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And your current leader Sturgeon, who said it multiple times.
A FTA with the EU, with a transition period, isn’t going to be the disaster that a no deal would be. £79bn worse off over 15 years is the prediction by the IFS. Corbyn and Sturgeon want to spend 3 times that in the next 10 years. Both are committing to that level of spending should Labour get into power and that’s the SNP’s price for getting them there.
The independence movement will crumble when the issues around a border, currency, North Sea Oil, the fact you’re not meeting and will likely be further away in the event of independence the EU standards to join. The latest noise is that they’re looking to make it harder and harder to join the EU. Expansionism is holting and you aren’t now, as a single country, at the levels of deficit required.
I hate to break it to you but the EU aren’t going to want an independent Scotland.
The likelihood is that the Tories will get a majority and in 5 years time Brexit will be a thing of the past, when life has gone on and the realities are in black and white, no sane Scottish person will vote for independence.
You add to that it’s still close to 50/50 even now, in a political crisis when Sturgeon is getting away with bare-faced lying and you realise you’ve got very little chance, if any.
If/when there is no desire (i've been hinting that i don't think there is), it won't be because of any 'economic realities', brexit-related or otherwise. It will be because ultimately people want to be part of the UK. Like last time.
And if/when there is, the so claimed economic realities won't matter one bit. Brexit or not.
Look, i've lived it, still do, spoken about it plenty, with plenty, still do (less than during indyref1). For all the no campaign's threats and doomsmongering, people at the end of the day voted for what they beleived in, rather than what they thought how numbers would be affected. From my experience, Very few voted on economic reasons. Call it ideological if you want (will).
As for how successful it might or might not be? Who am i to try predict that. I don't think the UK now post (mid) brexit is particularly successful, either economically (stalled, which in turn affects services) or certainly not sociologically, with the state of the mood and fabric of society.
hilts
Well-Known Member
This is not something I have ever encountered.
The ignorance on this thread is staggering.
It’s easy for you to just put the SNP and the Indy movement down as being an anti english movement.
There are other folk that live in Scotland on this thread, and maybe they’ve encountered what you quote, but I have not.
An anti Westminster belief? Absolutely. You better believe it.
If you think that people talk about getting away from the English or England then you are sadly mistaken.
There is a huge belief within the indy movement of Westminster deciding what is best for scotland, and that is coming through on this thread.
‘Let the rest of the UK decide, and we’ll give them what they want’
It’s lazy and easy to say that the SNP -I am not a supporter- and the Indy movement is anti English. It’s also false.
I started off as an absolute 100% No Voter.
Then I listened to the arguments. You could do the same
It’s a complicated issue and I don’t like to generalise but the last time I was in Scotland a pissed up Glaswegian wearing a kilt called me English scum. He then stabbed me and carried on eating his battered Mars Bar. Daft sod dropped it though proving the Scots don’t make good goalkeepers.
If we go for it, we will prosper. We have had ten years of austerity, if it's sticky at the start, so be it. We will get there.
https://www.businessforscotland.com...will-be-one-of-the-worlds-wealthiest-nations/
No offence but the economic arguments as parallels to Brexit are astonishingly similar.
The reality is an independent Scotland would have a long way to go before gaining access to the single market and would spent a significant amount of time completely alone, on WTO terms before doing so, which will make it practically impossible.
Maybe if we start calling it Scexit people will drop it.
If/when there is no desire (i've been hinting that i don't think there is), it won't be because of any 'economic realities', brexit-related or otherwise. It will be because ultimately people want to be part of the UK. Like last time.
And if/when there is, the so claimed economic realities won't matter one bit. Brexit or not.
Look, i've lived it, still do, spoken about it plenty, with plenty, still do (less than during indyref1). For all the no campaign's threats and doomsmongering, people at the end of the day voted for what they beleived in, rather than what they thought how numbers would be affected. From my experience, Very few voted on economic reasons. Call it ideological if you want (will).
As for how successful it might or might not be? Who am i to try predict that. I don't think the UK now post (mid) brexit is particularly successful, either economically (stalled, which in turn affects services) or certainly not sociologically, with the state of the mood and fabric of society.
So it’s Brexit in tartan, thanks for clarifying.
Magicpole
Well-Known Member
Sorry about that. I had endured a hard day. And you're right about my goal keeping skills. More of a midfield genius. But why were you cutting about in a Morris Dancer get up? Asking for it mate.It’s a complicated issue and I don’t like to generalise but the last time I was in Scotland a pissed up Glaswegian wearing a kilt called me English scum. He then stabbed me and carried on eating his battered Mars Bar. Daft sod dropped it though proving the Scots don’t make good goalkeepers.
hilts
Well-Known Member
Sorry about that. I had endured a hard day. And you're right about my goal keeping skills. More of a midfield genius. But why were you cutting about in a Morris Dancer get up? Asking for it mate.
Stag do suppose we were asking for it and your right most Scots see themselves as Archie Gemmill rather than Alan Rough. Just checked the 78 squad so I didn’t cock up and fuck me that was some team.
Magicpole
Well-Known Member
Stag do suppose we were asking for it and your right most Scots see themselves as Archie Gemmill rather than Alan Rough. Just checked the 78 squad so I didn’t cock up and fuck me that was some team.
Yes they were. But, still typically Scottish. We got handed out arse by Peru, drew with fucking Iran, then beat Holland who got to the final. Sums us up.
purplenose
Well-Known Member
Yes they were. But, still typically Scottish. We got handed out arse by Peru, drew with fucking Iran, then beat Holland who got to the final. Sums us up.
I can see where this is going....
If we had beaten Israel and then Norway or Serbia we would have stuffed England at Wembley in the group stage......Still its not all bad Andy Murray will most likely be playing at Wimbledon around that time so you Jocks will have someone to cheer next summer.
hilts
Well-Known Member
Yes they were. But, still typically Scottish. We got handed out arse by Peru, drew with fucking Iran, then beat Holland who got to the final. Sums us up.
I actually missed the 78 World Cup as I was at butlins(ffs) as a young kid. But British teams especially the top ones like candlepool and forest were full of Scots who were world class. Us English moan about the golden generation not achieving what they should but fuck me that team really should have won it based on the quality of players Alan rough excepted:-)