Nigel Farage

domalino said:
I ask you to prove "reverse racism" from post-2020 police training manuals is the reason Henry Nowak wasn't believed and you've replied about child grooming gangs in the 2000's...
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I responded to your post that quite literally had scandals dating back 60 years included in it. You’re not going to squirm out of it mate.

I said there’s a history of reverse racism, my post specifically spoke about the Grooming Gang Scandal and you said prove it.

I have and that’s it. The official reviews have shown widespread significant reverse racism as being at the centre of that scandal.

Why I think Henry Nowak’s case is similar, is the same behaviours were there in how the police dealt with the situation. As I’ve also said, the policing minister thinks there’s a review needed into training on anti racism, you said it was a far right conspiracy and that’s the only reason people are angry.
 
tonea2003 said:
the question surely is why wasn't henry believed, the officers as far i'm concerned should trust no one until actual facts are established, by all means take what has been said on board but that's different to just believing the first one to speak
terrible policing
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I think the reason he wasn't believed was -

- Police went in with a preconceived idea of the disturbance they would find. They weren't called to a stabbing.
- There was no clear sign he'd been stabbed. The bleeding was almost all internal and there was no weapon around.
- They were met with an organised conspiracy by an entire family denying there was a stabbing with a story that confirmed what they were told they were going to find on arrival.

I think the Police were negligent, I'm just yet to see any evidence offered that race was a factor in him not being believed as Farage claims.
 
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domalino said:
I think the reason he wasn't believed was -

- Police went in with a preconceived idea of the disturbance they would find. They weren't called to a stabbing.
- There was no clear sign he'd been stabbed. The bleeding was almost all internal and there was no weapon around.
- They were met with an organised conspiracy by an entire family denying there was a stabbing.

I think the Police were negligent, I'm just yet to see any evidence offered that race was a factor in him not being believed.
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never mentioned race mate, i said the officers should believe nobody until the facts are established, take on board what was initially reported by all means, henry was clearly in distress but was not initially believed and treated disgracefully
as i've said terrible policing
 
Ban-jani said:
the same behaviours were there in how the police dealt with the situation.
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Where?

Again I ask you to point to one single thing that the police did in the Novak situation that points towards race being a factor. You can't because there isn't one, and that's why you and Nige and Tommy 2 names band of thugs are wrong.
 
domalino said:
I think the reason he wasn't believed was -

- Police went in with a preconceived idea of the disturbance they would find. They weren't called to a stabbing.
- There was no clear sign he'd been stabbed. The bleeding was almost all internal and there was no weapon around.
- They were met with an organised conspiracy by an entire family denying there was a stabbing with a story that confirmed what they were told they were going to find on arrival.

I think the Police were negligent, I'm just yet to see any evidence offered that race was a factor in him not being believe
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As if the murder weapon was just going to be at the scene.
 
pmoney said:
Looking online I can only find two instances of serving police officers committing murder in the UK, so I don't understand how Farage's comments on the Couzens case are relevant to whether two-tier policing exists. One concerns an individual crime; the other is a claim about policing as a system.
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At least 16 serving or former policemen have killed women. For a man who claims to want to protect women (same as Yaxley), they've a funny way of showing it...

These are their names, if you're interested...

i] Claire Howarth, 32, (2009); Josephine Lamb, 58, (2009); Samantha Day, 38, (2011); Heather Cooper, 33, (2011); Janet Methven, 80, (2012); Nataie Esak, 33, (2012); Victoria Rose, 58, )(2013); Emma Siswick, 37, (2014); Jill Goldsmith, 49, (2015); Leanne McKie, 39, (2017); Avis Addison, (88), (2017); Bernadette Green, 88 (2018);Alice Farquharson, 56, (2019); Luz Margory Isava Villegas, 50, (2019),Claire Parry, 41, (2020); Sarah Everard, 33, (2021).
 
Trevor Morley's Tache said:
"Grooming gangs" is a common issue brought up in relation to the subject of race, but there is a lack of reliable evidence that race is even relevant.

