mancity2012_eamo
Well-Known Member
Needs someone in the middle to do a countdown.
3-2-1 Go.
Middle East Conflict
- Thread starter The blue phantom
- Start date
3-2-1 Go.
If those two sites are all you've read about the peace process I'm not surprised that's your opinion.Well the Israelis will point to this (one of many):
A Short History of Palestinian Rejectionism
The consistent and enduring Palestinian rejection of any and all peace initiatives with Israel, most recently the “Deal of the Century,” calls into question the commitment of the Palestinian leadebesacenter.org
And the Palestinians will point to this (one of many):
Palestinian views on the peace process - Wikipedia
en.m.wikipedia.org
I'm off the opinion that the Palestinians are the ones mainly to blame as the MAJORITY won't be happy unless there is a single state solution. A large minority actually don’t even accept the OSLO accords and a small minority want Israel to cease to exist (e.g Hamas). A minority of Israeli's will always try and block but when pushed by the US they move - but that requires movement from the Palestines to succeed. It never happens.
There's plenty of material about the sticking points on the various proposed peace deals.
I'm not even sure it's worth apportioning "blame", rather than seeking to understand what the sticking points were - and what in the future might be done to unstick those points.
Scottyboi
Well-Known Member
People having to undergo amputations without anesthesia, disgraceful.
Bluemoon_420
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- Man City
Arab/Palestinian experience in Israel right now:
Today in Israel, I’m not allowed to voice an opinion. Palestinian citizens of Israel have been forcefully silenced and threatened for any social media activity that isn’t in line with Israeli Hasbara. There’s a serious witch hunt going on. Full blown McCarthyism.
Hundreds have been detained, fired from their jobs. Hundreds have been threatened by Jewish citizens with physical harm. Authorities and law makers threatening to revoke our citizenship.
I’ll remain quiet for now in regards to the main issues rather than taking the risk of being ratted out like four of my friends who have been arrested for:
1) Following an Instagram page called eye on Palestine.
2) Sharing a post by an Israeli Jew on Facebook that accused Israel of genocide (the Israeli Jew has not been arrested, the Arab who shared the Jew’s post did get arrested).
3) Posting an instagram story sympathizing with the children of Gaza and calling for a ceasefire.
4) Being ratted out by her Jewish “friend” who shared screenshots of a private conversation they had on facebook, where she said there’s no evidence of beheadings. She’s been detained for three days, bullied by tens of thousands online, with the screenshots broadcasted on television.
An Arab medical doctor got fired because of an old profile pictures on Facebook that contain Quran texts. A political analyst got arrested for posting an objective analysis of the breach on the 7th.
Meanwhile Jewish citizen have been calling for a final solution, mocking Palestinian suffering, and dehumanizing them. Telegram groups with thousands of members rife with organizing pogroms and lynches without any consequences. Hell, they’re even posting videos of urinating on Palestinian dead bodies, stabbing them and poking their eyes out. Zero consequences.
My supposedly leftist Jewish colleagues have turned into vengeful right wing snitches.
I have been threatened by my Jewish neighbor (that I’ve had good neighborly relationship with) telling me he’s sick of hearing me speaking Arabic in the building, when I stood my ground, with his veins popping out of his neck he threatened “I’ll do another Nakba to you”.
Most importantly, we've been warned not to protest by the police commissioner as the police won’t hesitate to use live ammunition. So we just have to live with the grief, the shame, the anger and the sense of defeatedness while all of this is happening.
Today in Israel, I’m not allowed to voice an opinion. Palestinian citizens of Israel have been forcefully silenced and threatened for any social media activity that isn’t in line with Israeli Hasbara. There’s a serious witch hunt going on. Full blown McCarthyism.
Hundreds have been detained, fired from their jobs. Hundreds have been threatened by Jewish citizens with physical harm. Authorities and law makers threatening to revoke our citizenship.
I’ll remain quiet for now in regards to the main issues rather than taking the risk of being ratted out like four of my friends who have been arrested for:
1) Following an Instagram page called eye on Palestine.
2) Sharing a post by an Israeli Jew on Facebook that accused Israel of genocide (the Israeli Jew has not been arrested, the Arab who shared the Jew’s post did get arrested).
