done whilst in office is help Ukraine and other now nervous sovereign nations to resist Putin’s murderous, megalomaniacal operations. To say Biden is responsible for Putin continually invading sovereign nations and carrying out terrorist operations in the US, UK, Germany, France, and many other countries is simply nonsensical.
Finally, to say that Trump could not be worse than the current political class ignores essentially all evidence from his term as president and after. He literally wants to be eviscerate the American democratic republic and install himself as a de facto dictator. You can say what you want about Biden, or Sunak, or Macron—and I have said quite a lot—but there is at least a means for removing them or influencing their behaviour, however difficult or ineffective at times. Trump wants to do away with any mechanism allowing for control, oversight, or influence over his power.
I genuinely do not understand how someone could think Trump would not be worse than the crop of leaders we have now, when his intention is to remove the system that allows for them to be changed.
It is strange that you infer that people in opposition of Trump (or Putin or Netanyahu, it seems) are operating on emotion, when a cold analysis of Trump’s actual deeds, revealed beliefs, and policy outcomes shows he is danger to societies everywhere, much less America, Israel, or Palestine.
But I think we have entered a discussion more relevant to the Trump thread than this one at this point.
That penny should also go to the far-right within Isreal, many of whom have been desperate for an event like 7th October to occur so as to enable the actioning of their vision for “solving” the Palestinian problem.Penny for the thoughts of the cunts who organised and authorised 7th October. It can’t be discounted that this is precisely what they wanted. Long term, Israel has royally fucked it for themselves.
I don’t think you and I will agree on much based on the exchange thus far; we seemingly have very different approaches to assessing current events, and lens through which we see said events. And I don’t want to divert the thread to discussions of Trump, Biden, Putin, and other wars ongoing, given there are other threads for that.I think we can agree that Biden nor Trump are suitable.
It depends really upon your point of view of whether you want these conflicts to end or not. I just feel that it is more likely that the conflicts will end with Trump because unlike Biden that's what he's saying he'll do. Whether that ends in favour of the Palestinians is a very different matter but no US president is going to put Palestine above Israel. It is therefore pointless to somehow expect any US president to take charge and resolve what is happening.
I don't think that people quite understand or realise just how perilous the global security situation is and why Gaza/Palestine is just another proxy war in this huge escalation of east vs west. At this stage it doesn't require much to trigger the most devastating war in history. Ships and military sites are now under open attack in the Middle East, NATO is threatened with nuclear attack and is threatening Russia in return. This level of serious escalation and open attack has never happened before and what is Biden doing about it?
What's happening over there is essentially an extension of proxy wars with the axis of Iran, Syria and Russia. You only have to ask where does Palestine fit into this? It doesn't, the Palestinians are just a pawn in a much bigger game but they're part of that game. None of the countries that support the likes of Hamas want peace, Iran has a state aim to completely destroy Israel, they do not care about the Palestinians.
I still maintain that the only future for the Palestinians is one where they must be seperated from Hamas and the game that is being played around them. That can only happen if Hamas surrenders and the Palestinian authorities are able to take charge of their future. Anything else means war and suffering. The Palestinian supporters who also support Hamas are sending the Palestinians to their deaths because they're supporting the fight against an advanced military state where the end result is inevitable.