From a 2023 BBC article:

"The Home Office commissioned a study of the available data in 2020. It said:

  • "The academic literature highlights significant limitations to what can be said about links between ethnicity and this form of offending."
  • "Research has found that group-based child sexual exploitation offenders are most commonly white."
  • "Some studies suggest an over-representation of Black and Asian offenders relative to the demographics of national populations."
It found there was limited research on offender identity and poor quality data, which made it difficult to draw conclusions, however "it is likely that no one community or culture is uniquely predisposed to offending".
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Isnt this (Baroness Louise Casey) more up to date :

"In the report, Baroness Casey said: The report concluded that ignorance and a fear of being seen as racist meant organisations tasked with protecting children turned a blind eye to abuse.

"We found many examples of organisations avoiding the topic altogether for fear of appearing racist, raising community tensions or causing community cohesion problems," the report said

For me I always got the impression it was the police and the surrounding authorities ignoring a crime because there was an accusation of being racist to contend with.

I also thought they were addressing it by starting to record the ethnicity of suspects in future, something they never used to do for some reason.
 
domalino said:
Where?

Again I ask you to point to one single thing that the police did in the Novak situation that points towards race being a factor. You can't because there isn't one, and that's why you and Nige and Tommy 2 names band of thugs are wrong.
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You asked me to prove that reverse racism has happened, I gave you widespread institutionalised incidents. Do you now accept that? I’m not going to allow you to just gloss over that because I’ve given you the evidence you asked for.

I’ve already said it, you refuse to acknowledge it, their levels of negligence and behaviour pattern were the same as we saw in the Grooming Gang Scandal, that has been PROVEN to be widespread examples of reverse racism.

They ignored the more serious claims, took the accusations of racism as gospel and most serious, actually belittled someone claiming to be stabbed and on the floor. You’ve said they were negligent, this is a level of negligence so extreme that I fail to understand how it can be done without prejudice going into the situation.

It’s the same pattern repeated hundreds of times in the grooming gang scandal.

You won’t accept it because it shatters your political worldview. You lack objectivity on on it and on the grooming gang scandal. It’s also why I’ve received abuse and anger from people whose entire politics is white people are always the oppressors and non-whites are victims.
 
domalino said:
Where?

Again I ask you to point to one single thing that the police did in the Novak situation that points towards race being a factor. You can't because there isn't one, and that's why you and Nige and Tommy 2 names band of thugs are wrong.
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I personally think this is a case of negligence rather than anything more systemic.

However, that shouldn’t be ruled out just yet and in fact pursuing that line of enquiry to conclusion is beneficial to stop it being picked at by those seeking to profit from this case.

Amongst the missed opportunities to disrupt the Manchester bomber a security guard said he didn’t want to stop the bomber for fear of being labelled racist. Obviously this person wasn’t a policeman but it is at least some evidence of white people being fearful to tackle non white people for fear of retaliatory accusations
www.bbc.co.uk

Manchester Arena Inquiry: Security 'did not approach bomber over racism fears'

A security guard says he "had a bad feeling" about Salman Abedi, Manchester inquiry hears.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk

In this case the brothers concocted a racism accusation between themselves. It’s probably wrong to try and get behind the reasoning of 2 people who are awful human beings but it is plausible to think they did so as they felt it might be believed.

As I say though, I think the real issues in this case aside from the callous murder is the crap response from the officers on scene as opposed to issues of race, but some people don’t even appear to accept the police did anything wrong.

For things to get better in the world we need to keep talking about this and not shout at each other though. I’ve been tempted today to do that on here and it doesn’t help
 
tonea2003 said:
the question surely is why wasn't henry believed, the officers as far i'm concerned should trust no one until actual facts are established, by all means take what has been said on board but that's different to just believing the first one to speak
terrible policing
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I wasn't just the first one to speak at the scene that would have influenced the initial actions of the attending officer. The officers would have been primed by their dispatch officer prior to arrival, who would have given them a rundown of the situation, based on the details of the 999 call, which we now know to be a cruel fabrication.

Establishing the facts of any situation when you arrive on scene is often difficult at the best of time, and a whole lot worse in a high-pressure situation. It's a tragedy what happened, and the irony is that had the officers been taken more than a few minutes to arrive he would have already been dead, and this wouldn't even be a national news story.
 
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