3) Posting an instagram story sympathizing with the children of Gaza and calling for a ceasefire.
4) Being ratted out by her Jewish “friend” who shared screenshots of a private conversation they had on facebook, where she said there’s no evidence of beheadings. She’s been detained for three days, bullied by tens of thousands online, with the screenshots broadcasted on television.
An Arab medical doctor got fired because of an old profile pictures on Facebook that contain Quran texts. A political analyst got arrested for posting an objective analysis of the breach on the 7th.
Meanwhile Jewish citizen have been calling for a final solution, mocking Palestinian suffering, and dehumanizing them. Telegram groups with thousands of members rife with organizing pogroms and lynches without any consequences. Hell, they’re even posting videos of urinating on Palestinian dead bodies, stabbing them and poking their eyes out. Zero consequences.
My supposedly leftist Jewish colleagues have turned into vengeful right wing snitches.
I have been threatened by my Jewish neighbor (that I’ve had good neighborly relationship with) telling me he’s sick of hearing me speaking Arabic in the building, when I stood my ground, with his veins popping out of his neck he threatened “I’ll do another Nakba to you”.
Most importantly, we've been warned not to protest by the police commissioner as the police won’t hesitate to use live ammunition. So we just have to live with the grief, the shame, the anger and the sense of defeatedness while all of this is happening.
mancity2012_eamo
Well-Known Member
Same here.
I would say, at the risk of offending people in here that I take postings in here that state as fact what clearly is opinion, with the same degree of scepticism.
There’s been a few in here that have genuinely surprised me, but as I keep saying, in general I think the discussion has been cordial and largely fair.
I am currently struggling to find reliable news outlet that would be respected by all in here.
I have looked at an interview with an ex UN weapons inspectors that takes a dim view of Israel’s intentions towards a two state solution, going back a long way. I’ll check him out further however before putting it up here.
I am halfway through a very long interview with Amira Hass who does seem to be one of the most respected objective journalists and an expert on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
Her views are very interesting. She’s on YouTube but I’ll wait until I finish it before deciding to post or not.
It is very long and detailed.
Last edited:
Alan Harper's Tash
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Given that this is your stance, how can you be so firmly one one side?
I don’t post much in here as my knowledge of the nuance isn’t great.
It just seems that both sides want to kill as many as possible and that can’t be right.
After 846 pages - wow - I feel like I'm gatecrashing this thread chipping in at this stage, but the post above is an absolutely key point, apologies if the points I make have been made before.
This conflict is being packaged to us as a conflict between a Western democracy and Islamist nutters. But the truth is the forces leading Netanyahu are largely far right or fundamentalist, they are not interested in liberalism, gay rights, or any of the other things which are used to make the case that Israel is the only democracy in the ME.
The endgame for some close to Bibi is a theocracy in which the Third Temple is restored. The American evangelical right supports them in this because of the belief that when the Third Temple is restored, the end of the world is close at hand.
If Bibi and his fellow travellers clung to power, once they had pushed the people of Gaza into Egypt, they would move on to another power grab which will weaken the dream of a liberal Israel, which many Jewish people in Israel and the diaspora will not like - just as Bibi was attempting when things deteriorated so badly.
The attack of October 7 was horrific and Hamas are a murderous racket, but there's so much opportunism in politics. Bibi and his mates aren't just motivated by security or even revenge. You've got a load of oil and gas waiting to be exploited in Gaza, the dream of a Greater Israel free of Palestinians, End Times philosophies and an authoritarian government agenda all in the mix here.
Our government - in wanting to demonise protest and protect the trade deal with Israel - is making it worse with their Disney interpretation of a complex situation. My heart goes out to both sides, because the leadership is poor all around.
mancity2012_eamo
Well-Known Member
Chip in anytime if that’s your normal standard.
One word of advice though. Some people get more angry about you calling him Bibi than any other content you may contend.
meeesh
Well-Known Member
Reading the comments and posts on this thread........no wonder it's been brought to the streets of the UK, wow, just wow, opinions that are not needed in this country, it's as simple as that isn't it?